Gir!
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 20:43:45 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on Nov 2, 2009 20:43:45 GMT -5
I thought about letting this lie, since the discussion's moved on quite a bit, but I didn't want Pleo to think I was ignoring it. This statement is wrong and slightly suspicious. I freely admit that I may be letting an incident in my most recent (and still ongoing, yes, but the player in questions has already been mod-revealed) Mafia game color my perception. Since you stated that the statement is wrong and not just that you disagree with it, do you have stats to prove it? I will point out though, that, per The Rules, scum may post on the scumboard both Day and Night, and I find it extremely unlikely that the lack of unvoting didn't rate some discussion there. If I thought Idle was faking his misunderstanding, it might be a different story, but I don't think that he is.
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Gir!
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 20:46:38 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on Nov 2, 2009 20:46:38 GMT -5
Since you stated that the statement is wrong and not just that you disagree with it, do you have stats to prove it? And if you do, try to keep the complicated math to a minimum. I R Math-Dum.
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Trepa Mayfield
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 20:58:25 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Nov 2, 2009 20:58:25 GMT -5
Sorry, it's Day 1 and I'm acting stupid. Not at all. You're frustrated, and after rereading your posts and seeing you've explained your meaning a couple of times with no acknowledgment, I understand. And I should have let you know I was teasing with the "capslock of rage" comment, so that was tone fail on my part. Eh. I get a cool new sigline out of it!
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 21:03:45 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Nov 2, 2009 21:03:45 GMT -5
Peeker, to understand the vote (or at least Pede's stated reason for the vote), look at the votecount, or at least as it was then. Before Pede placed his vote, the count stood at three votes to Chucara, two to Pedescribe and one on Bill (plus four other singleton votes.) Pede voting for Chucara would give Chucara a three vote lead - a much wider margin (psychologically) than 2. Also, since Pede himself was second in the votecount, it might look as if he's voting Chucara to save himself, and people around here tend to view that with suspicion. It's probably Kat's fault. By voting for Bill, he keeps the vote pot boiling and both Bill and Chucara in the frame. And he cold always switch later if nothing develops from his voting Bill. while i understand what you are saying it still didn't parse right to me and i am not sure that i agree. if i have a case against someone that i consider "strong" i don't think i have ever not voted them just because of what the vote count is in order to vote on someone where by default the case would not be as strong just because the person with the weaker case has less votes than the person with the stronger case. matter of fact now that i type it out it makes less sense. and why would he want to keep the pot boiling on bill if the case on chuc is stronger? but now we are going down mucho hypotheticals between the two of us regarding motivation and reasoning regarding ped. ped 'splained what he was doing. now we/i get to decide, in our opinion, how that plays. i am unprepared, at this moment, to make a final determination.
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 21:11:16 GMT -5
Post by Idle Thoughts on Nov 2, 2009 21:11:16 GMT -5
Nothing to add other than I have, from the start of it, thought the Chucara train was stupid and weak....as am I with the possible Pede train that seems to be brewing now. However I might get on a BillMC train if it starts up since he, out of them all, seems to have said the most shady things and made the most vast and ugly assuptions throughout the whole thing. I'm also fine with a Natlaw train, as most may already know. And, so far, from all my observations today....redskeezix strikes me not only as scum but very obvious scum. Like, a person who has never been scum before and doesn't know how to play it and, therefore, is lousy at hiding it/covering it up. In post number 39, he makes a very wishy-washy type post that I've known scum to do (and made myself when I was scum). The whole "I'm not voting right now, but I'm just going to sow the seeds of doubt. It COULD be this..but it COULD be that too...in short, nobody should trust anybody..yeah! Yeah, that's it..." type of post. It really tripped my meter then, but I didn't say anything about it at the time. There was another post, after that, that only made me more suspicious of him..but I have to go find it first. History of posts to follow.
