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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 3, 2012 22:12:07 GMT -5
Merestil Haye, Town and a DOCTOR, is dead. jmj697mn, Town, is dead.
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It is now Day five.
Day Five will end (naturally) on SATURDAY at 5pm... ..or, earlier, if 19 people vote END DAY (early).
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Post by patricia on Jun 3, 2012 22:37:08 GMT -5
2. Pleonast 3. gnarlycharlie 4. mahaloth 5. Suburban Plankton 7. Texcat 8. CatinaSuit 9. Archangel 11. Cathi 13. jlrinmke 14. phoenixphyre 19. supermel 20. kagemoto 21. dizzymrslizzy 22. crys 24. annetastic 25. wombat99 27. Silver Jan 28. Meeko 29. AmyKB 30. Septimus 32. JustBeingGinger 33. Total Ulla 34. Inner Stickler. 36. aleetha 37. susanmurphy 38. richbeckman 39. Patricia 40. cassipietz 41. Colby11 42. guiri 43. jerelijah 45. mistde 47. Hal Briston 48. Michelehunter 50. LadyRogue 51. Starrirain 53. annem 56. Suits101 58. Paranoia 60. Oldred
If my counts and list are correct above is the list of players remaining with their current names only
Deathcount is 12 dead town and 4 scum and one pfk also
so we should only have Masons, Detectives, and Doctors left that have special roles correct?
so we can now assume the scum have two night kills?
Commits? Anyone?
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Colby11
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Post by Colby11 on Jun 3, 2012 22:40:59 GMT -5
Agreed that scum most likely has only two kills, and agreed that the specials are now only docs, cops, and masons.
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Colby11
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Post by Colby11 on Jun 3, 2012 22:45:06 GMT -5
Pleonast- want to reveal if you actually have a power, as you suggested on Night 0.
Meanwhile, I have no clue who to vote for, so I am voting for my favorite number, 32... Vote JustbeingGinger
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 3, 2012 22:51:59 GMT -5
JustbeingGinger - 1 vote (Colby11)
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Post by AmyKay on Jun 3, 2012 23:26:12 GMT -5
Pleonast- want to reveal if you actually have a power, as you suggested on Night 0. Meanwhile, I have no clue who to vote for, so I am voting for my favorite number, 32...Vote JustbeingGinger (bleached) while I, too, am interested in revisiting Pleonast's possible claim, the idea that Colby would vote so soon into a new Day intrigues me... it strikes me as both a great idea and a very odd ploy.
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Post by septimus on Jun 3, 2012 23:34:49 GMT -5
so we should only have Masons, Detectives, and Doctors left that have special roles correct? so we can now assume the scum have two night kills? Idle stated that there were only a total of three instances of other special roles so, yes, I agree everyone remaining must be Mason, Detective, Doctor, Vanilla Town, or Scum. There is no Godfather. But, we know Scum had at least three Kills in the early Days and I guess they still have that many for a simple reason: Idle promised us the Game would be relatively short. I have trouble understanding how shortness can follow from 3 Scum Kills, let alone from 2. I think it's time to revisit Pleonast. At the beginning of the Game he told us he was a Town Power, a Scum, or an Untruthful Vanilla Town. I was one of the ones who thought we should wait a few Days and let events tell us which of these he was. A few Days have passed. What do we now know? One of our main hopes was that he was Untruthful Vanilla and that Scum would waste their Night Kill on him. But that has not come to pass. Rather than Scum wasting Kill on Vanilla, I'm afraid we may have a Doctor wasting Protection on him. (BTW, Septimus #1 the Doctor did not Protect Pleonast.) I've looked at Masons' posts for a breadcrumb, but haven't found any. Anyway, we needn't worry about Lynching a Mason Pleonast -- Jan or Maha would step forth to save him. A Detective who claims early will reveal results early, so that's ruled out as well. I don't think Pleonast claimed a Power role just to become a relatively useless self-Protecting Doctor. (But if he did, Scum probably know he's Doctor by now -- why keep it secret from Town?) Therefore Pleonast is Scum or Untruthful Vanilla. By now, I'll guess one of our Detectives has investigated Meeko or Pleonast or both. I'd not be surprised if our Detective knows Pleonast is Scum but doesn't want to reveal himself to tell us the obvious. Let's let that Detective remain hidden. Vote: Pleonast
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Jun 3, 2012 23:37:29 GMT -5
Do the investigated have the right to ask that an investigator / detective reveal results on them?
