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Day One
Jan 13, 2012 23:55:59 GMT -5
Post by Boozahol Squid, P.I. on Jan 13, 2012 23:55:59 GMT -5
I made a request to Pleonast to be Town (since I don't like being scummy roles) and lo and behold, I am Town, although I know that accounts for fuck-all right now. Take it as you will. Particularly fuck all because Town doesn't even amount to a majority in this game. It's a good thing to remember for everyone, and particularly those Town-oriented, that a Town claim,. particularly if it's a stronger role, doesn't guarantee lynch freedom. The other factions, at the start of the game, might shy off from revealing their 'non-Town'ness, but in large part its because they will view each other as just as dangerous. But I don't like to start a game without throwing out a vote somewhere, and as far as I can recall, peeker tends to disrupt things more than he helps them along. vote:peeknasty [/b]
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Day One
Jan 14, 2012 7:45:55 GMT -5
Post by guiri on Jan 14, 2012 7:45:55 GMT -5
Really? In a game with no vanilla? And a discussion about it last night which included the very person your questioning here? You're actually asking this? Yeah, that's exactly why I asked. In a game without any vanilla town, his comment that he couldn't deal with the stress of having a power role and prefers VT was out of place and it's conceivable he was unaware of the game setup, even with his N0 comment, just like I hadn't noticed we can vote for multiple players. Vote: Guiri For a question that just doesn't make sense. I don't think it made no sense but even if it did, is it indicative of alignment? Or have I already made your buddies uncomfortable?
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Day One
Jan 14, 2012 9:15:14 GMT -5
Post by JustBeingGinger on Jan 14, 2012 9:15:14 GMT -5
Do you mean you've been randomly assigned more fun roles recently? Or something else? I actually have been given some fun roles in the last few games. A 3rd party survivor in Wedlock, as well as Doctor in Handbasket on LPP Mafia. Correct me if I am wrong, but I think Guiri was more asking about the randomizer portion. Meaning that most games we play here are random role selection but you sort of referenced that they were not.
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Day One
Jan 14, 2012 12:45:16 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on Jan 14, 2012 12:45:16 GMT -5
I didn't read colby's comment that way; just that random is as likely to give fun roles as games offering the option to choose one.
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Day One
Jan 14, 2012 16:20:23 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 14, 2012 16:20:23 GMT -5
Just for information, in the previous games, working backwards:
So for percentages of players:
Town: 48% 48% 52% 55% Wolves: 28% 20% 23% 23% Cabal: 12% 16% 16% 14% Undead: 12% 16% 10% 9%
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Colby11
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Creator of Hell's Kitchen Mafia
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 3:01:23 GMT -5
Post by Colby11 on Jan 15, 2012 3:01:23 GMT -5
I actually have been given some fun roles in the last few games. A 3rd party survivor in Wedlock, as well as Doctor in Handbasket on LPP Mafia. Correct me if I am wrong, but I think Guiri was more asking about the randomizer portion. Meaning that most games we play here are random role selection but you sort of referenced that they were not. I don't think that Guiri was asking about that, personally. This is the first game that I've played where I had the option to voice my opinion about what role that I had. And based on the fact that I have had some very interesting and different roles, I didn't want to pick a preference as to what side I was on.
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Colby11
Administrator
Creator of Hell's Kitchen Mafia
Posts: 1,193
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 3:22:21 GMT -5
Post by Colby11 on Jan 15, 2012 3:22:21 GMT -5
Based on Ed's figures from previous games, we can assume this (4%- 1 player; 20%- 5 players)
Town is around half the number of players (so 12- 13 people)
Wolves are between 20%-28% ( between 5-7 players)
Cabal is between 12%-16%, (between 3-4 players)
And Undead has anywhere from 9% to 16% (between 2 to 4 players)
Adding it up, the minimum total is 22 and the maximum total is 28 (and we have 25 players), so these numbers are close to what they actually are. No way to actually speculate on how many of each there are, because there are so many combinations atm.
