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Post by Mahaloth on Oct 4, 2010 20:01:51 GMT -5
If you can think of another way for us to discover whether your investigations take place and are "right" or "wrong" then don't hold back! Other than have someone investigate me and post the result? Not really.
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Gir!
FGM
EVIL Demon Goddess Mod
What? Kat is sweet and innocent!
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Post by Gir! on Oct 4, 2010 20:06:41 GMT -5
I don't get Marcel's case.
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Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Oct 4, 2010 21:00:59 GMT -5
I don't get Marcel's case. Chitter? Little Indian Girl: Marcel has a case?
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Post by Mahaloth on Oct 4, 2010 21:02:01 GMT -5
I don't get Marcel's case. Did you expect to?
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Hockey Monkey!
Borogrove
This is supposed to be a happy occasion. Let's not bicker over who killed who.
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Post by Hockey Monkey! on Oct 4, 2010 21:31:48 GMT -5
I'm getting a little weary of Gir!'s fluffy fluff.
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Post by Sister Coyote on Oct 4, 2010 21:44:59 GMT -5
I'm getting a little weary of Gir!'s fluffy fluff. SQUEEK! (And I'm getting tired of typing Squeek before I can "say" anything. Posting restrictions are what they are, mang. Besides, Gir did post a non-fluffy post not that far back.)
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Post by special on Oct 4, 2010 22:02:17 GMT -5
I'm getting a little weary of Gir!'s fluffy fluff. SQUEEK! (And I'm getting tired of typing Squeek before I can "say" anything. Posting restrictions are what they are, mang. Besides, Gir did post a non-fluffy post not that far back.) she apparently doesn't have to post fluff. She just has to post in a style that Gir would, which is basically silly most of the time. My restriction is almost meaningless at this point. Christ and Nakor were the only who kept their gender listed as female, and Christ has died. Christ is risen. Christ will come again.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 4, 2010 22:06:45 GMT -5
So changing my gender icon is a work-around? I was kidding when I made that suggestion because I assumed it wouldn't work and I don't recall anyone commenting further on the idea...
It is changed now though.
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Gir!
FGM
EVIL Demon Goddess Mod
What? Kat is sweet and innocent!
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Post by Gir! on Oct 4, 2010 22:09:00 GMT -5
I don't get Marcel's case. Chitter? Little Indian Girl: Marcel has a case? He said some stuff and then voted, but it doesn't make sense*. If he thinks the monkey shouldn't share, why didn't he speak up yesterDay when everyone wanted the monkey to share? It's nice to share. Did someone give Marcel my post restriction? It's mine, give it back! *It doesn't even make scum-sense to me. (Not "scumwouldn'tdothat" but "whywouldevenscumdothat?")
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Post by special on Oct 4, 2010 22:31:16 GMT -5
So changing my gender icon is a work-around? I was kidding when I made that suggestion because I assumed it wouldn't work and I don't recall anyone commenting further on the idea... It is changed now though. Yes, it is a workaround. It doesn't need to be male though, it just can't be female for me to reply directly to you in a Day thread.
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Hockey Monkey!
Borogrove
This is supposed to be a happy occasion. Let's not bicker over who killed who.
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Post by Hockey Monkey! on Oct 4, 2010 23:17:23 GMT -5
SQUEEK! (And I'm getting tired of typing Squeek before I can "say" anything. Posting restrictions are what they are, mang. Besides, Gir did post a non-fluffy post not that far back.) she apparently doesn't have to post fluff. She just has to post in a style that Gir would, which is basically silly most of the time. My restriction is almost meaningless at this point. Christ and Nakor were the only who kept their gender listed as female, and Christ has died. Christ is risen. Christ will come again.What am I? Chopped liver? And why does this matter? (I get that there's some post restriction about it, but what does it mean? Is there some relevance?) And more to the point, should I change it or remove it?
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Hockey Monkey!
Borogrove
This is supposed to be a happy occasion. Let's not bicker over who killed who.
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Post by Hockey Monkey! on Oct 4, 2010 23:19:36 GMT -5
So changing my gender icon is a work-around? I was kidding when I made that suggestion because I assumed it wouldn't work and I don't recall anyone commenting further on the idea... It is changed now though. Yes, it is a workaround. It doesn't need to be male though, it just can't be female for me to reply directly to you in a Day thread. OK, I'll go change it, but someone will have to remind me to put my dress back on when the game is over.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 4, 2010 23:35:24 GMT -5
Now I have a visual of HM and I running around naked and wearing strap-ons. You can thank this game and the Ed's Goliath's Fist of Pleasure from Zuma's game on GB.
