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Post by peekercpa on Apr 25, 2013 20:00:21 GMT -5
Peeker's probably town, since his posts read as stream-of-consciousness. That said, one thing that's way wrong - second, the 50/50 was on is he telling the truth? well he basically has come out with a power claim of some sort which kind of backs up my point one. what's interesting is that he left a dangling participle, so to speak in referring to the role set and how their alignment could go either way. now i don't know which alignment he is but cripes he has, as usual painted a damn big target on hit back. I genuinely don't understand why you think he painted a target on himself. Everyone has a role, so his claiming one isn't a big deal. He just said his was from the expansion set and then you made a big deal out of it for no reason. their are ten "basic villagers". i kind of read that as nillers. so are you suggesting that even "basic villagers" have powers? and this new format sucks.
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Post by lauriern on Apr 25, 2013 20:04:25 GMT -5
Peeker's probably town, since his posts read as stream-of-consciousness. That said, one thing that's way wrong - I genuinely don't understand why you think he painted a target on himself. Everyone has a role, so his claiming one isn't a big deal. He just said his was from the expansion set and then you made a big deal out of it for no reason. their are ten "basic villagers". i kind of read that as nillers. so are you suggesting that even "basic villagers" have powers? and this new format sucks. Are you saying you're not a basic villager? If you were, you would know the answer to your own question...... And I agree - these new boards suck
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Post by peekercpa on Apr 25, 2013 20:05:22 GMT -5
ok, i went back. apparently there are a lot of powers in this durn game. probably the only chance town has if that they are all protectors because the 7 v 17 still sticks in my craw a bit. either that or town needs a blow through killer that is hyper focused.
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Post by Sai on Apr 25, 2013 20:06:42 GMT -5
Oh my god, can we get a doctor on Peeker? And can townies read over the rules thread more closely please?
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Post by dizzymrslizzy on Apr 25, 2013 21:28:00 GMT -5
their are ten "basic villagers". i kind of read that as nillers. so are you suggesting that even "basic villagers" have powers? and this new format sucks. Peekers....Um, I think you misspoke there. I'm not quite comfortable with you not knowing that every role has a power. So that means you are either a Power Town role, or a Witch.....Considering Patricia recently made this same slip, I'm kind of feeling Witch of some kind.... Vote: Peekers
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Post by peekercpa on Apr 25, 2013 21:28:12 GMT -5
Oh my god, can we get a doctor on Peeker? And can townies read over the rules thread more closely please? ok, sir/madam sai. some of these more exotic rule sets rattle me. i am accustomed to just sussing out "scum" and lynching them. although, in past games where i have been a "vig" i just take them out at Night (unfortunately the collateral damage can be quite high at times) and that solves the damn problem. and maybe things have changed dramatically here since i last played. i'll spend my time looking for "scum" as opposed to reading some fucking odd bodkins rule set. i mean, carp, i'd have to take at least two of the damn pills to wade through the whole thing. cripes i tried once, gave up. tried another time, gave up. tried another, gave up. ain't even considering trying again. screw it. i'll just vote to lynch scum and the durn rules be damned. you'll notice that i will even post strategy at Night although it is verboten. it's like i teach my kids. speed limits are a suggestion not a fucking rule to be followed under all circumstances. p.s. since i don't think i have ever played with you. are you a penis possessor or a penis envyor?
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Post by dizzymrslizzy on Apr 25, 2013 21:32:02 GMT -5
Actually, given the 50/50, it was kind of a null tell. And as others have said, that is less than we usually get from Pleo. first, you are full of poo. pleo doesn't do anything in this game that is a "null tell" and the fact that he did not come out and claim niller townie on first post makes my hackles rise. now certainly i have been gone for a while and he may have changed his play style but the sumbitch is a slippery dude (in a nice way). and changes in play style are the first thing i look for. really, if meeko, for example, was playing and didn't post but once or twice a Day i'd be going what the heck with that? sorry folks, that's how i operate. The last two games I've played with Pleo he has claimed Cop on N0/D1. So yeah I agree with you Null tell was the wrong word, but really all it is is Pleo throwing out some wine. He knows he has to at this point throw out a random I am XYZ at the beginning of the game, it's not something I think we should focus on.