I'm not sure whether having just 2 Undead makes the game unbalanced in their favor or not, honestly.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 3:37:04 GMT -5
Post by guiri on Jan 15, 2012 3:37:04 GMT -5
I asked the question about this: I didn't request a role, simply because I wanted the randomizer (or however Pleo picks the roles) to pick what I got and then run with it. I seem to be doing alot better with that lately than in games past. I couldn't tell whether you were saying: - you liked how the randomiser had assigned you roles in recent games or - you do better in games where roles are assigned randomly rather than by request (have you played other games where you can request a role?) or - you've been lucky using the randomizer in recent games (what do you use it for? Voting, selecting targets for Night actions, selecting players to analyze?) Idle curiosity. I'm intrigued by SisterCoyote's comment on this topic. Her first and only post so far toDay is to say: I didn't read colby's comment that way; just that random is as likely to give fun roles as games offering the option to choose one. It must have some significance for her if it's the only thing she's deemed comment worthy so far in the game.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 12:41:29 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on Jan 15, 2012 12:41:29 GMT -5
Actually, it was the only thing that caught my attention on this page, and I thought I'd posted earlier.
Although, yes, on a meta/as an occasional mod standpoint and not from the standpoint of this game in particular, the opportunity to have a voice in one's role as opposed to knowing the role was entirely random does interest me. But that's really a discussion for after the game.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 14:00:18 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 15, 2012 14:00:18 GMT -5
NETA: Please tell me how I could have put it to where you wouldn't have found it nonsensical? Because unless I'm missing something, I don't know of a way I could have put it any more clear than I did. Why would you need to explicitly point out that "non-town" don't know if you're telling the truth? Why would you also need to point out parenthetically that neither would town? If you are a non-secret power holding townie, no one in this game would know that you are what you claim at this point. Non-town or otherwise. So why even bother qualifying the WIFOM with explicit mention of non-town and parenthetical mention of town? There was no good reason to that I can see, so I'm trying to figure out why you did it.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 14:06:31 GMT -5
Post by Pollux Oil on Jan 15, 2012 14:06:31 GMT -5
I apologize to everyone, I've been having some internet issues. For some reason my network likes to die whenever I actually try and accomplish work, so I guess I just have to spend every day on this board instead of attempting to apply for jobs. And from this, we can surmise that Burb is likely not a Necromancer. I don't think that's a good thing to assume. It's easy for anyone to play dumb about things, especially their role if they are one. I'm not saying it's a sign that Suburban IS a Necromancer, but we definitely shouldn't throw out the possibility. I'll be even more specific. I asked to be town first and a specific role second. I got both. So Pleo definitely seemed to give you the role you requested if they were available (at least, in my case he did...I can only speak for myself, however). Personally, I'd find it quite hilarious if you're actually a Scotsman this time. I don't like this post at all. I think if you are truly Town, you'd better serve yourself and your team by remaining quiet on this issue. As is, you're putting a big target on your back from the other groups, whether or not you're lying. And it also has undertones of protesting too much. Idle's post strikes me more as, well, simply how Idle always plays. I don't think I've ever been in a game with him where he hasn't started off the game with something similar to this. He always either declares he's town, or asks him to lynch him, or something off the wall. Heh. I have been wondering about the players that did NOT get the specific role that they requested may be at a slight advantage. I know that the role might not be in the game but if it is in the game and someone claims that particular role then the person who did not get it could think “hey, they are telling the truth” and either wipe them out or protect them. I am probably just doing a Flaky Jan thing again but I have been thinking about it and you can either shoot me down in flames or think about it yourself. If I recall correctly, Pleo randomizes the order of the people who submitted a list of preferences, then goes down that list, then randomizes everyone else and gives out the remaining roles. So people who submitted a list but didn't get their first choice have a big heaping pile of WiFoM, because either somebody else got the role(s) they requested, or the roles aren't even in the game. It's basically the same type of metagaming as "Ed could have asked to be a wolf again, or he didn't." AKA not really worth it. I'm not sure whether having just 2 Undead makes the game unbalanced in their favor or not, honestly. I think in the first Conspiracy game the Undead almost won because the Necromancer was one shy of raising enough zombies to overtake the town, and they only had 2 to being with. Vampires have an innate advantage because they're immune to faction cross-kills, and a Vig will only target them if they know for certain they're a vampire. The less vampires there are, the less likely it is the vampires will accidentally off the necromancer. I'd say they'd be slightly better off with just two.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 14:07:57 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Jan 15, 2012 14:07:57 GMT -5