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Trepa Mayfield
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 21:35:18 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Nov 2, 2009 21:35:18 GMT -5
and why would he want to keep the pot boiling on bill if the case on chuc is stronger? Because I never said that it was stronger. I said they were both strong cases. That they were equally strong. If we were playing under Pleonast's rules, I would have voted for both of them, and I thought I made that clear but I guess not. So, given that I had no quality reason to vote for one over the other, I chose a tactical reason. Note that this is what I was thinking at the time. Now that Chucara has given evidence of a strongly pro-town power, I am less suspicious of him, and am satisfied with my vote.
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Gir!
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 21:47:30 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on Nov 2, 2009 21:47:30 GMT -5
I was thinking about doing a WoW, but I'm lazy. So, I decided to do a WoW on Steve. For two reasons: 1) He's only posted twice. First post: Link: www.idlemafia.com/index.cgi?board=game17&action=display&thread=1171&page=4#56586Complete post: Hi all, sorry to have missed the start of the game. I'll catch up this weekend and start contributing. Busy, busy week for me. Which leads to the second reason: His 2nd post. Link: www.idlemafia.com/index.cgi?board=game17&action=display&thread=1171&page=6#56686In which he: (1) repeats <Pick one: Pleo's, Natlaw's, pedescribe's, etc.> comments about Idle(2) repeats <Pick one: Pleo's, Ed's, peeker's, etc.> comments bout pede and (3) votes Chucara for Chuc's vote on Ed, paraphrasing pretty much everyone's comments about Chucara, but seeming to give precedence to Chuc's vote on Ed (this drew my attention since Pleo had previously made a comment that "To me (this is to everyone, not just Bill) the only decent reason for voting for Chu is his vote on Ed.") Ends with a request for pede to explain his logic in voting Bill over Chuc, which is also a repeat (brought up by peeker an hour and a half before). So, his contribution consists of repeating everyone else's suspicions. Do you have any of your own, STEVE? How about comments on someone who's not one of the Big Three? I can't decide if this is lazy newbie scum or lazy newbie Town...
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Trepa Mayfield
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 21:50:06 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Nov 2, 2009 21:50:06 GMT -5
So, his contribution consists of repeating everyone else's suspicions. Do you have any of your own, STEVE? How about comments on someone who's not one of the Big Three? I can't decide if this is lazy newbie scum or lazy newbie Town... I would say something, but I am Rapier's bitch.
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 21:51:12 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Nov 2, 2009 21:51:12 GMT -5
and ped that question was more rhetorically asked of mhaye since it was his phrasing. that's why i felt that continuing to discuss your motivations would be merely suppositions on our/my part.
you are right. you were waffling back and forth between the two of them.
in hindsight your decision appears to have been correct based on chuc's subsequent claim and potential town alignment.
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Gir!
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 21:55:47 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on Nov 2, 2009 21:55:47 GMT -5
Oh, I had also wanted to ask one question about BillMc's Chucara locomotive: I noticed that Bill's location says that he's in the UK. Is it possible that the phrase "You're not the boss of ____ (usually "me")." isn't common slang in the UK? That's really the only explanation I can think of for him actually misinterpreting the comment that Chuc isn't "the boss of mafia" to mean he isn't "the boss of [the] mafia [scum group]" rather than he isn't "the boss of [how to play] mafia [the game]". Otherwise, I agree that it's blatantly opportunistic.
Does anyone know?
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Gir!
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 21:58:02 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on Nov 2, 2009 21:58:02 GMT -5
So, his contribution consists of repeating everyone else's suspicions. Do you have any of your own, STEVE? How about comments on someone who's not one of the Big Three? I can't decide if this is lazy newbie scum or lazy newbie Town... I would say something, but I am Rapier's bitch. If you really want, you could go back and juxtapose the first and last sentences of that post together. ;D
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 22:20:46 GMT -5
Post by special on Nov 2, 2009 22:20:46 GMT -5
A quick post on the "does where are votes are have any impact at Night" topic.
A way to avoid danger might be for as many people as possible to have their vote on the lynch target. That way, if anything bad happens, we might be minimizing the damage. Though, there are ways in which that might be increasing damage (Some victims might seek revenge of some sort)
I have a few thoughts on what might be possible issues. 1. A Vig who can only target whoever they were voting for 2. A Vig who can only target someone who is voting for them 3. A Scum role that is only active on people who are voting for them/people who they are voting for 4. Some messed up 3rd party role. 5. Infinitely other possibilities.