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Colby11
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Post by Colby11 on Jun 4, 2012 1:10:50 GMT -5
Pleonast- want to reveal if you actually have a power, as you suggested on Night 0. Meanwhile, I have no clue who to vote for, so I am voting for my favorite number, 32...Vote JustbeingGinger (bleached) while I, too, am interested in revisiting Pleonast's possible claim, the idea that Colby would vote so soon into a new Day intrigues me... it strikes me as both a great idea and a very odd ploy. Great idea, absolutely.... Odd ploy- not really. We as Town need to be more proactive, not reactive
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Post by Mahaloth on Jun 4, 2012 8:10:39 GMT -5
I still think it is Meeko.
Vote Meeko
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Post by supermel on Jun 4, 2012 8:23:03 GMT -5
Just a few 'musings'...
Hope there is lots of dialogue over this 'day', There are few people who i would like to read more from including Meeko, Pleonast and colby (due to early vote in this day that i am a bit lost on the strategy of that). I may not vote for these people but just looking for more information to think on. It is hard for me to guess the roles people might or might not have- when i have never played before ... i also don't understand why some are pushing for reveals- if there are only so many dr's and two people have revealed themselves- what is the advantage to putting a target on more special roles?
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Post by Hal Briston on Jun 4, 2012 8:27:23 GMT -5
Do we know this for certain? I mean, yes, we have all the power roles specified in the setup covered, but...well, I guess in my mind I was looking at that list as non-scum power roles, and thinking that there was still an opportunity for there to be unmentioned, scum-based ones. But again, that was just the way I was reading it, so I suppose I don't have any other basis for this. Hmm..wonder if this can be easily cleared up? Pardon me, Idle -- can you confirm or deny the presence of a Godfather role? Well, I suppose you can't confirm, but you can certainly deny it if the list of roles offered up at the beginning covered the possibility of scum powers. What say you?
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Post by Hal Briston on Jun 4, 2012 8:29:11 GMT -5
so we can now assume the scum have two night kills? I'm continuing to operate under the (gut-feeling) assumption that scum have three nightly kills, and that someone was successfully protected last night.
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Post by guiri on Jun 4, 2012 8:31:14 GMT -5
Texcat ~ I still believe texcat is scum. I made my case against her in D3 (I still have catching up to do there as well) I read her post earlier toDay objectively (the 'one of you' being one of the masons) But that doesn't change the rest of my thoughts on her being scum. I will get back to this soon I hope. (as I get time to go back to D3) I get the whole "vote who you think is scummiest", I understand you suspected annem, as do I, but you explicitly stated that you believed texcat to be scum, she was just one vote away from being lynch leader and had a good chance of being lynched yet you placed a one-off vote on annem, why? That's a three way tie with just hours left in the Day. I'd prefer to see Texcat lynched and I note she hasn't posted in 3 days, since she became the lynch leader, laying low. And her first post back was: You have been calling for my death since early on Day1, and yet you had 3 opportunities to kill me and did not do so. Why is that? I can understand Septimus2.0's concern. I figured I had a decent chance of getting you lynched, killing you would have exposed the non-scum killer. Guiri's case on Texcat makes me uneasy, not least because when he made the case he wasn't Town. I can't bring myself to trust that until we know whether Guiri's reincarnation can be trusted. What? When do you expect to know whether I can be trusted? That reminds me of richard, no comment or response to my #132? No vote? This was for richbeckman, possibly he missed it. Guiri makes an interesting case against Texcat. Apparently not interesting enough for you to vote her?
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Post by Suburban Plankton on Jun 4, 2012 8:31:55 GMT -5
Hi guys, remember me?
Sorry, but sometimes shit happens...and a bunch of it happened over the last couple of weeks. Thanks for not killing me...
I'm going to try a speed-read of everything I missed, and I promise I'll actually participate from here on.
