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Post by Rich Beckman on Sept 17, 2012 10:42:40 GMT -5
One thing is probable. Pleonast will be the subject of much debate in the first day. My money (not that I have any) says that is his primary objective. explain the motivation, however. He likes to be the center of attention. Oh! Game motivation? Beats me. He has made comments in the past about how the early claim makes the game more fun for him, which is an outside the game motivation. Notice how we are all talking about him....
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Post by peekercpa on Sept 17, 2012 10:46:07 GMT -5
explain the motivation, however. He likes to be the center of attention. Oh! Game motivation? Beats me. He has made comments in the past about how the early claim makes the game more fun for him, which is an outside the game motivation. Notice how we are all talking about him.... holy shit. you make sense and have gotten to the core. that deal with the spice girl is definitely on.
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Merestil Haye
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Post by Merestil Haye on Sept 17, 2012 10:47:56 GMT -5
See, that's my question for everyone jumping on Pleo. Explain to me how a scum pleo would think this is a good idea? My memory says that, some time after Pleo had got into the habit of early claims, he went one game without one. This drew suspicious eyes, and he wa lynched. He was in fact Mafia-aligned. His Mafia-aligned motive would be "I'd claim if I were Townie, and I need to play as if I'm Townie." On the other hand, read Arkham Revisited Day 1. He early claimed The Joker - truthfully. Really, if you're voting for Pleo (or announcing the intention to do so) because he claimed now, you're jumping the gun. If, on the other hand, the vote is because of the substance of Pleo's claim, feel free to decide to vote him. [quoteI think y'all are jumping the gun. It's not even Day 1, ferthecryinoutloud.[/quote]That I agree with. Voting can wait until Day.
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Post by guiri on Sept 17, 2012 10:48:31 GMT -5
See, that's my question for everyone jumping on Pleo. Explain to me how a scum pleo would think this is a good idea? I think y'all are jumping the gun. It's not even Day 1, ferthecryinoutloud. His power/wincon don't match and the game already has a mechanism for dealing with lurkers (the penalty votes) so, unless Pollux is messing with him, he's lied about his role. Why? A. Pleo's a jester and wants to be lynched B. Pleo's some sort of Scotsman or is lynch immune and wants to attract votes: - to get closer to wincon - to cover for a buddy who's bid agressively for the mercenary - to distract our attention from someone else C. Pleo may be a hostile third-party and gets powered up by votes D. Pleo needs to claim something at the beginning of every game and didn't think this one through very well (OK, that's probably the least likely given his conspiracy rule making)
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Sept 17, 2012 10:49:43 GMT -5
Suggested Role ListAlice (Wonderland Mafia) Anti-Vigilante (Unspecified Game) Ash (Evil Dead Mafia) Ben Gunn (Pirate Mafia) Chia Bingo Manager (Asylum Lane) Deadeye Dick (Pirate Mafia) Death of Rats (Halloween Mafia) Generic Homicidal Maniac (Halloween Mafia) Jesus Christ, Serial Killer (NSFW Mafia) Joker (Return to Arkham Mafia) Master of the Deck of Dragons (Malazan Mafia) Necromancer (Conspiracy Mafia) Sander Cohen (Bioshock Mafia) Solomon Grundy (Return to Arkham Mafia) Speculator (Blade Runner Mafia) The Demon (Hill House Mafia) The Riddler (Arkham Knights Mafia) War (Apocalypse Mafia) Zeddicus (Halloween Mafia) Zhang Bao (Three Kingdoms Mafia) Pleonast doesn't have one of these roles? Pitty. ---- There is no need to debate anything. Simply vote Pleonast. Oh there is no rationale? No reason to vote Pleonast? Certainly, vote he who does things without reason, without reason. Pleonast wants us to play his game? Ok, not using reason is in. His claim, as such, proves as much. Let us then follow suit with voting for him, also without reason. Pleonast is totally "that guy". God forbid if you are Facebook friends with him, get behind him in traffic -blinkers, turn signals, have you heard of them? And the bane of my existence, he takes 14 items down the 10 item express lane.
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Sept 17, 2012 10:54:26 GMT -5
As this game does draw from past games, is there precedent for an anti lurker role? Me thinks Pleonast over-extended once too many times. Bonus, we can prove it in a gastard game. That would be icing on the cake.