And I'm just a perverted deviant.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 4, 2010 23:40:20 GMT -5
NETA and SisterSinjin. *headsmack*
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Post by septimus on Oct 5, 2010 0:08:28 GMT -5
... if he's Scum, any Scum can investigate and relay the results to him So we do know Scum can communicate at Daytime? Have I been skimming? When did "we" learn that?
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 5, 2010 2:28:29 GMT -5
It wouldn't be that hard for scum to come up with a code along the lines of, if I say balloon in my first post of the day my target is a cop, if I say pumpkin, they're a doc or even to just spell out some short version of their role in a post.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 5, 2010 2:33:00 GMT -5
Brings a tear of nostalgia to think of my covert communication good old days of Batman (the game, not the player). I'm pretty sure that was the last time I really went for it with codes.
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Post by BillMc on Oct 5, 2010 5:13:30 GMT -5
SQUEEK (Oops. In that last quote, he says his action was a one-shot, which means he can't make anyone else unstoppable/unblockable.) so you believe his claim without question? there was certainly enough scepticism over whether zedd or I were telling the truth. I could have been scum - and maniac hands me the power to be unstoppable/undirectable -- so if I had been a killer, I would have been unstoppable. And at the point where the majority of folk are redirected to me? c'mon - talk about the stars aligning. And I don't believe you answered my question from yesterday on why you think there may be pfk's with mutual wincons -- that reeks of you being a pfk. Indeed, given your question, I'm thinking that there must be quite a few pfk's in this game for that question to even have relevance.
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Natlaw
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Post by Natlaw on Oct 5, 2010 5:23:44 GMT -5
Right = Zedd: Yes folks I did a role investigate and X is Y. X: Yes that is correct I am Y. If Zedd is scum I expect the role investigation part of the claim to be truthful. Or if X is scum too they even can make up a power. Additionally the information is useless to town if Zedd actually flips town. So I rather have him keep checking 'not-a-threat' although it's vague what that will return a corrupted town, etc.
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Natlaw
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Post by Natlaw on Oct 5, 2010 5:25:25 GMT -5
However, if Zedd were Scum, why wasn't I redirected? They must have thought that there was a good chance I would shoot at him. Of course, a bus driver would explain that. 2) They took the gamble you would go for Stay Puft3) Scum have a protector of their own 4) Scum don't have a redirector at all
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Post by BillMc on Oct 5, 2010 5:27:39 GMT -5
1. My power is described as Weak Town-Alligned Cop. It's not me that claims it's weak. It's my role PM. 2. What the fuck do I know? The fucking rules have screwed my role over then! I actually see your point here, but what can I do? I was unseen by a watcher and re-directed last night? Either the re-director targeted my target instead of me(possible) or the redirection does not require "seeing" something. I don't know! I'm frustrated with my role as it is. How can I know why I couldn't be seen visiting Batman but was able to be redirected. Aaaaaaaaagh! 3. Again, what can I say? I didn't believe Batman because I thought two investigators is too much for Town. I investigated Red(tried to anyway) because with 2 investigators, I'm not convinced our masonry is solid. Yeah it really bites when the rules and modtext screw you over. In Pedescribe's Hamlet game, good ole Ed led the crusade against me when I quoted my town PM - as he concluded it had to be fake due to its content. Given the "no threat to town" - and my previous comments related to pfk's - this does tend to support the idea that we have quite a few 3rd party/pfk's in this game - and some are benign, and some are killers. Your investigation doesn't conclusively tell us whether someone is scum - only a threat - so scum or pfk; so in that view, weaker. Now - let's say for the sake of argument, Zed is telling the truth (which I think he is) - with two cops alive - it's tying up two night actions keeping both of us alive. If we lynch Zed, and he is town, then town is screwed - I'll be dead shortly afterwards, and the scum/pfk's will walk all over us. What does lynching Zed gain town? nothing. Hell, in the Never Ending War game, the scum team deliberately jailed one of our own to get him town cred. So I would have expected something far more devious than just saying Skellington is town.