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Post by supermel on Jun 4, 2012 8:34:56 GMT -5
Do we know this for certain? I mean, yes, we have all the power roles specified in the setup covered, but...well, I guess in my mind I was looking at that list as non-scum power roles, and thinking that there was still an opportunity for there to be unmentioned, scum-based ones. But again, that was just the way I was reading it, so I suppose I don't have any other basis for this. Hmm..wonder if this can be easily cleared up? Pardon me, Idle -- can you confirm or deny the presence of a Godfather role? Well, I suppose you can't confirm, but you can certainly deny it if the list of roles offered up at the beginning covered the possibility of scum powers. What say you?I must say I am really really enjoying this game, but as a newbie- trying to catch scum, it is near impossible- predicting or musing about roles I know nothing of... I do find it interesting, just hard to be good at this when i feel like i'm playing blind. i am anxious for another round when i start out knowing more...
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Post by wombat99 on Jun 4, 2012 8:56:50 GMT -5
Any thoughts on how many doctors and detectives we started with? What would you expect in a game of this size? (We began with 5 masons, according to the masons).
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Jun 4, 2012 9:05:04 GMT -5
I still think it is Meeko. Vote Meeko I would expect reasons from you, Maha. Perhaps, the fact that you don't have any, should tell you something about your vote on me.
Anyone else concerned that they will read a player's post, and confuse them with another role they were playing this game? How many people have subbed back in? Or, can we go ahead and ignore those players posts completely, in terms of looking for slips and scum motivation?
Would a subbed back in player be more likely to fill in for a Vanilla Town Role than not?
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Post by Hal Briston on Jun 4, 2012 9:54:03 GMT -5
I must say I am really really enjoying this game, but as a newbie- trying to catch scum, it is near impossible- predicting or musing about roles I know nothing of... Understandable -- here's a clarification for the new folks: The Godfather is a scum role where the a member of the mafia team appears respectable. In game terms it means that even though the Godfather is scum, if a Godfather is investigated by a detective the detective will get a "town" result. Obviously, that makes life a lot harder for town and detectives, which is why I reached out to Idle for clarification.
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Post by Rich Beckman on Jun 4, 2012 10:08:31 GMT -5
Weird how the quote button did not call up the entire quote, so I had to reconstruct a bit.... <snip> [navy]Jun 1, 2012, 3:24pm, guiri[/navy] wrote:This was for richbeckman, possibly he missed it. Guiri makes an interesting case against Texcat. Apparently not interesting enough for you to vote her? I was not aware that a response was needed to #132. (Although in retrospect I guess I should have thanked you for withdrawing the smudge...so, thanks) Yes, you explained the smudge, but only because Wombat99 expressed curiosity. And your explanation was preceded in the same post by a cleaning of the smudge in your response to me: [navy] May 30, 2012, 4:40pm Guiri [/navy] wrote:Also, in the middle of the explanation to Wombat, you included this: [navy] May 30, 2012, 4:40pm Guiri [/navy] wrote:which seems to me to be the opposite of a smudge. As to my comment that I wanted to be able to state my reasons for Lianne, well....in explaining the game, many people stress the necessity for explaining one's vote (a necessity that seems to be unfilled as often as not). I felt I actually had solid reasons for my vote that day and I wanted to show my work! As to my comments on the authenticity of Hal, I would point out that I was not the only one to not unquestionably accept his claim. Also, in the first comment I am asking more in the context of Mafia Games in general than about this specific game. Since then, I believe a couple of people have suggested that it is not beyond the realm of possibility that scum would give up two lives for the trade of having a scum player be a "confirmed detective". The second comment on Hal is simply saying that if the expected did happen, then there was no reason to doubt Hal. This does not strike me as an attempt, feeble or otherwise, to cast doubt on Hal. As to the "I told you so" tone, well, I guess that's just me. I can get a bit of that when I was right and people did not listen. On to Texcat. Please note that "interesting" and "convincing" are two different things. I find the case you make interesting because I feel that I do not understand it. (If I do understand it, then I do not think it is much of a case.) I've read it over and over and gone back to read the previous posts referred to and I just can not quite figure it out. A reasonable response from you right now would be "Why did you not just ask?" To which I reply "Well, you do not seem to be that open to questions. A question is what got you started in your suspicions of Texcat and when I asked a question, you smudged me. I want to start that all over again?"