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Post by peekercpa on Apr 25, 2013 21:39:44 GMT -5
their are ten "basic villagers". i kind of read that as nillers. so are you suggesting that even "basic villagers" have powers? and this new format sucks. Peekers....Um, I think you misspoke there. I'm not quite comfortable with you not knowing that every role has a power. So that means you are either a Power Town role, or a Witch.....Considering Patricia recently made this same slip, I'm kind of feeling Witch of some kind.... Vote: Peekerswell you are at least half right. kinda picked the wrong flip, however. don't votes need to be in blue? although i fully understand the intent. kind of sucky, btw. who the fuck is patricia?
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Post by peekercpa on Apr 25, 2013 21:43:50 GMT -5
The last two games I've played with Pleo he has claimed Cop on N0/D1. So yeah I agree with you Null tell was the wrong word, but really all it is is Pleo throwing out some wine. He knows he has to at this point throw out a random I am XYZ at the beginning of the game, it's not something I think we should focus on.[/quote] on preview. the above is snipped from dizzythank og that someone is on the same page. this new format is giving me hell.
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Post by peekercpa on Apr 25, 2013 21:48:31 GMT -5
i don't know how to fix it folks. really, i am trying hard to get back into the swing but crimminy this is a beast for an old man. it seems that some of the times the tags work but other times it is totally random. and editing a quote has become very problematic. i don't normally quote the whole durn thing but rather the salient parts that i am focusing on. but shit i've fucked up every single one that i have done that with.
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Colby11
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Post by Colby11 on Apr 25, 2013 23:27:42 GMT -5
Greetings.
Peeks just seems like regular Peeks to me.., speaking of which, Yo Peeks, whatcha up to?
This setup does discredit any and all claims. The way I understood it, everyone has a special ability, and also a faction. Everyone can be either town or scum, except for the Holy characters.
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Post by Sai on Apr 26, 2013 2:11:29 GMT -5
p.s. since i don't think i have ever played with you. are you a penis possessor or a penis envyor? I'm not sure what you mean by envyor, but I'm a guy. @ dizzymrslizzy - How do you read peeker's stream-of-thought posts as coming from scum?
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Post by Silver Jan on Apr 26, 2013 2:17:08 GMT -5
Greetings. Peeks just seems like regular Peeks to me.., speaking of which, Yo Peeks, whatcha up to? This setup does discredit any and all claims. The way I understood it, everyone has a special ability, and also a faction. Everyone can be either town or scum, except for the Holy characters. That's what I thought too. I am kind of with Peeks here, this set up is a bit confusing but we shouldn't really go too far wrong if we hunt scum, or witches in this case. As to Pleo, I have seen him claim very early in the last few games and he has been both Town and Scum and although I don't think it should be totally dismissed I don't think it tells us that much. He didn't post a full claim after all, did he?
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Post by lauriern on Apr 26, 2013 7:03:35 GMT -5
p.s. since i don't think i have ever played with you. are you a penis possessor or a penis envyor? I'm not sure what you mean by envyor, but I'm a guy. @ dizzymrslizzy - How do you read peeker's stream-of-thought posts as coming from scum? That was just Peekerese for are you a guy or gal. Penis possessor = guy Penis envyor = gal
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Post by gnarlycharlie on Apr 26, 2013 7:26:00 GMT -5
yikes! didn't notice this started. catching up now.
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Post by gnarlycharlie on Apr 26, 2013 7:54:23 GMT -5
that was a fast catch up. one thing's for sure. i need to re-read the rules. their are ten "basic villagers". i kind of read that as nillers. so are you suggesting that even "basic villagers" have powers? and this new format sucks. Are you saying you're not a basic villager? If you were, you would know the answer to your own question...... And I agree - these new boards suck i think peeker needs to re-read the rules too. Greetings. Peeks just seems like regular Peeks to me.., speaking of which, Yo Peeks, whatcha up to? This setup does discredit any and all claims. The way I understood it, everyone has a special ability, and also a faction. Everyone can be either town or scum, except for the Holy characters. That's what I thought too. I am kind of with Peeks here, this set up is a bit confusing but we shouldn't really go too far wrong if we hunt scum, or witches in this case. As to Pleo, I have seen him claim very early in the last few games and he has been both Town and Scum and although I don't think it should be totally dismissed I don't think it tells us that much. He didn't post a full claim after all, did he? definitely a null tell for Pleo. ----------------------------------------- sai, have we ever played together? are you active in vendetta-strada?