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Post by Inner Stickler on Sept 17, 2012 10:55:05 GMT -5
A. Pleo's a jester and wants to be lynched B. Pleo's some sort of Scotsman or is lynch immune and wants to attract votes: - to get closer to wincon - to cover for a buddy who's bid agressively for the mercenary - to distract our attention from someone else C. Pleo may be a hostile third-party and gets powered up by votes D. Pleo needs to claim something at the beginning of every game and didn't think this one through very well (OK, that's probably the least likely given his conspiracy rule making) So then my question to you is why are you planning to vote for him? Looks to me like you're doing exactly what you posit he wants.
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Sept 17, 2012 10:58:08 GMT -5
See, that's my question for everyone jumping on Pleo. Explain to me how a scum pleo would think this is a good idea? My memory says that, some time after Pleo had got into the habit of early claims, he went one game without one. This drew suspicious eyes, and he wa lynched. He was in fact Mafia-aligned. His Mafia-aligned motive would be "I'd claim if I were Townie, and I need to play as if I'm Townie." On the other hand, read Arkham Revisited Day 1. He early claimed The Joker - truthfully. Really, if you're voting for Pleo (or announcing the intention to do so) because he claimed now, you're jumping the gun. If, on the other hand, the vote is because of the substance of Pleo's claim, feel free to decide to vote him. [quoteI think y'all are jumping the gun. It's not even Day 1, ferthecryinoutloud. That I agree with. Voting can wait until Day.[/quote] Merestil do you have knowledge of Pleonast's claim in marathon mafia? I would like you comments on that.
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Post by guiri on Sept 17, 2012 11:00:16 GMT -5
So then my question to you is why are you planning to vote for him? Looks to me like you're doing exactly what you posit he wants. (Pre-)Voting a liar is a gut reaction.
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Post by guiri on Sept 17, 2012 11:01:33 GMT -5
(Pre-)Voting a liar is a gut reaction. Or jerk reflex.
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Sept 17, 2012 11:01:38 GMT -5
Still, wouldn't there be some type of .... Litmus for how much of a post is a post?
What's stopping Pleonast from just being a "This" machine?
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Sept 17, 2012 11:02:38 GMT -5
(Pre-)Voting a liar is a gut reaction. Or jerk reflex. The jerk reflexed first. Ours came after. It's a jerk-reflex reflex.
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Post by scáthach on Sept 17, 2012 11:04:53 GMT -5
One last thing! While The Mercenary is alive and participating in the game, every player will get two votes to cast during the Day! My bolding. This kind of worries me - if the mercenary is a player and not just a game mechanic, what would his win condition be? Is there a risk in hiring him? Presumably he has some other abilities rather than just being directed by the highest bidder.
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Post by Meeko on Sept 17, 2012 11:06:33 GMT -5
I BET PLEONAST WON THE MERC TODAY.
HENCE, HE DOESN'T WANT VOTES.
LEAVE IT TO HIM TO DO A CLAIM, CRAFTED TO THIS END.
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Sept 17, 2012 11:07:55 GMT -5
One last thing! While The Mercenary is alive and participating in the game, every player will get two votes to cast during the Day! My bolding. This kind of worries me - if the mercenary is a player and not just a game mechanic, what would his win condition be? Is there a risk in hiring him? Presumably he has some other abilities rather than just being directed by the highest bidder. Or, Pleonast is the Merc. This would be eerily similar to a scum claiming dick.
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Post by Inner Stickler on Sept 17, 2012 11:22:40 GMT -5
So then my question to you is why are you planning to vote for him? Looks to me like you're doing exactly what you posit he wants. (Pre-)Voting a liar is a gut reaction. I will agree that there appears to be a mismatch between the point of his powers and his claimed wincon but I don't see why that means we should jump right to killing him.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 17, 2012 11:23:44 GMT -5
Wow, some of you don't even pretend to not hold grudges.
It should be obvious why I claimed. It should be obvious why any non-hostile third-party should claim early. A non-hostile third-party doesn't hurt town; it's a mislynch to lynch us. A non-hostile third-party doesn't hurt scum; it's a waste to a Night-kill to kill us. The only third-parties that have something to lose are those that are hostile. Thus, any third-party claiming under lynch pressure is probably hostile. Hence, non-hostile third-parties should claim early.
And take my claim in particular. My powers are useless against anyone who posts more than little. I'm not a threat to anyone who's playing the game actively.