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Post by special on Oct 5, 2010 6:52:49 GMT -5
Yes, it is a workaround. It doesn't need to be male though, it just can't be female for me to reply directly to you in a Day thread. OK, I'll go change it, but someone will have to remind me to put my dress back on when the game is over. I'm sorry. I didn't notice that you had the female gender icon visible. I thought everyone else had either the male icon or no icon at all. Again, my apologies. I didn't mean to leave you out, despite the fact that your character tracks down and kills people like me who kill other people.
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Post by special on Oct 5, 2010 6:55:21 GMT -5
... if he's Scum, any Scum can investigate and relay the results to him So we do know Scum can communicate at Daytime? Have I been skimming? When did "we" learn that? We don't know that they can't do we? So it is possible. Even if they can't, there are ways for Scum to communicate covertly in the Day thread.
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Post by septimus on Oct 5, 2010 7:06:48 GMT -5
Regarding Zedd's claimed power, do we understand what a "threat to Town" is? A Town-aligned Vigilante could be considered a threat to Town, no? If so, what about a Town-aligned doctor or role-blocker; they could use their powers foolishly or unluckily to harm Town.
As Zedd himself implies, his power is so ambiguous and unlikely that it's almost tempting to think he's telling the truth!
And what of his bizarre redirection from Corinthian to Jack Skellington last Night? A busdriver was involved perhaps, but did that driver have any discernable strategy?
Help this novice out, please. This game seems Weird. Is it just me? Is Mafia always like this?
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Post by Mahaloth on Oct 5, 2010 7:19:53 GMT -5
Regarding Zedd's claimed power, do we understand what a "threat to Town" is? A Town-aligned Vigilante could be considered a threat to Town, no? If so, what about a Town-aligned doctor or role-blocker; they could use their powers foolishly or unluckily to harm Town. As Zedd himself implies, his power is so ambiguous and unlikely that it's almost tempting to think he's telling the truth! And what of his bizarre redirection from Corinthian to Jack Skellington last Night? A busdriver was involved perhaps, but did that driver have any discernable strategy? Help this novice out, please. This game seems Weird. Is it just me? Is Mafia always like this? 1. I have already stated that I am not sure what "threat to Town" means. However, "not a threat to town" should(I hope) mean just that. Not sure what a Town alligned vigilante would come up, though. 2. Tempted to think I'm telling the truth? Well, gee, that's because I am!!!! 3. Yeah, it's weird. Two investigators on Town is pretty powerful. I tend to think we have either a very, very strong scum team or some kind of weird roles that makes two investigators justifiable.
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Post by storyteller0910 on Oct 5, 2010 7:56:20 GMT -5
We agree on something. This is refreshing. Maybe I won't need to summon the Hounds for a little attitude adjustment, hee. I don't find the role as claimed hard to swallow in itself, but I do agree there's no direct evidence at this point that he actually took the action he claims to have taken. Given my pre-existing suspicion, I would be willing to support this vote, if it came down to it. ...I find this reasoning, on your part, to be... questionable. Maybe all that messing around with mules is muddying your judgment. Batman has expressed disbelief in my role power, which, I guess, is fair enough on his part. I have no answer to it, of course, and no way to argue it. I'll just point to the track record of Towns trying to guess at what powers are and aren't believable, point to Blockey's track record as a mod who enjoys creating quirky roles, and let it go at that. Well, not quite at that, actually. Batman: You were not role-blocked on Night One, and got a result (indeed, identified Scum!). You were role-blocked on Night Two. Do you wonder, even a little bit, why the Scum chose not to role-block you on Night One? Figure they were just being generous about it? I acknowledge that there are multiple possible explanations, but is it really so far-fetched to imagine that my device is among them? (Incidentally, I targeted you precisely because I thought if you were a Cop, you'd be a good target for a non-Town role-block. And if you were Scum false-claiming Cop, you might try to claim that you had been role-blocked on Night One in order to avoid having to give a result. Had you done so, I'd have known you were lying and been able to out you. A reasonable gambit all around, I figured). But let's get back to Iskaral. As far as I can see, Iskaral's post above, in which she indicates she'd be willing to support my lynch, is bad reasoning. First, she explicitly refuses to state that she finds my power unbelievable as Batman does. So his reasoning, on which she is pseudo-piggybacking (because she does not back her smudge with a vote), she specifically disavows. Instead she is voting for me because there is no direct proof that I did what I