|
Post by AmyKay on May 14, 2012 11:19:31 GMT -5
thanks for both the run-down of who votes whom and the timeline - I enjoyed taking a few notes on both.
|
|
|
Post by Suburban Plankton on May 14, 2012 11:42:57 GMT -5
We have a term called Scum gloating. We use it most often when a Town player gets lynched or NK'd and they go "Shucky Darn, I'm so sorry." While on the inside they are gleeful. We do indeed have that Concept...but has it ever been demonstrated to have any validity whatsoever? I mean, sure, there have been times when Scum players have 'gloated', but there are far more times when Town players legitimately post "Sorry to see you go". Is there any evidence whatsoever that Scum are statistically more likely to make such posts than Town? Or should this go in the 'Mafia myths' pile along with the 'third-vote rule' and 'Scum wouldn't do that'?
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on May 14, 2012 11:44:42 GMT -5
Just caught up. I'm not online on weekends, generally.
Although we're allowed to talk at Night, I think it wiser to avoid doing so.
|
|
|
Post by wombat99 on May 14, 2012 11:54:12 GMT -5
Just caught up. I'm not online on weekends, generally. Although we're allowed to talk at Night, I think it wiser to avoid doing so. Really? But at least one townie will be killed at the end of Night, shouldn't we share our observations in case we are the one killed?
|
|
|
Post by wombat99 on May 14, 2012 12:00:47 GMT -5
bleached <rubs hands together> who to lynch first...I think I'm seeing some sneaky scum in here already! Sorry for the noob question, but how long do we have to cast our vote? -400 Townie Cred Vote: starrirain Mr Special Ed - you got the starrirain bandwagon rolling with this. -400 townie cred for (what turned out to be) an innocent newbie comment? That seems like an exaggeration of the scumminess of the comment. I could see a scum wanting to pick out a newbie comment like this, exaggerate the scumminess, and get a bandwagon going against a town (knowing that a bandwagon was likely with lots of newbies voting).
|
|
|
Post by special on May 14, 2012 12:05:35 GMT -5
We have a term called Scum gloating. We use it most often when a Town player gets lynched or NK'd and they go "Shucky Darn, I'm so sorry." While on the inside they are gleeful. We do indeed have that Concept...but has it ever been demonstrated to have any validity whatsoever? I mean, sure, there have been times when Scum players have 'gloated', but there are far more times when Town players legitimately post "Sorry to see you go". Is there any evidence whatsoever that Scum are statistically more likely to make such posts than Town? Or should this go in the 'Mafia myths' pile along with the 'third-vote rule' and 'Scum wouldn't do that'? Like the third vote Scum (in a smaller game) the concept only works with newer players, but yes, I've experienced some success with it.
|
|
|
Post by special on May 14, 2012 12:06:33 GMT -5
bleached -400 Townie Cred Vote: starrirain Mr Special Ed - you got the starrirain bandwagon rolling with this. -400 townie cred for (what turned out to be) an innocent newbie comment? That seems like an exaggeration of the scumminess of the comment. I could see a scum wanting to pick out a newbie comment like this, exaggerate the scumminess, and get a bandwagon going against a town (knowing that a bandwagon was likely with lots of newbies voting). it depends on the exchange rate for those points. They're really more like airline miles than dollars.
|
|
|
Post by special on May 14, 2012 12:09:06 GMT -5
PS, plus, I didn't really start a bandwagon. I made a case and placed a vote.I asked for comments on my case as well. At the time of my vote, it was quite far from a bandwagon.
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on May 14, 2012 12:10:25 GMT -5
Just caught up. I'm not online on weekends, generally. Although we're allowed to talk at Night, I think it wiser to avoid doing so. Really? But at least one townie will be killed at the end of Night, shouldn't we share our observations in case we are the one killed? Posting always has risks. Risks of revealing information. Scum risk slipping their alignment or their teammates. Power roles risk revealing their power. Vanilla town risk looking like vanilla and thus increasing the odds a power role is killed. During the Day, we need to take those risks, because we want to lynch scum and posting is the best way to do that. During the Night, there's not benefit for talking those risks.
|
|
|
Post by wombat99 on May 14, 2012 12:11:22 GMT -5
bleached Mr Special Ed - you got the starrirain bandwagon rolling with this. -400 townie cred for (what turned out to be) an innocent newbie comment? That seems like an exaggeration of the scumminess of the comment. I could see a scum wanting to pick out a newbie comment like this, exaggerate the scumminess, and get a bandwagon going against a town (knowing that a bandwagon was likely with lots of newbies voting). it depends on the exchange rate for those points. They're really more like airline miles than dollars. ;D I've got my eye on you, Ed ;D
|
|
|
Post by wombat99 on May 14, 2012 12:12:52 GMT -5
Really? But at least one townie will be killed at the end of Night, shouldn't we share our observations in case we are the one killed? Posting always has risks. Risks of revealing information. Scum risk slipping their alignment or their teammates. Power roles risk revealing their power. Vanilla town risk looking like vanilla and thus increasing the odds a power role is killed. During the Day, we need to take those risks, because we want to lynch scum and posting is the best way to do that. During the Night, there's not benefit for talking those risks. Ah. I see your point.
