Colby11
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Creator of Hell's Kitchen Mafia
Posts: 1,193
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Post by Colby11 on Oct 4, 2012 23:08:32 GMT -5
and if colby wants to cut in line that be just fine with me. Cut in line? Sorry, I'm not standing in line for the IPhone 6....
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Meeko
FGM
I raccoon it's time to play Mafia
Posts: 2,474
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Post by Meeko on Oct 4, 2012 23:28:19 GMT -5
Testing something
Peeker
Ironman. Deadpool. Ironman. Deadpool.
Do you hate shoes?
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Post by gnarlycharlie on Oct 5, 2012 0:50:41 GMT -5
i think it's pretty obvious that the gastard part is that majority of us are 3rd party. Vote: JustBeingGinger [/color][/quote] Gnarly does this mean you are 3rd party?[/quote] it means majority of us are 3rd party. there were 29 players. if we believe Red Skeezix, there originally were 7 town and 5 scum, we now have 4 to 5 town and 5 scum left. the remaning players would then be 3rd party. so why are you fishing? Examples? By my count he had a theory that Peeker was killed by some sort of nexus power. That is not an answer, it is a theory, unless you know something the rest of us don't? Also if you know he knows everything, that mean you also know everything... There were two examples from yesterday. The first was the whole Nexus thing. His theory seemed way more advanced then what a "normal" person would know. I said this yesterday. The second, I'll have to go back for: It had to do with Pizza and his random hidden messages for the Town Vig. He said (and I can't quote it for some reason) <snipped> I'm not sure where he got the knowledge for this post. Because it's not information that "I" have, and doesn't seem like information that was common knowledge. Several posts later Pizza said basically the same thing, confirming Inner's previous "thoughts" It was a bit too convenient for me. I personally don't have any extra information. I have no clue if Inner is blowing smoke up our rear ends, or if he really knows something the rest of us don't. I'd just like an explanation. i don't see the case on Inner. he made some suppositions, nothing more. if they turn out to be true, i'll revisit this argument. but for now he's in my Town list. Colby has been pinging me. i can't quite tell why. my gut tells me to Vote: Colby
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Colby11
Administrator
Creator of Hell's Kitchen Mafia
Posts: 1,193
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Post by Colby11 on Oct 5, 2012 1:10:14 GMT -5
It isn't your vote against Inner that I was taking issue with, Peeker. I can't take issue with your vote on Inner because you've never explained why you're making it in the first place. The vote I was taking issue with was Colby's, as he justifies it (at least in part) with the judgement that Inner is playing angrily. Colby also doesn't really douch on the debate of why Inner's vote on Guiri was somehow the lynchpin of the crap that led to a dead Town Doc on Day 2. It seemed like you were backing Colby's vapor-case because nothing in this game is certain, so I was kinda responding to you both at once, but for different reasons. I'll just pick up where I left off yesterday with KidV and add Colby to the mix now too. Vote KidV Vote Colby[/b][/quote] So, gnarly got a feeling (the black eyed peas are singing in the background) and Cookies says that my case is weak.... I respect what Rabid Cookies has said, and will build a better case on Inner.
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Post by Silver Jan on Oct 5, 2012 1:38:21 GMT -5
I have a feeling that someone wants me gone , I was given a very creepy doll last Night. First I was cursed and then the doll, what's up with that? Vote JustBeingGinger
For editing her PM, why would Town do that? I did pick up the point that if she was scum they would have corrected her but that still leaves the point that she could be a hostile 3rd Party.
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Post by Askthepizzaguy on Oct 5, 2012 1:47:27 GMT -5
I was roleblocked, no further objections to Ginger's lynch. Can't prove squat if I'm roleblocked.
Vote JustbeingGinger
Vote dizzymrslizzy for calling me arrogant. I don't care what alignment you are at this point, just die.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 5, 2012 1:48:38 GMT -5
Everyone gets a cookie for not pointing and laughing at my douche typo.