I made a request to Pleonast to be Town (since I don't like being scummy roles) and lo and behold, I am Town, although I know that accounts for fuck-all right now. Take it as you will. Particularly fuck all because Town doesn't even amount to a majority in this game. It's a good thing to remember for everyone, and particularly those Town-oriented, that a Town claim,. particularly if it's a stronger role, doesn't guarantee lynch freedom. The other factions, at the start of the game, might shy off from revealing their 'non-Town'ness, but in large part its because they will view each other as just as dangerous. But I don't like to start a game without throwing out a vote somewhere, and as far as I can recall, peeker tends to disrupt things more than he helps them along. vote:peeknasty <bleached> weekend has been a bitch. i'll catch up tonight and tomorrow but i just can't help but comment on this bad boy. what a bunch of fucking hooey. i don't think i have posted shit in this thread because of rl. tough shit. so i skimmed to get to this piece of shit. let's wait for another fucking lazy player. to try and nail me on that. sure scum hate disruption. makes 'em shuck and jive which invariably they fail if the pressure stays on them.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 14:24:15 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 15, 2012 14:24:15 GMT -5
Really? In a game with no vanilla? And a discussion about it last night which included the very person your questioning here? You're actually asking this? Yeah, that's exactly why I asked. In a game without any vanilla town, his comment that he couldn't deal with the stress of having a power role and prefers VT was out of place and it's conceivable he was unaware of the game setup, even with his N0 comment Gotcha. I looked at your comment on his statement out-of-context. Now that I understand where you're coming from, and looking back on where his statement came from (i.e. in the middle of people discussing whether or not they asked for specific roles) I see your point. You understand there's no vanilla, but the fact that he's afraid of requesting specific roles because he doesn't like the stress of having a power-role, yet he's playing in an all power-role game, just seems off. So I take it back. Unvote: guiri Vote: Inner Stickler Depends on why you ask it. I voted you mainly to spur you explaining. Though, admittedly, my experience with your playstyle means I probably wouldn't have to have voted you to get you to explain, since you typically are among the more verbose players no matter what alignment you are. But in a game with multiple voting and the fact that it's Day 1 where the only way to get a case is to get people talking, there's no reason to do FOS or anything. Votes are cheap and easy to get rid of, so I'll use them. 1) I'm not schizophrenic so no buddies there. 2) The only faction in this game that has no currently connected group (barring secret powers) is Undead. Wolves are connected, Cabal are connected, Witches (Town) are connected. And then there are secret powers which could connect others. So answering that question would reveal something about what I know about the setup and/or my role, wouldn't it? So if you don't mind, I'll just say that my line of questioning is purely from me and no one else.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 14:30:23 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 15, 2012 14:30:23 GMT -5
The less vampires there are, the less likely it is the vampires will accidentally off the necromancer. Yeah, but they still seem to have a knack for killing their necro. IIRC, NAF vamped his necro in one of the conspiracy games on the Dope (I think it was #2), and his reaction to realizing what he did was amusing.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 14:38:54 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 15, 2012 14:38:54 GMT -5
Actually, now that I think about it, it might have been 3, where one of the Vamps ended up taking out the necromancer he didn't know (since each vamp knew of one of the necromancers).
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 15:10:10 GMT -5
Post by Inner Stickler on Jan 15, 2012 15:10:10 GMT -5
Guiri and Frood are thinking too much. I don't choose roles in Conspiracy, the only game I'm aware of where one can influence their role like that, because it's too stressful. I take what comes trusting in luck. But this is an all power role game? Really? So every single person is submitting either a night or day action?