|
|
|
Post by Rich Beckman on May 14, 2012 12:15:37 GMT -5
PS, plus, I didn't really start a bandwagon. I made a case and placed a vote.I asked for comments on my case as well. At the time of my vote, it was quite far from a bandwagon. Well, obviously it was far from a bandwagon when you posted. If you are starting the bandwagon, then it seems logical that the bandwagon simply did not exist prior to your starting it! ;D
|
|
|
Post by laxrules017 on May 14, 2012 13:06:53 GMT -5
I feel like I'm posting all my thoughts. Sorry for spamming.
|
|
|
Post by crys on May 14, 2012 13:09:55 GMT -5
What I find interesting is that some players that were very active in Day 1 have just vanished. For instance the person that was so very helpful in Day 1 (Gadarene) has completely vanished. However two of the vote front runners on in Day 1(Meeko and Pleonast) have both posted on the night board.
The fact that Gadarene completely disappeared really bothers me. I guess when they said that sometimes scum is the nicest and most helpful player on the board really stuck with me. It might be over reaction and it might be paranoia on my case.
Thoughts?
|
|
|
Post by crys on May 14, 2012 13:12:05 GMT -5
I feel like I'm posting all my thoughts. Sorry for spamming. Participation is good from what I understand
|
|
|
Post by laxrules017 on May 14, 2012 13:13:16 GMT -5
What I find interesting is that some players that were very active in Day 1 have just vanished. For instance the person that was so very helpful in Day 1 (Gadarene) has completely vanished. However two of the vote front runners on in Day 1(Meeko and Pleonast) have both posted on the night board. The fact that Gadarene completely disappeared really bothers me. I guess when they said that sometimes scum is the nicest and most helpful player on the board really stuck with me. It might be over reaction and it might be paranoia on my case. Thoughts? Either inactive or maybe spending all their time with the scum.
|
|
|
Post by laxrules017 on May 14, 2012 13:21:24 GMT -5
When is night over?
|
|
Meeko
FGM
I raccoon it's time to play Mafia
Posts: 2,474
[ Exalt | Smite ]
Karma:
|
Post by Meeko on May 14, 2012 13:26:30 GMT -5
Just caught up. I'm not online on weekends, generally. Although we're allowed to talk at Night, I think it wiser to avoid doing so. Really? But at least one townie will be killed at the end of Night, shouldn't we share our observations in case we are the one killed? I would think most town would feel this way. Unless Pleonast isn't town.....
|
|
|
Post by laxrules017 on May 14, 2012 13:32:18 GMT -5
Really? But at least one townie will be killed at the end of Night, shouldn't we share our observations in case we are the one killed? I would think most town would feel this way. Unless Pleonast isn't town..... common sense? He's thinking town unless he isn't town?
|
|
|
Post by Gadarene on May 14, 2012 13:45:33 GMT -5
What I find interesting is that some players that were very active in Day 1 have just vanished. For instance the person that was so very helpful in Day 1 (Gadarene) has completely vanished. However two of the vote front runners on in Day 1(Meeko and Pleonast) have both posted on the night board. The fact that Gadarene completely disappeared really bothers me. I guess when they said that sometimes scum is the nicest and most helpful player on the board really stuck with me. It might be over reaction and it might be paranoia on my case. Thoughts? I haven't been around very much the last couple of days; sorry about that. Also sorry to starrirain for leading her lynch. I'm no more scum than, say, Silver Jan is, though. At some point I intended to do a Short Guide on Playing Vigilante, in case there are newbie vigs among us. Work is pressing right now, but the highlights are as follows: (1) I advocate using your vigilante shot every night, although I know some people disagree with this approach; (2) when a townie is lynched the previous day, resolving the runner-up wagon with a vig shot is usually a decent idea (in this case, however, I would not advocate vigging Pleonast, for the same reasons I laid out on Day One); (3) absent that, don't be afraid to vig your strongest scum lean; (4) give special consideration to players who are under the radar and not contributing very much (recognizing, of course, that the fewer posts they have, the harder it might be to have a scum lean on them, but still). Vigging from the bottom half of the post count (i.e., the lowest-volume posters) is generally safe-ish. Others can feel free to chime in.