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Post by Silver Jan on Oct 5, 2012 2:29:43 GMT -5
Everyone gets a cookie for not pointing and laughing at my douche typo. Haha, "d's" "t's" hmmm
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Post by JustBeingGinger on Oct 5, 2012 5:45:16 GMT -5
JustBeingGinger, I have a question about your Power: If I understand your claim correctly, it works like this: You pardon someone, so that instead of being lynched, they are 'jailed' for the next Night/Day period. At the end of that next Day, you choose to have them live or die. What happens if you are killed that Night, while the player is in 'jail'? Do they live? Do they die? Do they turn into a cat? To answer this, well I have no idea. I didn't think of that. I am not sure which would supersede the other. I will ask the mod and get back to you.
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Post by dizzymrslizzy on Oct 5, 2012 7:07:26 GMT -5
I was roleblocked, no further objections to Ginger's lynch. Can't prove squat if I'm roleblocked. Vote JustbeingGinger Vote dizzymrslizzy for calling me arrogant. I don't care what alignment you are at this point, just die. LOL, a little OMGUS there Pizza. Maybe you don't see how you are coming across, or you don't care, but that's my take, you were over the top yesterDay with your "If you push me I'm going to the grave with my secrets" That's arrogant to me. I don't know what else to call it. Here have a little wine, and calm the eff down....it's a game.
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Post by storyteller0910 on Oct 5, 2012 7:47:16 GMT -5
Well, so, here we are.
I don't object to a JustBeingGinger lynch - I keep going in circles around it and can't see a reasonable sequence of events that would lead to her changing her designation from "hostile" to "non-hostile" that is consistent with her claimed alignment.
vote JustBeingGinger
That said, I'd really like to consider some other folks toDay, if only because the Day's going to get boring otherwise.
Based on Pleo's flip, I am withdrawing previous suspicion of Inner Stickler. I had a number of theories about why Inner might be trying (from my perspective) so hard to save Pleonast, but the flip pretty much obviates those. I mean, there's still the possibility that Inner is Scum and knew Pleo was not and thus thought defending him would earn him points when the latter flipped... but there's no more evidence of that explanation than of any number of other less sinister explanations. So no Inner Stickler vote from me.
YesterDay, I had some concerns about the case against pizzaguy, and then I encountered the New Jersey health care system and got distracted. I'm going to start there, and see where things go.
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Post by gnarlycharlie on Oct 5, 2012 8:12:32 GMT -5
I was roleblocked, no further objections to Ginger's lynch. Can't prove squat if I'm roleblocked. Vote JustbeingGinger Vote dizzymrslizzy for calling me arrogant. I don't care what alignment you are at this point, just die. LOL, a little OMGUS there Pizza. Maybe you don't see how you are coming across, or you don't care, but that's my take, you were over the top yesterDay with your "If you push me I'm going to the grave with my secrets" That's arrogant to me. I don't know what else to call it. Here have a little wine, and calm the eff down....it's a game. OMGUS? probably. he thinks it's a viable tactic. is he pissed at you? nope. he's being overly dramatic as usual. ;D
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Post by dizzymrslizzy on Oct 5, 2012 8:52:06 GMT -5
Lol gnarly. I have a 4 yr old. Extreme drama doesn't phase me
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Post by storyteller0910 on Oct 5, 2012 8:54:57 GMT -5
Just re-read all of Day Two, and I think I'm much less at sea than I was before. I was going to do a lengthy recap, even wrote one out, but I think the content's going to get lost, so here's a summary:
1. I owe Inner Stickler a public apology for my posts toward him toward the end of the day. I still disagree with his decision to vote for guiri when he did, but I unreservedly withdraw the rest of it.
2. Regarding pizzaguy. I want to say that I don’t think that what he has done qualifies as “magic bagging.” That term was originally coined to describe a player who says, “I know something amazing, but I won’t tell you any of it... maybe tomorrow I’ll show you what’s in my magic bag! Ha-ha!” What pizzaguy did was the opposite of that: he showed us what was in the bag – the information he thought was useful – while declining to elaborate further. If he is Town or sympathetic to Town, this is exactly what he should be doing – keeping the secrets that it is beneficial to keep while sharing the things that it is beneficial to share. I'm not the first or even the second person to make this point, but I want to emphasize it.