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 22:45:14 GMT -5
Post by Dirx on Nov 2, 2009 22:45:14 GMT -5
A quick post on the "does where are votes are have any impact at Night" topic. A way to avoid danger might be for as many people as possible to have their vote on the lynch target. That way, if anything bad happens, we might be minimizing the damage. Though, there are ways in which that might be increasing damage (Some victims might seek revenge of some sort) I have a few thoughts on what might be possible issues. 1. A Vig who can only target whoever they were voting for 2. A Vig who can only target someone who is voting for them 3. A Scum role that is only active on people who are voting for them/people who they are voting for 4. Some messed up 3rd party role. 5. Infinitely other possibilities. Are you proposing that as many players as possible vote as a bloc on whoever appears will be lynched? 'Cause that's a great way for scum to avoid accountability. Unless you're suggesting changing votes to the recently-lynched player post-mortem, but I'm not sure that voting for dead players would be allowed.
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Day 1
Nov 2, 2009 23:06:14 GMT -5
Post by special on Nov 2, 2009 23:06:14 GMT -5
A quick post on the "does where are votes are have any impact at Night" topic. A way to avoid danger might be for as many people as possible to have their vote on the lynch target. That way, if anything bad happens, we might be minimizing the damage. Though, there are ways in which that might be increasing damage (Some victims might seek revenge of some sort) I have a few thoughts on what might be possible issues. 1. A Vig who can only target whoever they were voting for 2. A Vig who can only target someone who is voting for them 3. A Scum role that is only active on people who are voting for them/people who they are voting for 4. Some messed up 3rd party role. 5. Infinitely other possibilities. Are you proposing that as many players as possible vote as a bloc on whoever appears will be lynched? 'Cause that's a great way for scum to avoid accountability. Unless you're suggesting changing votes to the recently-lynched player post-mortem, but I'm not sure that voting for dead players would be allowed. Well, maybe not post mortum, but right as close to mortum as possible. I wouldn't want to avoid complete accountability. I've dealt with a somewhat similar issue before in a game where the Day wouldn't end until a threshold of voting (more than 50% for one person) was reached. One solution was to set a deadline and use that deadline for accountability. Then, everyone just switched over to the lynch leader so that the Day could eventually end. I don't think we need to do that, but it something to keep in mind should the need arise after Night 1.
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Chucara
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 2:40:37 GMT -5
Post by Chucara on Nov 3, 2009 2:40:37 GMT -5
What about we just switch votes to ourselves at night?
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Merestil Haye
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 5:19:42 GMT -5
Post by Merestil Haye on Nov 3, 2009 5:19:42 GMT -5
Oh, I had also wanted to ask one question about BillMc's Chucara locomotive: I noticed that Bill's location says that he's in the UK. Is it possible that the phrase "You're not the boss of ____ (usually "me")." isn't common slang in the UK? That's really the only explanation I can think of for him actually misinterpreting the comment that Chuc isn't "the boss of mafia" to mean he isn't "the boss of [the] mafia [scum group]" rather than he isn't "the boss of [how to play] mafia [the game]". Otherwise, I agree that it's blatantly opportunistic. Does anyone know? I'm also UK based, and I've heard the phrase - sufficiently often that I knew what Chucara meant. I'm an old fuddy-duddy compared to most others here, so if I know it it's reasonable to suppose you youngsters do. Also, Bill's spent some time on business trips to the States. As another point, Chucara's not American either. So I'm not sure why you'd think the phrase is peculiarly American (except in origin.) I've slept on the questions and am still no longer a vote. Back this evening.