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Post by Mahaloth on Jun 4, 2012 10:42:16 GMT -5
I would expect reasons from you, Maha. Perhaps, the fact that you don't have any, should tell you something about your vote on me. My reasons have not changed from previously.
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Post by wombat99 on Jun 4, 2012 10:53:27 GMT -5
Would a subbed back in player be more likely to fill in for a Vanilla Town Role than not? In other words, were newbie VTs more likely to abandon the game and need replacing? No way to know.
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Post by Hal Briston on Jun 4, 2012 11:06:29 GMT -5
Would a subbed back in player be more likely to fill in for a Vanilla Town Role than not? In other words, were newbie VTs more likely to abandon the game and need replacing? No way to know. There will be a certain percentage who were doomed to walk away from the start. They signed up simply to meet the PackRat requirement (although I don't know how much actual gameplay was required to meet the PR goal), but walked about without really caring about the game or their role. These folks could be any role at all. I would think that those who stayed on and looked around for a bit before walking away are equally likely to be either Vanilla Town or Scum. If they were VT, they would likely (mistakenly) think "Oh, I'm not important to the game, so I'm going to hang back for now" and never really get into it. If they were Scum, then the thought is likely either "I don't want to be on the bad guy team" or "this team has a lot fewer players, so each is important, but I don't want to screw anything up so I'll just hang back for now". Of course, "hanging back for now" usually leads to dropping out completely. If I had to pick a type who would be least likely vanish, it would be Town Power Role players -- you've got something interesting to work with, meaning you're more likely to stay involved. Of course, some might find the responsibility offputting, so it's by no means a lock that a TPR wouldn't drop out. So all in all, there's probably not much to be gained by trying to figure things out based on replacement players.
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Post by Pleonast on Jun 4, 2012 11:51:58 GMT -5
To your first point towards me, how is it not useful to investigate a claimed power role? Right now, it is simply just that, a claim, with nothing or no one to back it up. We should all just believe anyone who makes a power role claim and never give them a second glance? Not me It's not as useful to investigate a claimed power role because we will have other information to evaluate them. Sure, an investigation of a claimed power role is somewhat useful, but it's more useful to investigate someone we have nothing on. Who would we rather be investigated: a player who's made a claim and will be giving an account of their actions sooner or later, or a player who's given us nothing? I prefer the latter. Your spin on my contributions are so wrong, I don't see the need to discuss this any longer. Other players can see for themselves my discussions and votes. Huh. You say you believe texcat is scum, and that the two other players near the vote lead you think are town. But then, instead of voting to lynch the player you think is scum and not lynch the players you think are not, you put your vote on another player who's not at all close to being lynched. That stinks like scum. vote starrirainfor not voting to lynch someone they say is scum over two other players they say are not, when all three are in a close tie. It sounds like you want to deny responsibility for lynching town but claim credit if texcat comes up scum. Without doing anything to actually further that. I think Pleonast might be onto something with the number of scum and the night kill in Day 4. 4 scum have been killed, and it seems that there was only 2 kills last Night. So I want to say that there are 8 scum left. Are you sure it's me your thinking of? My original estimate of the number of scum was 15. With more recent information, I'm not sure. I don't think the rules are clear enough to make a reasonable estimate. And I agree that it is time for detectives to claim. We need something concrete to go on Tomorrow. That's lazy-player thinking. While investigations are very helpful, if we need them to win, we're probably screwed anyway. Vote records and discussions are the only reliable ways to catch scum. And we're only in Day Five of a huge game. It's still early. Pleonast- want to reveal if you actually have a power, as you suggested on Night 0. I'd prefer to wait until mid-game. But since we've lost another Doctor, I think it's better to reveal results before ToNight. I'm a Detective. I got a town result on Nights One, Two and Four. I didn't get a result on Night Three because I was out of it. Sorry. At first, I was thinking to wait until the end of the Day to reveal the names. And I think I should reveal before Night, so a Night kill can't prevent the reveal. However, I don't see any reason to wait to reveal townie results, so here they are. N1: supemel is town. N2: dottiebob is town. Which means the new michelehunter is town, if my notes are correct. N3: - N4: jlrinmke is town. I was trying to pick players who didn't have many contributions, and new players (or new to me, at least), since I think new players are more likely to get mislynched. Anyone else concerned that they will read a player's post, and confuse them with another role they were playing this game? How many people have subbed back in? Since we disagree so much, it's only fair to point out when I definitely agree with Meeko. (I still want to lynch you this game, by the way. ) My reasons have not changed from previously. That's nice. Can you restate them, or link back to them, so we don't have to go searching through many pages? You'll convince more players if they can easily read why you're voting.