Having re-read, I'm willing to provisionally accept pizzaguy as Town (or third party sympathetic to Town and with a Town-friendly wincon). Few of his actions make even the slightest sense from a Scum perspective.
I disliked the votes against him generally. Some of the later votes centered more around pizza's talk about JustBeingGinger, but it was the earlier votes that bugged. dizzymrslizzy's vote, the third on pizza, bothers me most. She just claims that his approach (revealing some information but not all) is “anti-Town,” without explaining why, or even acknowledging the several other posters making essentially the point I made just above.
3. Colby continues to make votes that seem like opportunism to me. His early vote for Pleonast, uniquely among the many votes for Pleo, seemed like a classic bandwagon vote - he just threw it out there, adding a strange justification (that Pleo didn't have a character name).
4. Meeko, toDay, has made perfect sense. I have not always agreed with his points, but they have been understandable to me. I am not yet sure whether this is (a) a reason to trust Meeko; (b) a reason to be suspicious of Meeko; or (c) a sign that I need clozapine.
5. It is clear that a discussion of the merc may be warranted. Some players seem to view even bidding for the merc as inherently suspicious. I do not. I view the merc as being a big red button that says: push me. Some players are going to want to push that button, even if it is dangerous, even if it is unwise, because it's a game and the button is big and red. I think the kinds of players who want to push the button will want to push it no matter what alignment they are issued. That's why I am generally willing to protect merc bidders who get caught out, in the absence of other compelling evidence that they should be lynched - because I don't view bidding on the merc as evidence of anything at all.
But I'm open to other opinions.
vote colby11
I want to look more closely at dizzymrslizzy and at colby himself, but it'll have to wait until later tonight.
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Post by Rich Beckman on Oct 5, 2012 9:23:26 GMT -5
Things do look bad for Ginger. Her posting an edited PM was forced and then she denied editing it. An aside. I am a little confused why she was in such a rush to post it. She arrived to play the game at 1:13 pm Monday She posts her PM on Wednesday at 9:40 am when Night Two still had 28 hours to go. [/aside] I am curious about PizzaGuy's comment that he was role blocked when he attempted to do whatever it was he was trying to do to Ginger (sounds like he was investigating, but since he has refrained from such language...) I was roleblocked, no further objections to Ginger's lynch. Can't prove squat if I'm roleblocked. <snip> Unless her PM is a compete fabrication, it does not sound like she could role block herself. Are there any innocent explanations for the role block? The only one that comes to my mind is if PizzaGuy is lying about it. In the meantime Vote: JustBeingGinger
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Post by Rich Beckman on Oct 5, 2012 9:36:46 GMT -5
I wonder if the Merc even knows he or she is the Merc. Seems like the whole concept works fine without the player's knowledge.
Also, it seems we have all forgotten this little tidbit:
So, if guiri was Town, what does that make KidV?
Vote: KidVermicious
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 5, 2012 9:40:06 GMT -5
Apology accepted and mine is offered in return.