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Chucara
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 6:13:42 GMT -5
Post by Chucara on Nov 3, 2009 6:13:42 GMT -5
I can't believe how much effort you are putting into analyzing that statement. It was indeed a reference to angsty teeny "You're not the boss of me", and I have no idea where I got it from. This shouldn't surprise anyone, but it's not like I sit for hours to think about my posts before writing them. It meant exactly what most seem to have figured out. That while I can voice my opinions in a way that sounds like I don't want to discuss an issue that doesn't mean that I demand everyone else should stop too. And yes, I am suspicion of BillMc for being so keen on lynching me with little other than that to back it up. But even more so, I am supicious of him seemingly wanting to garner support for that. Then again, I have plenty of times been guilty of "locking on" to a townie and slowly convincing myself of his/her scumminess. Anyway, my vote would go to BillMc, but as I'm already voting through BillMc, I will vote for myself. In order to give BillMc a vote, I offer to change my own to whoever he wants to vote for. vote chucara
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Natlaw
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 6:47:02 GMT -5
Post by Natlaw on Nov 3, 2009 6:47:02 GMT -5
Anyways That is why I am sorry and I hope I am right with my main suspicioun today. So vote BillMc As I said, sorry man, I hope I am right here but I think for day one it is the best case I am seeing. Since we have almost 2 days I may try and reread again to see if anything jumps at me, but anyways I am happy with my vote for now. I think you did this in Super!Smash!Bros! mafia as well (where you were town IIRC), but I still find the excessive apologizing for your vote odd. Just respect the grudge-rule . "And it's not that hard to understand. I'm not referring to direct actions, I'm referring to tone. The tone of post 61 had a very grandstanding, look-at-me-I'm-town sound to it." D1.133 (Yeah, it did. So do a lot of actions taken on Day One. So did Chucara's soft claim, but I notice you didn't jump Chucara for being too Townie.) I think the soft-claim is more considered anti-town and not a look-at-me-I'm-(being-pro)-town, so I don't see pedescribe's reasoning to vote Pleo applies to Chucara soft-claim? With pede's 'acknowledge the possibility of claiming' he didn't consider it anti-town/scummy, but neither (scummy toned) pro-town as Pleo's self vote.
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 7:44:29 GMT -5
Post by Renata on Nov 3, 2009 7:44:29 GMT -5
Nothing to add other than I have, from the start of it, thought the Chucara train was stupid and weak....as am I with the possible Pede train that seems to be brewing now. However I might get on a BillMC train if it starts up since he, out of them all, seems to have said the most shady things and made the most vast and ugly assuptions throughout the whole thing. I'm also fine with a Natlaw train, as most may already know. And, so far, from all my observations today....redskeezix strikes me not only as scum but very obvious scum. Like, a person who has never been scum before and doesn't know how to play it and, therefore, is lousy at hiding it/covering it up. In post number 39, he makes a very wishy-washy type post that I've known scum to do (and made myself when I was scum). The whole "I'm not voting right now, but I'm just going to sow the seeds of doubt. It COULD be this..but it COULD be that too...in short, nobody should trust anybody..yeah! Yeah, that's it..." type of post. It really tripped my meter then, but I didn't say anything about it at the time. There was another post, after that, that only made me more suspicious of him..but I have to go find it first. History of posts to follow. The phrasing of his vote, perhaps? Can't remember it exactly but it was one of those "I don't really think you're Scum, but" votes that annoy me so much and yeah, it pinged me too.
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Gir!
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 7:59:55 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on Nov 3, 2009 7:59:55 GMT -5
Oh, I had also wanted to ask one question about BillMc's Chucara locomotive: I noticed that Bill's location says that he's in the UK. Is it possible that the phrase "You're not the boss of ____ (usually "me")." isn't common slang in the UK? That's really the only explanation I can think of for him actually misinterpreting the comment that Chuc isn't "the boss of mafia" to mean he isn't "the boss of [the] mafia [scum group]" rather than he isn't "the boss of [how to play] mafia [the game]". Otherwise, I agree that it's blatantly opportunistic. Does anyone know? I'm also UK based, and I've heard the phrase - sufficiently often that I knew what Chucara meant. I'm an old fuddy-duddy compared to most others here, so if I know it it's reasonable to suppose you youngsters do. Also, Bill's spent some time on business trips to the States. As another point, Chucara's not American either. So I'm not sure why you'd think the phrase is peculiarly American (except in origin.) I've slept on the questions and am still no longer a vote. Back this evening. Who said anything about thinking it was peculiarly American? "Non-UK" doesn't mean "US only". But with that clarification, I'm satisfied to vote BillMc for blatant word-twisting.