And yet some players want to lead the town down the same path that the town took in the last Arkham game. They lynched non-win-stealing third-parties the first two Days. Not only 1) did those lynches not further the town's win condition, 2) they made advanced the scum win condition, 3) they gave no information to help find scum in the voting record, 4) they discouraged the remaining third-parties from trying to help town, AND 5) they removed from the game power-roles who were trying to help town (remember, town probably can't win by themselves if there's many non-hostile third-parties, because of balancing). Town lost that game, not surprisingly.
Try thinking rationally, instead of jumping on the "must kill Pleo because I don't like how they play" bandwagon. Heck, I can even confirm myself, if you guys want. Total waste of my power, when I'm sure someone else could confirm me. But if you want to burn your face in spite of your nose, go ahead.
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Merestil Haye
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Post by Merestil Haye on Sept 17, 2012 11:24:05 GMT -5
Merestil do you have knowledge of Pleonast's claim in marathon mafia? I would like you comments on that. That was a long slog, and my memory is hazy. I subbed in on Day 2 or 3, played for maybe three Days and then was Nightkilled. Pleo was alive all that time, I think. His claim came before I joined, and his exposure after I died. Pleo's early claim is a null tell (for Pleo). The fact of the claim offers no clue as to his alignment, as he would claim early regardless of alignment, and indeed examples exist of his early claim as Town, Mafia and Third Party. Analyse his claim, and vote for him or not based on what he has claimed. I think you're carrying that game into this. You're intending to vote for him because of a knee-jerk reaction; "Pleo claimed early in one game and happened to be Mafiate. His claim this time is for the same reason." That feels like a grudge.
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Post by KidVermicious on Sept 17, 2012 11:28:04 GMT -5
I BET PLEONAST WON THE MERC TODAY. HENCE, HE DOESN'T WANT VOTES. LEAVE IT TO HIM TO DO A CLAIM, CRAFTED TO THIS END. Dude, it isn't Today yet. You guys need to slow down. Pleo claims early on a regular basis. It's not a scum-tell, it's not a town-tell, it's just proof that he hasn't been bodysnatched. It's a Pleo-tell. Give it time for his claim to play out. He's not going to win Day One, so relax.
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Merestil Haye
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Post by Merestil Haye on Sept 17, 2012 11:33:25 GMT -5
I think you're carrying that game into this. You're intending to vote for him because of a knee-jerk reaction; "Pleo claimed early in one game and happened to be Mafiate. His claim this time is for the same reason." That feels like a grudge. O reflection, although it feels like a grudge, it's probably not. My memory says Meeko was one of the more tenacious players in pursuit of Pleo. It's still carrying a previous game over to this one.
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Post by Suburban Plankton on Sept 17, 2012 11:43:56 GMT -5
One last thing! While The Mercenary is alive and participating in the game, every player will get two votes to cast during the Day! My bolding. This kind of worries me - if the mercenary is a player and not just a game mechanic, what would his win condition be? Is there a risk in hiring him? Presumably he has some other abilities rather than just being directed by the highest bidder. If the Mercenary is a Player (which the description certainly implies), I wonder if he can vote to retain himself?
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Post by peekercpa on Sept 17, 2012 12:10:11 GMT -5
(Pre-)Voting a liar is a gut reaction. Or jerk reflex. well you are a lot of things guiri but jerk is not one of the descriptives i would use.
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Post by Pollux Oil on Sept 17, 2012 12:12:16 GMT -5
Night Zero's over now. You can continue this conversation in the Day One thread.
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Post by peekercpa on Sept 17, 2012 12:21:38 GMT -5
and i agree that we are N0 so probably any votes will be voided when D1 commences but i still think this interaction (since we all know what in the world we are) is productive.
pleo is being pleo. so that is a null tell. but i don't think we should discount the fact that it does look contradictitory.
and misgivings about voting for someone because of a perceived negative impact really feels odd. if that's the way the game is set up let it be. i'd rather make the right decision and get a bad result than ah fuck it.
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Post by peekercpa on Sept 17, 2012 12:22:47 GMT -5
(Pre-)Voting a liar is a gut reaction. I will agree that there appears to be a mismatch between the point of his powers and his claimed wincon but I don't see why that means we should jump right to killing him. liars skate?
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Post by peekercpa on Sept 17, 2012 12:27:46 GMT -5
... it's a mislynch to lynch us. A non-hostile third-party doesn't hurt scum; it's a waste to a Night-kill to kill us. <snipped> does the us mean that you have additional knowledge of various other players and that they are aligned with you? because that doesn't feel all warm and fuzzy to me.
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