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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 18:00:26 GMT -5
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Mar 1, 2010 18:00:26 GMT -5
As I said before, I didn't follow the first game, but whether or not it was an all-power-role set up has nothing to do with this set up. I've made my own assumptions about this game, the opposite assumption made by Paul. Will either of us be correct? Who knows. It is irnoic that self-protection (as Paul is alleging was his motivation in not voting for Bill) carries over to to toDay, when Paul's justifications painting a "But I'm a power role! I thought we all were?" target on his back.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 18:15:38 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 1, 2010 18:15:38 GMT -5
Peeker, at the end of Day you said this.... "and you don't want to risk yourself if he is a bomb? it doesn't take a fucking einstein to figure out that you are either scum or just outed yourself. so he needs to be gotten rid of but you don't want to get your hands dirty. this is a very poor attitude and play for a townie." Maybe you think it was poor play, I disagree. I don't remember if you played in the first game, but as Ed has already pointed out it was all powered game. I fully anticipate that this game would follow that theme. It doesn't make much sense to have a game on this theme with vanilla characters... especially following the precedence that the last game set. So lets suppose I am wrong, and that there are Nillas in this game. Meeko had already outed himself and you didn't say boo about his claim, why chime in about me not claiming but supposedly outing myself? Like I said, my reluctance to vote for Bill was not in any part to dodge accountability. I agreed he needed to die. I just didn't want to risk going down with him. So maybe that's selfish, and you can think that it wasn't in town's best interest. But you don't know the setup, so you don't know what roles everyone has. Each player should have considered the possibility that they would have died for their vote against Bill before voting for him. You say my refusal to throw my vote on top of the already massive number of votes was poor play, I would counter that anyone that is vital to town was playing fast and loose by taking the risk of doing so. Further more, my not voting for him provided the rest of you with something to hold me accountable for. I could have easily hidden in the masses and voted for Bill and left it at that, but I voted for Red. Whether or not my suspicions of Red are gonna pan out is yet to be seen, but i stand by my play. while i hear what you are saying i still stand by my statement. ok, so you think we are all power roles, mabye, maybe not. but not all power roles are created equal. and ed pointed out the previous games setup after the end of the Day so that doesn't get a whole lot of traction with me. and i believed bill so i figured the possibility of a bomb as small unless he happened to be scum which really didn't make sense. so yeh, not standing with your town brethren and sistren (if that's what you are) is pretty self serving. now for the most part self preservation is to be kind of expected. because even nillers serve town's best interest if they can defend against a mis lynch. it's the more "he's gonna die anyways so i will hedge my bets" attitude that is alarming. ***Bolding mine*** Exactly. Not all power roles are created equal. My move wasn't just willy nilly. I put thought into it. It's chock full of WIFOM. Mayhaps I was concerned with keeping my power available for Town, mayhaps I was preserving myself to make scum think I am important and end up wasting a NK on me. That's for them to hash out. Either way, I think my role is worth keeping around, and my actions ensured that would happen at least until Dawn.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 18:18:24 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 1, 2010 18:18:24 GMT -5
As I said before, I didn't follow the first game, but whether or not it was an all-power-role set up has nothing to do with this set up. I've made my own assumptions about this game, the opposite assumption made by Paul. Will either of us be correct? Who knows. It is irnoic that self-protection (as Paul is alleging was his motivation in not voting for Bill) carries over to to toDay, when Paul's justifications painting a "But I'm a power role! I thought we all were?" target on his back. Really? No one is remembering that one of the best things a vanilla or lesser power role can do for Town is to paint a target on their backs for scum? Even if I am one of those, wouldn't it serve in Town's best interest if I got NK'd instead of a Doc, Cop, or other potentially game saving role? And if I am one a Cop, Doc, or other... then wouldn't not taking a chance also be in Town's best interest?
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 18:37:38 GMT -5
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Mar 1, 2010 18:37:38 GMT -5
You're right. It is pure brilliance when neither the Town nor the Scum can get a read on your motivations.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 19:05:03 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Mar 1, 2010 19:05:03 GMT -5
ok, so you are claiming. but you are claiming that you might be claiming vanilla since that will wifom scum, right?
but on the off chance that you are a really really super duper power role town should back off and let scum nk you because that's kind of what you want, right?
so you are painting a target on your back to have scum target you because your power is uber special but you are really vanilla so it fucks with them, right?
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 19:50:10 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 1, 2010 19:50:10 GMT -5
You're right. It is pure brilliance when neither the Town nor the Scum can get a read on your motivations. I made my motivations extremely clear. Self preservation. I'mnot gonna be around much longer, I just didn't want to go out before my time.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 19:55:16 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 1, 2010 19:55:16 GMT -5
ok, so you are claiming. but you are claiming that you might be claiming vanilla since that will wifom scum, right? but on the off chance that you are a really really super duper power role town should back off and let scum nk you because that's kind of what you want, right? so you are painting a target on your back to have scum target you because your power is uber special but you are really vanilla so it fucks with them, right? I haven't claimed anything except that I am Town. I merely gave you my thought process. Why you and Cookies seem to be so upset about this, I don't understand. Here's what it boils down to... I won't even be around in a Day or two... focusing on me is a waste of time.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 20:23:09 GMT -5
Post by Drain Bead on Mar 1, 2010 20:23:09 GMT -5
So now you have a Magic Bag full of suicide?