claimed. But... there's no direct proof - nor even evidence - that I didn't (none will be forthcoming, either... because I did exactly what I claimed to do). For virtually all of the claimed actions so far, there is no direct proof that the claimant is telling the truth. In simple terms: the mere fact that a thing cannot be conclusively proven is not evidence that the thing is not so. Else you'd have to vote for everyone. There's no direct proof that anyone in this game is Town, therefore I could support a vote for any player using the same reasoning Iskaral offers for her pseudo-smudge above. She backs this with her "pre-existing" suspicion, which near as I can tell is "pre-existing" in the sense that some time ago, she felt I didn't talk about exactly the subjects she would prefer - and which pre-existing she has repeatedly recanted (prior to the post above) on the basis of the action claim that she is now using as a reason to cast suspicion in my direction. ------ Read as a whole, the sequence looks to me like this: 1. Iskaral tries to push suspicion my way when I attempt an analysis that doesn't really get where I was hoping it would go. It doesn't really work, but she's stuck with it, until: 2. I claim, giving her an excuse to back off. But then: 3. The likely Town detective throws some crap my way, at which point she has a chance to jump back in and maybe get me lynched... but: 4. She holds off for now, satisfied with a nudge in the right direction and hoping that she can generate sufficient interest to swing a mislynch of me either toDay or soon. ---- On the whole, and since I see no particular merit in the whole Zedd thing right now, I'm happy to: vote Iskaral Pust
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Post by Renata on Oct 5, 2010 8:07:16 GMT -5
So we do know Scum can communicate at Daytime? Have I been skimming? When did "we" learn that? We don't know that they can't do we? So it is possible. Possible, Hood's mangy beard. Try as certain as sand storms in Raraku. (Before the deluge, heehee.) Masons can talk during the day, so if the scum can't, that'd be very, very unexpected. Batman -- your argument is all well and good *if Zedd is town*, but I don't think he is. It's not day one anymore -- there's enough water under the bridge to start making decisions on problematic claims like his. So we are at an impasse. Five votes on a claimed detective and the whole game grinds to a stop. I'm taking a nap. Wake me up when someone does something.
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Post by Renata on Oct 5, 2010 8:08:00 GMT -5
Good timing!
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timmy
Mome Rath
In the frozen land of Nador they were forced to eat Robin's minstrels. And there was much rejoicing
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Post by timmy on Oct 5, 2010 8:08:15 GMT -5
SQUEEK (Oops. In that last quote, he says his action was a one-shot, which means he can't make anyone else unstoppable/unblockable.) so you believe his claim without question? there was certainly enough scepticism over whether zedd or I were telling the truth. I could have been scum - and maniac hands me the power to be unstoppable/undirectable -- so if I had been a killer, I would have been unstoppable. And at the point where the majority of folk are redirected to me? c'mon - talk about the stars aligning. And I don't believe you answered my question from yesterday on why you think there may be pfk's with mutual wincons -- that reeks of you being a pfk. Indeed, given your question, I'm thinking that there must be quite a few pfk's in this game for that question to even have relevance. Appears the Maniac took a gamble by making you unstoppable. If I believe his claim, it makes sense he'd empower the Cop to overcome a Roleblocker or Redirector. If you were not a Cop and went on a killing spree then we'd be talking differently. Agreed it's a powerful tool for Town but I'd rather have it in our hands than Scum. And makes me wonder what Scum has to balance that. Seems many powers are strong but limited; the Mime's mass Roleblock; the Dr/Ed's Vig ability; the Maniac's booster. What would Scum have to counter those? Or would Scum have typical power with no exceptional qualities, just able to use them every Night? Let's look at the Jail. Not much but it shuts down a player for a Day. Does seem to stop them from getting results, by Elinor's account. Total hasn't claimed so don't know what she was doing. Zedd's got me thinking, could be Town, could be Scum. Role ambiguous enough to fit fake Town claim. but strange enough to make sense in this game for Town to have. Willing to go along with Corinthian's recommendation.
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timmy
Mome Rath
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Post by timmy on Oct 5, 2010 8:16:57 GMT -5
It wouldn't be that hard for scum to come up with a code along the lines of, if I say balloon in my first post of the day my target is a cop, if I say pumpkin, they're a doc or even to just spell out some short version of their role in a post. Thought of coding when I read this: Bottom line: I gOt nO cOmic bOOks. Odd use of caps within a sentence.
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