|
|
|
Post by crys on May 14, 2012 13:58:24 GMT -5
What I find interesting is that some players that were very active in Day 1 have just vanished. For instance the person that was so very helpful in Day 1 (Gadarene) has completely vanished. However two of the vote front runners on in Day 1(Meeko and Pleonast) have both posted on the night board. The fact that Gadarene completely disappeared really bothers me. I guess when they said that sometimes scum is the nicest and most helpful player on the board really stuck with me. It might be over reaction and it might be paranoia on my case. Thoughts? I haven't been around very much the last couple of days; sorry about that. Also sorry to starrirain for leading her lynch. I'm no more scum than, say, Silver Jan is, though. At some point I intended to do a Short Guide on Playing Vigilante, in case there are newbie vigs among us. Work is pressing right now, but the highlights are as follows: (1) I advocate using your vigilante shot every night, although I know some people disagree with this approach; (2) when a townie is lynched the previous day, resolving the runner-up wagon with a vig shot is usually a decent idea (in this case, however, I would not advocate vigging Pleonast, for the same reasons I laid out on Day One); (3) absent that, don't be afraid to vig your strongest scum lean; (4) give special consideration to players who are under the radar and not contributing very much (recognizing, of course, that the fewer posts they have, the harder it might be to have a scum lean on them, but still). Vigging from the bottom half of the post count (i.e., the lowest-volume posters) is generally safe-ish. Others can feel free to chime in. I can empathize with a high volume work load lol. I am enjoying my only day off for the week. Earlier today I was coerced into some overtime for tomorrow. Actually that happens to me quite a bit, but that is what I get for working at a 4 diamond resort holidays and weekends are just any other day for us unfortunately.
|
|
|
Post by wombat99 on May 14, 2012 14:28:27 GMT -5
What I find interesting is that some players that were very active in Day 1 have just vanished. For instance the person that was so very helpful in Day 1 (Gadarene) has completely vanished. However two of the vote front runners on in Day 1(Meeko and Pleonast) have both posted on the night board. The fact that Gadarene completely disappeared really bothers me. I guess when they said that sometimes scum is the nicest and most helpful player on the board really stuck with me. It might be over reaction and it might be paranoia on my case. Thoughts? I think it's important to separate explaining-the-game helpfulness from influencing-your-vote helpfulness. Gadarene has been very helpful in explaining the game and I'm not counting that for or against him.
|
|
|
Post by special on May 14, 2012 14:50:03 GMT -5
What I find interesting is that some players that were very active in Day 1 have just vanished. For instance the person that was so very helpful in Day 1 (Gadarene) has completely vanished. However two of the vote front runners on in Day 1(Meeko and Pleonast) have both posted on the night board. The fact that Gadarene completely disappeared really bothers me. I guess when they said that sometimes scum is the nicest and most helpful player on the board really stuck with me. It might be over reaction and it might be paranoia on my case. Thoughts? Most games have much smaller participation at Night. There's not really much to be done in the Night thread since we can't vote to lynch anyone.
|
|
|
Post by special on May 14, 2012 14:54:30 GMT -5
Really? But at least one townie will be killed at the end of Night, shouldn't we share our observations in case we are the one killed? I would think most town would feel this way. Unless Pleonast isn't town..... I'm not much for sharing inforamtion at Night with a few noteable exceptions. For example, if I'm a detective and I have some Townie results, I might share them with seconds to go in a Night so that if I'm killed, my results don't go with me. But, in reality, we can't lynch until Day, and I don't want to tip my hand any more because the Scum might decide to kill me if I'm on to them (and in WiFoM, they might kill me if I'm way off base becuase people trust dead Townies)
|
|
|
Post by special on May 14, 2012 14:56:17 GMT -5
What I find interesting is that some players that were very active in Day 1 have just vanished. For instance the person that was so very helpful in Day 1 (Gadarene) has completely vanished. However two of the vote front runners on in Day 1(Meeko and Pleonast) have both posted on the night board. The fact that Gadarene completely disappeared really bothers me. I guess when they said that sometimes scum is the nicest and most helpful player on the board really stuck with me. It might be over reaction and it might be paranoia on my case. Thoughts? I haven't been around very much the last couple of days; sorry about that. Also sorry to starrirain for leading her lynch. I'm no more scum than, say, Silver Jan is, though. At some point I intended to do a Short Guide on Playing Vigilante, in case there are newbie vigs among us. Work is pressing right now, but the highlights are as follows: (1) I advocate using your vigilante shot every night, although I know some people disagree with this approach; (2) when a townie is lynched the previous day, resolving the runner-up wagon with a vig shot is usually a decent idea (in this case, however, I would not advocate vigging Pleonast, for the same reasons I laid out on Day One); (3) absent that, don't be afraid to vig your strongest scum lean; (4) give special consideration to players who are under the radar and not contributing very much (recognizing, of course, that the fewer posts they have, the harder it might be to have a scum lean on them, but still). Vigging from the bottom half of the post count (i.e., the lowest-volume posters) is generally safe-ish. Others can feel free to chime in. If I were a Vigilante, at this point, I would take out one of the low posting players who hasn't been subbed. For the reasons you state, plus, it is only Night 1, that makes it difficult to get a strong Scum lean.