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Post by Hal Briston on Jun 4, 2012 12:23:54 GMT -5
Well, looks like we're getting a good list of confirmed*-town going.
I'll add to that by letting you know I was inspired by Meeko's paranoia and took a look at colby11 last night. He's town as well.
*As in "someone claiming detective has confirmed them".
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Post by Hal Briston on Jun 4, 2012 12:38:17 GMT -5
Just to update the player list with those who have been at least somewhat confirmed:
2. Pleonast 3. gnarlycharlie 4. mahaloth - MASON 5. Suburban Plankton 7. Texcat 8. CatinaSuit 9. Archangel 11. Cathi 13. jlrinmke - TOWN (as investigated by Pleonast) 14. phoenixphyre 19. supermel - TOWN (as investigated by Pleonast) 20. kagemoto 21. dizzymrslizzy 22. crys 24. annetastic 25. wombat99 27. Silver Jan - MASON 28. Meeko 29. AmyKB 30. Septimus 32. JustBeingGinger 33. Total Ulla 34. Inner Stickler. 36. aleetha 37. susanmurphy 38. richbeckman 39. Patricia 40. cassipietz 41. Colby11 - TOWN (as investigated by Hal Briston) 42. guiri 43. jerelijah 45. mistde 47. Hal Briston 48. Michelehunter - TOWN (as investigated by Pleonast) 50. LadyRogue 51. Starrirain 53. annem 56. Suits101 58. Paranoia 60. Oldred - TOWN (as investigated by Hal Briston)
If I'm missing anyone, by all means, update away.
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Post by supermel on Jun 4, 2012 13:27:30 GMT -5
Interesting. By being named on that list- does that make me an easier target for scum night killing? Or does it make me less of a target as its obvious i'm vanilla and thus no threat?
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Post by Pleonast on Jun 4, 2012 13:48:14 GMT -5
Interesting. By being named on that list- does that make me an easier target for scum night killing? Or does it make me less of a target as its obvious i'm vanilla and thus no threat? I only got a "town" result, I don't know your role. You are more likely to be Night-killed, which is why I'd preferred to wait until later in the game to reveal. There's now lots of obvious targets for scum, so there's some safety in numbers. Best be good to get out your thoughts before each Dawn.
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Post by Pleonast on Jun 4, 2012 13:50:19 GMT -5
If I'm missing anyone, by all means, update away. It should be obvious to anyone paying attention, but you should probably mark us as "claimed DETECTIVE", for those players skimming along.
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Post by dizzymrslizzy on Jun 4, 2012 13:50:34 GMT -5
Okay so here's my extrapolation of the 4 days of data: Players who have voted 3 or more confirmed town players: Player | # of votes | Annem | Lady, Mchelle, Lady | SuperMel | Lady, Wombat, Lady | Kagemoto | Lady, Mchelle, Lady |
Only Mel has been confirmed Town above. But something to explore. Players who have voted 2 confirmed Town Members: Player | Pleo | Archangel | Cathi | CatInASuit | Crys | Jlrinnmke | Meeko | Dizzy | Phoenixphyre |
I don't know if chart 2 really tells us anything since there were two lynched Town players. And for a little Town Credibility: Players who have voted for only Scum: Player | Vote Record | Hal | 3 scum votes, 1 no vote | GnarlyCharlie | 2 votes, 2 no vote | SusanMurphy | 3 scum votes, 1 unknown |
(I counted the PFK as a scum-esq player in the 3rd table)
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