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Trepa Mayfield
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 8:44:44 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Nov 3, 2009 8:44:44 GMT -5
What about we just switch votes to ourselves at night? The problem is that we have no way of knowing which mechanics would go into effect. If there's an SK who can only kill people being voted for... In retrospect, it probably wasn't a good idea to bring it up again, since there are so many unknowns that the only real advice for us (as in everyone) is to vote for people we find suspicious.
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 10:42:33 GMT -5
Post by Renata on Nov 3, 2009 10:42:33 GMT -5
Chucara's claim is a bit problematic. I agree it's unlikely to be a Scum role, but "unlikely" is a far cry from certainty. Especially on Day One when we have no idea whatsoever of the set-up, and there has been no opportunity for him to use the ability in any way we can really judge. The role is dangerous enough in the hands of Scum (towards endgame) that unless Chucara can be confirmed without a doubt in the meantime (which given the closed setup would probably require a dead detective), he'd probably have to be killed anyway. Do we want that distraction down the road? Is that an effective use of a detective's ability?
Then there's the soft claim, which I still think is something likelier for Scum to resort to than Town; and the initial vote for Ed, which pings me a bit. If Chucara really was voting Ed for making a fluffy no-accountability post (a legitimate enough thing to do), why not just say so? Surely "I'm voting Ed because he made a fluffy no-accountability post that seemed designed to produce more noise than light" would work just fine as an aggressive vote designed to provoke a response, but that's not what Chucara said. He said this:
The no-accountability part is only vaguely in there; the "intended to put someone under suspicion" bit is a complete mis-representation of what Ed said; and the last sentence's "joke vote" tone is at odds with the rest. I'm not sure Chucara himself knew what he was trying to accomplish with this vote, but it reads wrong to me.
I've talked myself into and out of this about half a dozen times while writing this, but heck with it: vote: Chucara
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 10:47:27 GMT -5
Post by BillMc on Nov 3, 2009 10:47:27 GMT -5
This comment did strike me as a little strange - an odd choice of words. Looking for town cred? obviously not mafia? Not much to go on, but it's what has pinged me the most. ffs - all I said that I found it a strange choice of words And yes, I am suspicion of BillMc for being so keen on lynching me with little other than that to back it up. But even more so, I am supicious of him seemingly wanting to garner support for that. Nope - since I can't unvote (well can't vote anyways now) no one else was pinging me so I didnt move my vote to someone else. In order to give BillMc a vote, I offer to change my own to whoever he wants to vote for. vote chucaraIt's your vote - use it as you wish. But with that clarification, I'm satisfied to vote BillMc for blatant word-twisting. Word twisting? Well since I can't vote, and am pretty busy for the next day. So it looks like I'll get lynched today, or claim and probably end up dead tonight. oh well I'm the Passenger Vigilante. The interesting thing about my PM, is that it says I'll find out in the morning whether I was successful, and what the role of the person I've killed was - which kinda leads me to believe that there may be a janitor about, or some other obfuscation/delay of death info.
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Merestil Haye
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 10:55:10 GMT -5
Post by Merestil Haye on Nov 3, 2009 10:55:10 GMT -5
Chucara, do you actually think BillMc is a Mafiate? - If you do, why are you not placing your own vote on Bill?
- If you do not, why did you force Bil to vote for himself, instead of a person you did think was a Mafiate?
You look like you're trying to have the best of both worlds. As for offering to place your vote where someone else thinks it should go - sorry, it's your vote. You, and no-one else, are accountable for it. You can't pass the onus onto someone else. Now I've vented my spleen,, time for a full reread. Hopefully I can get a vote down tonight.