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 20:26:02 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Mar 1, 2010 20:26:02 GMT -5
ok, so you are claiming. but you are claiming that you might be claiming vanilla since that will wifom scum, right? but on the off chance that you are a really really super duper power role town should back off and let scum nk you because that's kind of what you want, right? so you are painting a target on your back to have scum target you because your power is uber special but you are really vanilla so it fucks with them, right? I haven't claimed anything except that I am Town. I merely gave you my thought process. Why you and Cookies seem to be so upset about this, I don't understand. Here's what it boils down to... I won't even be around in a Day or two... focusing on me is a waste of time. well i am sorry to hear that. care to let the rest of town in on this? i mean i love magic bags (not). now if it's a definite scum kill by some mechanism, then sure don't say anything. but if there is at all some leverage that town could get by information that would be a good thing.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 21:20:44 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Mar 1, 2010 21:20:44 GMT -5
ok, so you are claiming. but you are claiming that you might be claiming vanilla since that will wifom scum, right? but on the off chance that you are a really really super duper power role town should back off and let scum nk you because that's kind of what you want, right? so you are painting a target on your back to have scum target you because your power is uber special but you are really vanilla so it fucks with them, right? I haven't claimed anything except that I am Town. I merely gave you my thought process. Why you and Cookies seem to be so upset about this, I don't understand. Here's what it boils down to... I won't even be around in a Day or two... focusing on me is a waste of time. well you claimed something or another since you have basically predated ed's observation about all power roles which you seem to endorse. and you didn't want to expose yourself to a bomb because of your value. but now you will be dead in a Day or two. seems like if you are town aligned you might just want to be a little more forthright. hee hee, magic bag suicide. serisously, drain you crack me up.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 21:56:50 GMT -5
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Mar 1, 2010 21:56:50 GMT -5
If self-preservation is your instinct, I don't understand why you decided to come clean when challenged about your vote. If you were not behaving in that manner, but rather trying to put on a show in order to wifom scum, you shouldn't be surprised that people and/or their paranoia sniff out your ruse and are suspicious of it.
It is one of those examples where "lynch all liars" is perhaps too constricting. I don't mind if you told some little whilte lies to put on a show for scum. Other people might mind. What I mind is not owning that earlier decision by spinning a better yarn to preserve the wifom instead of making your gambit moot.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 22:06:20 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Mar 1, 2010 22:06:20 GMT -5
oh one last point before this gets to pile onnish. so you will be dead in a Day or so but want to protect your butt from a potential bomb. makes no sense.
mod question: can we vote paul right now?
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Meeko
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 22:16:56 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Mar 1, 2010 22:16:56 GMT -5
I haven't claimed anything except that I am Town. I merely gave you my thought process. Why you and Cookies seem to be so upset about this, I don't understand. Here's what it boils down to... I won't even be around in a Day or two... focusing on me is a waste of time. If only we had someone who could protect tonight.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 23:15:05 GMT -5
Post by Inner Stickler on Mar 1, 2010 23:15:05 GMT -5
Are you saying you're offering to protect paul? And therefore vig Tomorrow?
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 23:25:31 GMT -5
Post by special on Mar 1, 2010 23:25:31 GMT -5
I haven't claimed anything except that I am Town. I merely gave you my thought process. Why you and Cookies seem to be so upset about this, I don't understand. Here's what it boils down to... I won't even be around in a Day or two... focusing on me is a waste of time. If only we had someone who could protect tonight. Meeko, do you believe paul is Town?
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 23:29:06 GMT -5
Post by special on Mar 1, 2010 23:29:06 GMT -5
oh one last point before this gets to pile onnish. so you will be dead in a Day or so but want to protect your butt from a potential bomb. makes no sense. mod question: can we vote paul right now?I'm with you on the oddness of paul's moves. But what's the Scum motivation? If he's Scum, wouldn't he have known that Bill wasn't a Scum bomb? And, whoever heard of a 3rd party bomb? Unless this is a game with a 'secret' Scum.
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Mar 2, 2010 0:03:49 GMT -5
<font style="font-size: 12px;">Are you saying you're offering to protect paul? And therefore vig Tomorrow? I believe I answered this, twice. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> <font style="font-size: 12px;"> oh one last point before this gets to pile onnish. so you will be dead in a Day or so but want to protect your butt from a potential bomb. makes no sense.
mod question: can we vote paul right now? I'm with you on the oddness of paul's moves. But what's the Scum motivation? If he's Scum, wouldn't he have known that Bill wasn't a Scum bomb? And, whoever heard of a 3rd party bomb? Unless this is a game with a 'secret' Scum. I find a lot of things odd with this game [And Cecil Pond]. And if Meeko finds something Odd. Look out. --- --- My god, Multi-quote on here is like trying to go from Miami to Vancouver by way of Cairo.