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Post by Pleonast on Apr 26, 2013 9:21:03 GMT -5
Everyone's wrong! Mwuahaha! The follow-up comment was tongue and cheek assumption that Pleo would be the one to say that I've over-simplified why he does what he does. You are correct! But I'd say your description of my actions is wrong rather over-simplified. their are ten "basic villagers". i kind of read that as nillers. so are you suggesting that even "basic villagers" have powers? and this new format sucks. I don't see how a Basic Villager would make this statement. Since 7 out of the other 14 players who are not Basic Villagers are scum, I'm happy to vote peekercpaunless a meaningful explanation is given. Oh my god, can we get a doctor on Peeker? And can townies read over the rules thread more closely please? This is an interesting comment. You are implicitly excluding peeker from the group "townies". Why? Peekers....Um, I think you misspoke there. I'm not quite comfortable with you not knowing that every role has a power. So that means you are either a Power Town role, or a Witch.....Considering Patricia recently made this same slip, I'm kind of feeling Witch of some kind.... Vote: PeekersExactly my thoughts. How do you read peeker's stream-of-thought posts as coming from scum? It's not the stream of thought that's the problem. It's that peeker has shown particular ignorance about Basic Villagers. That has a high correlation with not being a Basic Villager, since most players read their own role PMs, even if they skip over the rules. We know that there are 10 Basic Villagers in this game. That means there are 14 players who are not. Of those 14, 7 are other types of Villagers and 7 are Witches. Absent of additional information, that gives us a 50% chance that peeker is scum. Note that if peeker is another type of Villager, they will be able to claim to save themself from the lynch, since both Holy Villagers and Village Spies can be counter-claimed if a false claim is made. Also note that if peeker is one of those non-Basic Village Types, the Witches will have already figured that out, so claiming doesn't put any additional risk on peeker. If peeker does not make a claim, I am confident they are a Witch. Bottomline, if peeker is a Villager, they've already put a target on themself for a Night kill. If peeker is a Witch, we've got them lynched.
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Post by Silver Jan on Apr 26, 2013 10:35:35 GMT -5
Character – Every player also has a unique character card featuring some special ability. A few “holy” characters are reserved for the Holy Villagers. The rest could be any type, include a Witch! Read more: idlemafia.com/thread/2146/witchhunt-rules#ixzz2RaGXcxMWOk, I just took this from the rules. Even if Peeker claims he could still be a witch, unless he has a holy role and then he shouldn't claim. See, it's confusing already. You can't trust any claim.
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Post by Pleonast on Apr 26, 2013 11:35:44 GMT -5
Ok, I just took this from the rules. Even if Peeker claims he could still be a witch, unless he has a holy role and then he shouldn't claim. See, it's confusing already. You can't trust any claim. By claim, I meant peeker needs to claim a Type, because as you say, a Character claim is next to useless. peeker's statements imply they are not a Basic Vanilla. So let's look at the options: 1. Holy Villager: Witches already know now that peeker is Holy, because they're not on the list of possibly Witches. peeker should claim Holy, since it doesn't give the Witches any added information, and it will prevent us from lynching them. And they should claim a specific Character, to prevent later false claims. 2. Village Spy: Witches already know now that peeker is a Spy, because they are on the list of possible Witches. peeker should claim Spy, since it doesn't give the Witches any added information, and it will prevent us from lynching them. And they should not claim a specific Character. 3. Elder Witch: we lynch them, unless they falsely claim to be a Holy Villager or Village Spy. If they falsely claim Spy, then a real Spy can counter claim and we make one-for-one trade. If they falsely claim Holy, we'll need to force a specific Character claim so that the real one can counterclaim. Then we have a one-for-one trade. 4. Junior Witch: same as Elder Witch.