|
|
|
Post by Gadarene on May 14, 2012 15:42:40 GMT -5
I'm not sure how I feel about Ed making a lot of sense so far this game to me. We weren't on the same page like this in Little Mermaid when we were both Town, Ed. Then again, we were both scum in Arkham, and if I had been Town there I'm not sure I would have felt you were making a ton of sense in that game either. Bottom line: I think you've been really cogent and incisive so far. Hope you're on my team.
|
|
|
Post by laxrules017 on May 14, 2012 15:44:44 GMT -5
I'm not sure how I feel about Ed making a lot of sense so far this game to me. We weren't on the same page like this in Little Mermaid when we were both Town, Ed. Then again, we were both scum in Arkham, and if I had been Town there I'm not sure I would have felt you were making a ton of sense in that game either. Bottom line: I think you've been really cogent and incisive so far. Hope you're on my team. Samesies.
|
|
|
Post by Sister Coyote on May 14, 2012 15:47:48 GMT -5
Meatspace ate my game time -- My aunt had triple bypass surgery in the middle of last week and she's doing fine but I was running about helping my family with errands and stuff. Also, I won't be online much the latter half of this week, as I'm going to be dogsitting and forgot to get the internet password from the homeowners. So I understand we all have to wait around for Scum to do their bit, but what about these mysterious roles...when do we hear from them? I haven't really got the hang of what they are or when they contribute... Or have you all run away to have a life for a couple of days lol. Oh dear I think I'm hooked...!! Yeah, it's pretty addicting. That said, though, we DON'T want our power roles to out themselves (Pleo notwithstanding) if at all possible until they've got a couple of Days under their belts (for the cops) or pretty much ever (in the case of a doc/vig) unless they need to claim to avoid a lynch. this thread has been really helpful to me. I went with the "xyz made sense with their reasoning, so I'll vote that way, too" for Day One, not realizing that there was any need for me to give a different insight. My apologies if that was a scum thing to do - I just didn't understand why we needed to clog up a long thread with more words, LoL. are all Days the same length? do they all tend to have that many posts or will that increase/decrease as time goes on and more are lynched/killed? (oh yeah, I didn't realize there was a difference there, either, haha!) Actually, it depends. If you only ever vote for someone based on someone else's reasoning, then you can get yourself lynched for being a "me, too" voter. On the other hand, sometimes the only thing one can say is that one has been swayed by person(s) X (Y, Z) -- but it's good to explain specifically which PART of their argument you agree with. Guys it seems odd to me that 14 people all vote for one person, and there are 15 scum. Hypothetically if one doesn't vote or is inactive, then shouldn't we start with that lynch as to avoid a second mislynching? That's what I will be basing my votes on. It is really, really unlikely that all 14 people who voted for that Town person were Scum. Really. Scum generally split up their vote rather than all voting in a bloc (at least, until the end game when things are a little different). Are there exceptions? OF course. Scum would totally do that. What I find interesting is that some players that were very active in Day 1 have just vanished. For instance the person that was so very helpful in Day 1 (Gadarene) has completely vanished. However two of the vote front runners on in Day 1(Meeko and Pleonast) have both posted on the night board. The fact that Gadarene completely disappeared really bothers me. I guess when they said that sometimes scum is the nicest and most helpful player on the board really stuck with me. It might be over reaction and it might be paranoia on my case. Thoughts? Night threads tend to be quieter than Day threads, generally speaking. That said: It is not possible to be too paranoid in a Mafia game.
|
|
|
Post by guiri on May 14, 2012 15:48:48 GMT -5
I haven't seen a player called "Dropped out" so I presume mel simply dropped out and was not replaced by a substitute. Will she be replaced? If not, will there be a reveal?
|
|
|
Post by Gadarene on May 14, 2012 15:59:40 GMT -5
That said: It is not possible to be too paranoid in a Mafia game. I disagree with this. As I said in the Day One thread, one of the most important things to learn about Mafia, in my opinion, is the fact that by far the majority of us are Townspeople. Reflexive paranoia is ill-served and just benefits the scum. I'd rather approach people with some measure of cautious trust and be proved wrong occasionally than view everyone as a potential scum and be wrong around three-quarters of the time. Y'know? Glad your aunt's doing okay, by the way!
|
|