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 15:24:13 GMT -5
Post by septimus on Jan 15, 2012 15:24:13 GMT -5
It seems to me that the Undead will try to handshake with each other early in the game. Do we already see evidence of such shaking? I told Pleo that I'd rather be dead than be a wolf. I seem to remember Hoopy being a Zombie even though he wasn't playing. Undead really need to figure out their teammates, don't they? Yep. The wolfman is the Necromancer. Vote: Mr. Special EdAnd from this, we can surmise that Burb is likely not a Necromancer.... Could be WiFoM, but also an under-the-wire Vampire hint. Not taking any chances: Vote: Drain BeadI hope for posts to help clarify game mechanics. For example Any other (including results announced by the Coroner, if there is one) could be meddled with. This isn't phrased as though you're speaking of a false or lying Coroner. Is there another power involved?
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 15:40:37 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 15, 2012 15:40:37 GMT -5
Tomorrow is a holiday for some in the USA. We really do need to get some vote out there in order to have someone over 13.
Also, I have a nasty cold and headache, so I'm not thinking clearly. Do we usually have a mad influx of votes later into Day 1?
I actually like the way septimus is thinking, but I don't like him voting for me
Vote: septimus
guiri is a very good player. However, I have a feeling that he isn't on my team
Vote: guiri
Idle thoughts hasn't claimed yet
Vote: Idle Toughts
peeker has made a pre-emptive move to avoid easy votes on himself
Vote: peeker
In case I'm wrong about guiri, he's usually very good and he's voting texcat
Vote: texcat
and, since I've voting for septimus and everyone who has gotten votes so far...
Vote: Drain Bead Vote: Inner Stickler
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 15:59:14 GMT -5
Post by Idle Thoughts on Jan 15, 2012 15:59:14 GMT -5
I'm not sure whether having just 2 Undead makes the game unbalanced in their favor or not, honestly. It's just two right now. You have to remember* that they can get more by resurrecting the dead. *I'm assuming you have to remember this by giving you the benefit of the doubt and that you're not just playing dumb (I.E. you're the Necromancer and pretending not to remember). NETA: Please tell me how I could have put it to where you wouldn't have found it nonsensical? Because unless I'm missing something, I don't know of a way I could have put it any more clear than I did. Why would you need to explicitly point out that "non-town" don't know if you're telling the truth? Because I was asked about it.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 16:13:13 GMT -5
Post by guiri on Jan 15, 2012 16:13:13 GMT -5
and, since I've voting for septimus and everyone who has gotten votes so far... You don't seem to have much confidence in your votes. If your goal is to help reach the minimum number of votes, why not vote for all 24 other players?
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 16:24:33 GMT -5
Post by guiri on Jan 15, 2012 16:24:33 GMT -5
Guiri and Frood are thinking too much. I don't choose roles in Conspiracy, the only game I'm aware of where one can influence their role like that, because it's too stressful. I take what comes trusting in luck. But this is an all power role game? Really? So every single person is submitting either a night or day action? Almost. According to the rules, all roles have a Night or Day action except the passive roles (Coroner, Scotsman, and Omega) and the groups that share an action (witches, cabal, and wolves). Oh, there are also zombies.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 18:44:05 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 15, 2012 18:44:05 GMT -5
and, since I've voting for septimus and everyone who has gotten votes so far... You don't seem to have much confidence in your votes. If your goal is to help reach the minimum number of votes, why not vote for all 24 other players? I don't have much confidence in any of my votes. But if this game is like the previous two games and has 12/25 Town, then I have 13/24 (54%) chance of hitting a non-Town randomly anyway. Besides, it might spark some conversation.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 19:48:43 GMT -5
Post by texcat on Jan 15, 2012 19:48:43 GMT -5
I have no idea why you would think this or say it. All I said is that I prefer to just let "whatever happens, happen", and I was obviously referring to role assignment. If I'm scum, OK. If I'm Town, OK. If something else, OK.