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Mar 2, 2010 0:05:08 GMT -5
NETA: I answered which action I Was taking tonight. I made no statement on the target.
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Post by luvbwfc on Mar 2, 2010 2:36:07 GMT -5
well, lots going on in this game. Full re-read required already after we see what happens at dawn.
Not a fan of the "I won't be around long play", as I have often seen ti used by scum to eke out an extra day, but in this case, Paul didn't even have that much presuure *shrugs*
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Post by special on Mar 2, 2010 7:37:40 GMT -5
[ <font style="font-size: 18px;"> If only we had someone who could protect tonight. [/size] [/quote] Meeko, do you believe paul is Town?[/quote] If he had asked for help, it would have gone a long way in helping me decide what to do. He didn't ask. [/quote] OK, but still, do you think he's Town?
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Post by special on Mar 2, 2010 7:40:05 GMT -5
My last post should have looked more like this: If he had asked for help, it would have gone a long way in helping me decide what to do. He didn't ask. OK, but still, do you think he's Town?
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Post by peekercpa on Mar 2, 2010 8:28:57 GMT -5
I'm with you on the oddness of paul's moves. But what's the Scum motivation? If he's Scum, wouldn't he have known that Bill wasn't a Scum bomb? And, whoever heard of a 3rd party bomb? Unless this is a game with a 'secret' Scum. i am struggling with that as well. because as you correctly note if he is scum then he would have know that bill wasn't a bomb, so why draw attention to yourself unless it's exactly the opposite of what a scum would do. wiform, for me at this point. but the magic baggie thing as well as the professed short life doesn't exactly instill a whole air of townieness to his play.
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Night 1
Mar 2, 2010 10:22:36 GMT -5
Post by The Real FCOD on Mar 2, 2010 10:22:36 GMT -5
Sorry I was absent the past few days, I moved this weekend and have been temporarily insane.
Anyway, I'm glad we didn't lynch Town on Day One, woohoo. I don't know what to make of Paul's magic bag...
--FCOD
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Night 1
Mar 2, 2010 11:12:12 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 2, 2010 11:12:12 GMT -5
It wasn't intended to be a magic bag. I'll explain more at Dawn. I'm not comfortable saying more until then.
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Meeko
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Night 1
Mar 2, 2010 11:25:58 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Mar 2, 2010 11:25:58 GMT -5
Paul, let me ask it this way then.
You read my claim. Correct?
If Paul is or is not Town, it wouldn't matter if we can't save him. Rather than dodge a second time, I have not formed an Opinion.
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Night 1
Mar 2, 2010 12:10:27 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 2, 2010 12:10:27 GMT -5
Paul, let me ask it this way then. You read my claim. Correct? If Paul is or is not Town, it wouldn't matter if we can't save him. Rather than dodge a second time, I have not formed an Opinion. What the hell did you just say? That didn't make any sense to me. "If Paul is or is not town, it wouldn't matter if we can't save him." Okay basically... it doesn't matter if he is town or not because he says he is destined for death. ---- Here's the problem there Meeko. You can't take the side that I am Town and not believe I am telling the truth about not being around much longer.... and you can't take the opposite side and expect to be able to believe that I am telling the truth. "Rather than dodge a second time, I have not formed an Opinion." I have no idea how to parse this. Also.... what does me having read you claim have to do with anything?
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Night 1
Mar 2, 2010 12:27:44 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on Mar 2, 2010 12:27:44 GMT -5
I suppose I'll wait until morning to figure out what you're talking about, Paul, but I have to admit that the magic bag of sudden death isn't very impressive from where I'm sitting at the moment.
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Night 1
Mar 2, 2010 12:30:28 GMT -5
Post by special on Mar 2, 2010 12:30:28 GMT -5
Rather than dodge a second time, I have not formed an Opinion. I have no idea how to parse this. I think Meeko's quote was in response to me asking him about your (paul's) Towniness
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Night 1
Mar 2, 2010 12:32:59 GMT -5
Post by special on Mar 2, 2010 12:32:59 GMT -5
[quote author=paulwhoisaghost board=aggressivenegotiations thread=1308 post=60809 time= "If Paul is or is not town, it wouldn't matter if we can't save him." Okay basically... it doesn't matter if he is town or not because he says he is destined for death. ---- Here's the problem there Meeko. You can't take the side that I am Town and not believe I am telling the truth about not being around much longer.... and you can't take the opposite side and expect to be able to believe that I am telling the truth.[/quote]
While it's true that fake claims will often have some truth in them, I'll agree that more than a couple of players tend to believe something just because it's been claimed.
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Night 1
Mar 2, 2010 12:38:54 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 2, 2010 12:38:54 GMT -5
I suppose I'll wait until morning to figure out what you're talking about, Paul, but I have to admit that the magic bag of sudden death isn't very impressive from where I'm sitting at the moment. It wasn't intended to impress... just to get you to talk about more than just me. Not even to stop talking about me even... just talk about others as well.
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