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Post by JustBeingGinger on Oct 5, 2012 9:53:48 GMT -5
Things do look bad for Ginger. Her posting an edited PM was forced and then she denied editing it. An aside. I am a little confused why she was in such a rush to post it. She arrived to play the game at 1:13 pm Monday She posts her PM on Wednesday at 9:40 am when Night Two still had 28 hours to go. [/aside] I am curious about PizzaGuy's comment that he was role blocked when he attempted to do whatever it was he was trying to do to Ginger (sounds like he was investigating, but since he has refrained from such language...) I was roleblocked, no further objections to Ginger's lynch. Can't prove squat if I'm roleblocked. <snip> Unless her PM is a compete fabrication, it does not sound like she could role block herself. Are there any innocent explanations for the role block? The only one that comes to my mind is if PizzaGuy is lying about it. In the meantime Vote: JustBeingGinger [/color] [/quote] I have a lot going on in my life right now, major move, getting married, 5 yr old but I don't ever remember saying that I didn't edit my PM and I never denied it. I even came clean to say I did edit it... Please help me in recalling my denial of it and where I said I didn't edit it to begin with. I will go back and look at when I claimed, but... I already explained why I claimed. I thought about it. Knowing I am town, and with just my title out there, I wanted to explain it. Think about it for a minute. What side of the law is a Judge, normally the good guys. What side of the law is a jury, the good ones. What side of the law is a executioner. good ones with a very bad job. So let's break this down, Scum know I am not scum, that's a fact jack... Could I be a 3rd party? Maybe but how would my powers help me win? I really cannot kill anyone that was already not about to be lynched. I can save someone whom I have no idea really of their alignment and typically the wincon for 3rd party is to just survive or get recruited to which ever team... I really cannot be last one standing with my powers at work. I am town. Being town, I have the chance to possibly save a mis-lynch and pardon someone that I think is town or kill them. I could not just leave my title out there. It was really not a pro-town thing of Pleo by just putting out my title. With him not knowing that I was town, he basically outed a power role. Like I said before Judge, Jury and executioner does not sound like just plain ole vanilla town. You don't think that no one was going to ask me about it and then me not answering info would of looked scummy... It was a double edge sword so to speak.
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Post by BillMc on Oct 5, 2012 10:05:16 GMT -5
The (three) Peacekeepers, in Total War, had a shared wincon. They could not win with either Town or Mafia. One of them was in fact a traitor to the Mafia. To that extent, these Peacekeeprs are not like the originals in Total War. Scathach is listed as a nonhostile third party, so she did not prevent a Town or Mafia win, while poor Wombat 99 (she's a girl Wombat, by the way) is listed as Town. The Peacekeepers did not win at the expense of town or scum -- if the peacekeepers had won, everyone would have won (except for a couple of folk whose wincons were to kill the peacekeepers) I need some time to re-read, but pending that: Vote: Ginger I can't fathom why, if she is town and truthful, why she felt the need to edit her PM from Hostile to Non-Hostile Vote: Colby same gut feeling reasons as yesterday.
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Post by Rich Beckman on Oct 5, 2012 10:06:23 GMT -5
<snip> I have a lot going on in my life right now, major move, getting married, 5 yr old but I don't ever remember saying that I didn't edit my PM and I never denied it. I even came clean to say I did edit it... Please help me in recalling my denial of it and where I said I didn't edit it to begin with. I will go back and look at when I claimed, but... <snip> Sorry. That is my mistake. You are correct. You never denied the edit.
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Post by Rich Beckman on Oct 5, 2012 10:16:37 GMT -5
[green]Regarding the Mercenary, you wrote
Does Town constitute "an allied group with the same win condition" for the purpose of the quoted statement?[/green]
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Post by Suburban Plankton on Oct 5, 2012 10:19:56 GMT -5
I was roleblocked, no further objections to Ginger's lynch. Can't prove squat if I'm roleblocked. Vote JustbeingGingerVote dizzymrslizzy for calling me arrogant. I don't care what alignment you are at this point, just die. Are you implying that you were blocked by Ginger? Because that's certainly what I'm inferring from your first statement. And your vote on lizzy is a piece of crap, but you already know that. It's right in line with your random votes yesterDay.
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Post by Sister Coyote on Oct 5, 2012 10:21:27 GMT -5
I may still vote Ginger but I haven't quite settled on whether or not I believe she's Hostile Third Party or just someone confused by the Hostile/non-Hostile designation. vote: ColbyI don't like his votes and there's something heavily pinging me about this part of his first post of the day: Based on how the night kills went, I assume someone did go after KidV, and he blocked that kill with his protection. Also, it seems someone protected Peeker, and was able to bring him back. There is a role in Conspiracy that can do this (Witchdoctor, I think)
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Post by Sister Coyote on Oct 5, 2012 10:22:37 GMT -5
I don't think Pizza meant to imply that at all, just that he can't prove things one way or another if he can't act.