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Post by Pleonast on Apr 26, 2013 11:59:52 GMT -5
I just realized that one-for-one trades are complicated in this setup because we do not get death reveals. If we get a pair of players who counterclaim each other, it may be better to wait for the Witches to take action first, rather than immediately lynching one.
The lack of alignment reveals is going to be a real burden on us this game. Our primary source of alignment is going to be from who gets Night killed. But even then we can't assume the Witches won't kill one of their own, since there's so many of them.
I'm not sure how we can win this without dumb luck.
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Post by Mahaloth on Apr 26, 2013 12:13:55 GMT -5
Character – Every player also has a unique character card featuring some special ability. A few “holy” characters are reserved for the Holy Villagers. The rest could be any type, include a Witch! Read more: idlemafia.com/thread/2146/witchhunt-rules#ixzz2RaGXcxMWOk, I just took this from the rules. Even if Peeker claims he could still be a witch, unless he has a holy role and then he shouldn't claim. See, it's confusing already. You can't trust any claim. In theory, we could trust a holy claim, but like you said, holy folks should not claim because they will be a target. Also, would it not be wise to avoid getting a bunch of claims out there in case we have a bishop? If we have a bishop, we'd be foolish to put them in a position to claim before "halftime" because there is a chance to win. What are the odds we have a bishop? 50/50? The lack of alignment reveals is going to be a real burden on us this game. Our primary source of alignment is going to be from who gets Night killed. But even then we can't assume the Witches won't kill one of their own, since there's so many of them. I'm not sure how we can win this without dumb luck. :snipped: I entirely agree and was about to say the same thing as Pleo. Unless I don't get it, we're playing in a huge gamble game. It's always a gamble, especially early, but no death reveals makes it a total crapshoot.
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Post by crys on Apr 26, 2013 13:18:52 GMT -5
Yipes. I'm here going to read my pm now
Sent from my DROID RAZR using proboards
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Post by texcat on Apr 26, 2013 13:44:09 GMT -5
Pleo's argument makes sense to me. Vote: peeker
PM received, I'll read and comment when I get home tonight As I understand it, cookies is explaining Pleo's habit of claiming at the start of game to PeekerI always think this is a scum tell, saying that you will comment later and then not having much to say later. Vote: sario
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Post by Pleonast on Apr 26, 2013 16:48:22 GMT -5
In theory, we could trust a holy claim, but like you said, holy folks should not claim because they will be a target. Also, would it not be wise to avoid getting a bunch of claims out there in case we have a bishop? If we have a bishop, we'd be foolish to put them in a position to claim before "halftime" because there is a chance to win. What are the odds we have a bishop? 50/50? There's a 100% chance we have a Bishop, because we are using the Showdown expansion set. If peeker is the Bishop (or any other Holy), we're already screwed because the Witches know they're Holy and will Night-kill them immediately. So they should claim Bishop now if they are, simply to prevent a Witch from later falsely claiming to be the Bishop. (Okay, the Nun mitigates this somewhat, but we're still screwed if peeker is Holy.) If peeker is not the Bishop, but claims to be, then the real Bishop needs to keep quiet until after Halftime, when they can do a full reveal. The Nun should keep quiet as well.
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Post by Silver Jan on Apr 26, 2013 17:32:16 GMT -5
Pleo's argument makes sense to me. Vote: peeker
PM received, I'll read and comment when I get home tonight As I understand it, cookies is explaining Pleo's habit of claiming at the start of game to PeekerI always think this is a scum tell, saying that you will comment later and then not having much to say later. Vote: sarioIs that a witches tell, voting in turquoise? Peeks hasn't claimed anything and I am not too happy that you think he should. I think he is just as screwed up about the rule as I am.