I've had enough mix of everything that randomness is fine by me. I was referring to previous games where I'd voted you early on and you flipped scum. Apart from the most recent game we've played together, it seems you're always scum. Mahaloth is always scum? Really? Tomorrow is a holiday for some in the USA. We really do need to get some vote out there in order to have someone over 13. Also, I have a nasty cold and headache, so I'm not thinking clearly. Do we usually have a mad influx of votes later into Day 1? I actually like the way septimus is thinking, but I don't like him voting for me Vote: septimus [/color] guiri is a very good player. However, I have a feeling that he isn't on my team Vote: guiri [/color] Idle thoughts hasn't claimed yet Vote: Idle Toughts [/color] peeker has made a pre-emptive move to avoid easy votes on himself Vote: peeker [/color] In case I'm wrong about guiri, he's usually very good and he's voting texcat Vote: texcat [/color] and, since I've voting for septimus and everyone who has gotten votes so far... Vote: Drain Bead [/color] Vote: Inner Stickler [/color][/quote] Following the crowd and voting for everyone who already has a vote? Is that really a good strategy? Bandwagoning for the sake of bandwagoning? And voting for Guiri, and then just in case that's wrong, voting for me? Trying to cover all bases and then some, Ed? And I'm not sure that I like the way you not so subtly said that you don't already know who is on your team. I'm thinking that you already know exactly who is on your team. Vote: Special Ed
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 19:52:42 GMT -5
Post by Pollux Oil on Jan 15, 2012 19:52:42 GMT -5
It's just two right now. You have to remember* that they can get more by resurrecting the dead. This post makes me curious. I interpreted colby's post as a hypothetical on whether 2 active undead would be at a disadvantage. (And when I say active, I mean actual players a la Vampires/Necromancers, as Zombies don't really affect the playing field apart from the win condition.) But the "right now" portion of your post makes it seem like you're not talking hypothetical. Care to explain?
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 20:34:16 GMT -5
Post by Idle Thoughts on Jan 15, 2012 20:34:16 GMT -5
I think you're reading too much into it.
I was just reminding him of things he may have forgotten (that the necro has the ability to raise the dead, thus making the undead faction grow in size).
That's all there is to it. Nothing more to be read into it. I don't see how my saying "right now" shows anything...there ARE only two Undead right now..yes or no? Seems to me the answer is yes.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 20:37:06 GMT -5
Post by Idle Thoughts on Jan 15, 2012 20:37:06 GMT -5
Oh, I get what you mean now. I misread what he said (and what Ed had said in the quote before him). I took it to mean there were only 2 undead in the game.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 21:35:09 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Jan 15, 2012 21:35:09 GMT -5
I love starting the game off giving all the groups a big, steaming pile of WiFoM. I don't like this post at all. I think if you are truly Town, you'd better serve yourself and your team by remaining quiet on this issue. As is, you're putting a big target on your back from the other groups, whether or not you're lying. And it also has undertones of protesting too much. oh, ffs, it's what he does. if he didn't he catch shit for not doing so. crud, draino/b] you know that. fishing for a vote on some lame ass reason?
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 21:37:47 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Jan 15, 2012 21:37:47 GMT -5
I did not place any request in for my role. I would think that if Pleo was going to ask for what role you wanted, they would try to get you in the role that you requested. <bolding and sizing mine> heh heh. pleo is not only all know but apparantly sybil as well.
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 21:38:25 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 15, 2012 21:38:25 GMT -5
Following the crowd and voting for everyone who already has a vote? Is that really a good strategy? Bandwagoning for the sake of bandwagoning? And voting for Guiri, and then just in case that's wrong, voting for me? Trying to cover all bases and then some, Ed? And I'm not sure that I like the way you not so subtly said that you don't already know who is on your team. I'm thinking that you already know exactly who is on your team. Vote: Special EdWell, we have less than 48 hours to get someone to 13 votes or no one will be lynched. And you're trying to find things in my votes? hehe. good luck
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Day One
Jan 15, 2012 21:39:38 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 15, 2012 21:39:38 GMT -5
I did not place any request in for my role. I would think that if Pleo was going to ask for what role you wanted, they would try to get you in the role that you requested. <bolding and sizing mine> heh heh. pleo is not only all know but apparantly sybil as well. really? another comment on the use of "they" for "he/she" it really isn't that rare.
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