Of course, I could be wrong, what with not being pizza and all.
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Post by Suburban Plankton on Oct 5, 2012 10:31:55 GMT -5
I wonder if the Merc even knows he or she is the Merc. Seems like the whole concept works fine without the player's knowledge. Also, it seems we have all forgotten this little tidbit: So, if guiri was Town, what does that make KidV? Vote: KidVermicious But it doesn't prove he's Scum. Do you have a particular reason to think he's Scum/Hostile Third Party? Or are you just voting him on a "He's definitely not Town" basis? And I'm not 100% certain from reading that rule that the restriction applies to "Town". In his examples, Pollux gives us Scum (obviously an 'an allied group with the same win condition'), Third Party Groups (not Third Party players), and Masons (a specific subset of Town), but not "Town" as a whole. O Great and Benevolent Mod,
Is there a blanket restriction that makes it impossible for two Town players win the Mercenary's services on consecutive Nights, provided that they are not 'affiliated' with each other (as in the example case of Masons)?
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Post by Suburban Plankton on Oct 5, 2012 10:33:49 GMT -5
And..on posting, I see that Rich already noticed what he had possible overlooked and asked the Mod the same question I just did.
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Post by JustBeingGinger on Oct 5, 2012 10:41:28 GMT -5
The (three) Peacekeepers, in Total War, had a shared wincon. They could not win with either Town or Mafia. One of them was in fact a traitor to the Mafia. To that extent, these Peacekeeprs are not like the originals in Total War. Scathach is listed as a nonhostile third party, so she did not prevent a Town or Mafia win, while poor Wombat 99 (she's a girl Wombat, by the way) is listed as Town. The Peacekeepers did not win at the expense of town or scum -- if the peacekeepers had won, everyone would have won (except for a couple of folk whose wincons were to kill the peacekeepers) I need some time to re-read, but pending that: Vote: Ginger [/color] I can't fathom why, if she is town and truthful, why she felt the need to edit her PM from Hostile to Non-Hostile Vote: Colby [/color] same gut feeling reasons as yesterday. [/quote] Because I had no idea what hostile mean't versus non-hostile in the world of town. It is my fault for not reading where it stated what it mean't. I didn't know how to explain it if it came up. I almost want to be be lynch so I can say that Bill got one wrong! Ginger does make mistakes...
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Post by Suburban Plankton on Oct 5, 2012 11:05:32 GMT -5
Because I had no idea what hostile mean't versus non-hostile in the world of town. It is my fault for not reading where it stated what it mean't. I didn't know how to explain it if it came up. I almost want to be be lynch so I can say that Bill got one wrong! Ginger does make mistakes... See, that's the part that doesn't make sense. If you're Town, then you should know you have nothing to fear by posting your PM as written. And if it didn't seem to make sense, then the logical thing to do would be to PM the Mod and ask for clarification, rather than simply figuring "the Mod must have screwed up; I'll go ahead and fix it for him". The only reason you're getting any slack on this at all is because it does seem that you did actually forget about this game and therefore were trying to quickly get caught up, which makes it more plausible that you would make a mistake like this. On the other hand, I can't see how someone would not clarify their PM first thing if there was anything about it that didn't make sense...and definitely before claiming, and definitely definitely before claiming with an edited PM.
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Post by LightFoot on Oct 5, 2012 11:36:19 GMT -5
~snipped~ Because I had no idea what hostile mean't versus non-hostile in the world of town. It is my fault for not reading where it stated what it mean't. I didn't know how to explain it if it came up. I almost want to be be lynch so I can say that Bill got one wrong! Ginger does make mistakes... The problem is, if you’re Town you know that whatever the mod typed is true and correct ( unless it isn’t and that’s on them to correct not you?) I think that’s the major fly in your jelly jar
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Post by LightFoot on Oct 5, 2012 11:36:51 GMT -5
And I see I'm redundant again
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