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Post by Sai on Apr 26, 2013 17:46:07 GMT -5
Oh my god, can we get a doctor on Peeker? And can townies read over the rules thread more closely please? This is an interesting comment. You are implicitly excluding peeker from the group "townies". Why? I'm not, actually. I'm also not excluding him from the list of people that need to read the rules more closely. Townies, incl Peeker, need to read the rules closely. How do you read peeker's stream-of-thought posts as coming from scum? It's not the stream of thought that's the problem. It's that peeker has shown particular ignorance about Basic Villagers. That has a high correlation with not being a Basic Villager, since most players read their own role PMs, even if they skip over the rules. We know that there are 10 Basic Villagers in this game. That means there are 14 players who are not. Of those 14, 7 are other types of Villagers and 7 are Witches. Absent of additional information, that gives us a 50% chance that peeker is scum. Note that if peeker is another type of Villager, they will be able to claim to save themself from the lynch, since both Holy Villagers and Village Spies can be counter-claimed if a false claim is made. Also note that if peeker is one of those non-Basic Village Types, the Witches will have already figured that out, so claiming doesn't put any additional risk on peeker. If peeker does not make a claim, I am confident they are a Witch. Bottomline, if peeker is a Villager, they've already put a target on themself for a Night kill. If peeker is a Witch, we've got them lynched. This is the best post in the thread. Regardless, it didn't really answer my question, so I'll rephrase it. I agree Peeker seems to have accidentally claimed NOT basic villager. I also have a town read on him, just from his stream of thought posts. .: I think it's more likely that he's a nonbasic townie than scum. I didn't think about the witches having a list for the spies, so if I'm right, they know which category he is anyways. You're right, he should 100% claim his category. If he's Holy, I agree that he should also claim a role, since it's no-reveal. That said - if he's Bishop or Priest, he should instead claim Nun or Acolyte. If he's legit, the real one won't CC him since they'll know his true role. Not super sure how to handle CCs if we get one, but if he's legit, mafia might not take the risk, since he'd have an equal chance of being the lesser role from their POV.
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Post by Sai on Apr 26, 2013 17:46:55 GMT -5
sai, have we ever played together? are you active in vendetta-strada? Same Sai.
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Post by Sai on Apr 26, 2013 17:49:35 GMT -5
Oh, in all that I didn't actually post my rephrased question.
Pleo, do you have a read on Peeker aside from the mechanics of his claim?
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Post by Silver Jan on Apr 26, 2013 18:08:47 GMT -5
This is an interesting comment. You are implicitly excluding peeker from the group "townies". Why? I'm not, actually. I'm also not excluding him from the list of people that need to read the rules more closely. Townies, incl Peeker, need to read the rules closely. It's not the stream of thought that's the problem. It's that peeker has shown particular ignorance about Basic Villagers. That has a high correlation with not being a Basic Villager, since most players read their own role PMs, even if they skip over the rules. We know that there are 10 Basic Villagers in this game. That means there are 14 players who are not. Of those 14, 7 are other types of Villagers and 7 are Witches. Absent of additional information, that gives us a 50% chance that peeker is scum. Note that if peeker is another type of Villager, they will be able to claim to save themself from the lynch, since both Holy Villagers and Village Spies can be counter-claimed if a false claim is made. Also note that if peeker is one of those non-Basic Village Types, the Witches will have already figured that out, so claiming doesn't put any additional risk on peeker. If peeker does not make a claim, I am confident they are a Witch. Bottomline, if peeker is a Villager, they've already put a target on themself for a Night kill. If peeker is a Witch, we've got them lynched. This is the best post in the thread. Regardless, it didn't really answer my question, so I'll rephrase it. I agree Peeker seems to have accidentally claimed NOT basic villager. I also have a town read on him, just from his stream of thought posts. .: I think it's more likely that he's a nonbasic townie than scum. I didn't think about the witches having a list for the spies, so if I'm right, they know which category he is anyways. You're right, he should 100% claim his category. If he's Holy, I agree that he should also claim a role, since it's no-reveal. That said - if he's Bishop or Priest, he should instead claim Nun or Acolyte. If he's legit, the real one won't CC him since they'll know his true role. Not super sure how to handle CCs if we get one, but if he's legit, mafia might not take the risk, since he'd have an equal chance of being the lesser role from their POV. So you are telling a Townie to lie, way to go, I am not with you on this one.
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Post by Sai on Apr 26, 2013 18:18:53 GMT -5
Can do it as Nun/Bishop or Acolyte/Priest instead if you want, but that's semantics.
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