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 11:18:30 GMT -5
Post by sinjin on Nov 3, 2009 11:18:30 GMT -5
I was thinking about doing a WoW, but I'm lazy. So, I decided to do a WoW on Steve. For two reasons: 1) He's only posted twice. First post: Link: www.idlemafia.com/index.cgi?board=game17&action=display&thread=1171&page=4#56586Complete post: Hi all, sorry to have missed the start of the game. I'll catch up this weekend and start contributing. Busy, busy week for me. Which leads to the second reason: His 2nd post. Link: www.idlemafia.com/index.cgi?board=game17&action=display&thread=1171&page=6#56686In which he: (1) repeats <Pick one: Pleo's, Natlaw's, pedescribe's, etc.> comments about Idle(2) repeats <Pick one: Pleo's, Ed's, peeker's, etc.> comments bout pede and (3) votes Chucara for Chuc's vote on Ed, paraphrasing pretty much everyone's comments about Chucara, but seeming to give precedence to Chuc's vote on Ed (this drew my attention since Pleo had previously made a comment that "To me (this is to everyone, not just Bill) the only decent reason for voting for Chu is his vote on Ed.") Ends with a request for pede to explain his logic in voting Bill over Chuc, which is also a repeat (brought up by peeker an hour and a half before). So, his contribution consists of repeating everyone else's suspicions. Do you have any of your own, STEVE? How about comments on someone who's not one of the Big Three? I can't decide if this is lazy newbie scum or lazy newbie Town... Sorry for the confusion, I was Steve in the last mini-game and forgot to change my profile. I am not a lazy newb. As I said, I had some real life stuff going on and still do. Sue me. As for repeating others suspicions, again sue me. I read straight thru the thread and posted my suspicions. How unusual that I find the same things that others do in a mafia game suspicious!! I'm shocked, shocked
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 11:21:27 GMT -5
Post by sinjin on Nov 3, 2009 11:21:27 GMT -5
So, his contribution consists of repeating everyone else's suspicions. Do you have any of your own, STEVE? How about comments on someone who's not one of the Big Three? I can't decide if this is lazy newbie scum or lazy newbie Town... I would say something, but I am Rapier's bitch. What does this mean?
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 11:42:50 GMT -5
Post by special on Nov 3, 2009 11:42:50 GMT -5
Steve, you're sinjin? I was sitting here trying to figure out who steve was and if you were an immigrant from facebook or something.
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 11:50:01 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on Nov 3, 2009 11:50:01 GMT -5
I can confirm that STEVE is Sinjin, due to the Halloween Mini.
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 11:51:27 GMT -5
Post by sinjin on Nov 3, 2009 11:51:27 GMT -5
Ya know, more I think about it, the more I'm getting pissed about Kat's little smear of me up-thread. Her only in game post prior to my post where I outlined my suspicions was the one below. I'd use the pot/kettle phrase here but I think someone else used it already in this game and I don't want to be accused of copying someone else's work again. vote PleonastJust to put myself on record that I'm going to vote for someone. Anyone who ends a Day without a vote is going to be very suspicious to me, especially in this game. Our best chance to lynch scum is to have everyone vote--we outnumber scum, so when everyone votes most of the votes will be pro-Town. We'll make mistakes, but scum will not be able to evade all the time. How is that different than in any other game? Also, how helpful do you feel voting for yourself really is. You say it puts you "on record that [you're] going to vote for someone", but if you wouldn't vote yourself in another game, how is voting yourself in this game different? That goes for anyone who's voted themselves under this reasoning. ( Idle's another story, since his self-vote was intended to cancel out a seriously-placed vote that he now feels is misplaced.) I don't believe that Idle's misunderstanding of the voting rule is a scum tell. Town are more likely to miss things than scum are, since they don't have a scumboard to discuss the game amongst themselves.
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Trepa Mayfield
FGM
Does Not Follow Directions
The only kind of panda worth preserving.
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Day 1
Nov 3, 2009 12:21:09 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Nov 3, 2009 12:21:09 GMT -5
I would say something, but I am Rapier's bitch. What does this mean? In SDMB, I was curt and dismissive to Rapier42 under the assumption that he was a newb, when he was actually KidV. Later, in Evil Dead, we made a bet near the end that I lost, thus forcing me to adopt the title 'Rapier's Bitch' for a period of time. Basically, I was telling Kat that STEVE wasn't a newb humorously.
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