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Post by zuma on Jun 9, 2007 18:57:02 GMT -5
I already outlined many things that didn't make sense and nobody is listening. WHY would Captain Steele roleclaim so early? WHY? CAN YOU ANSWER THAT? Do you have a good response? You or anyone? I can see waiting until the LAST minute but zuma still had about TWO days left. You are also the one who originated the "two days" nonsense which Auto picked up on, I've noticed. And you can't seriously still be holding the opinion that FCOD and AZ aren't who they say they are, can you? The "real" officers could not possibly be so dense.
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Post by capybara on Jun 9, 2007 19:04:05 GMT -5
Hey, there, ah. . . Zuma? Nice of you to pop in. You wanna put your money where your mouth is, or at least explain to us why you aren't voting, by the way? It looks funny.
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Parzival
Mome Rath
Let's all strive to do our best today![on:forgot to log out][of:forgot to log in]
Posts: 201
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Karma:
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Post by Parzival on Jun 9, 2007 19:13:15 GMT -5
Because I have news for everyone. It's right here. It's right in all of my posts. I am an honest member of the crewIt is really scummy to hold your own life so highly when the crew stands to gain so much information from your death.[/qu ote] Not to make light of your situation if you're telling the truth, but this has to be one of the funniest coding mistakes I've seen in a while. Besides, by pointing out ArizonaTeach's certainty, you're offering us 3 for 1 on your life! That's a fantastic deal! By the way, why advise zuma to come up with a good excuse? If you turn up honest crew we'll be as heartless in killing him as we are you. I didn't want to get a speed lynch going, but since I will probably be putting my computer under the knife tonight and may well be out of action for a day, I'm going on record: vote Idle Thoughts
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Post by The Real FCOD on Jun 9, 2007 19:18:05 GMT -5
I already outlined many things that didn't make sense and nobody is listening. WHY would Captain Steele roleclaim so early? WHY? CAN YOU ANSWER THAT? Do you have a good response? You or anyone? I can see waiting until the LAST minute but zuma still had about TWO days left. This is misinformation. Here's zuma's claim. 10:14pm EDT on June 6. The day ended 4pm EDT on June 7. So he claimed, oh, about 16 hours before the end of the day. He's already explained that he works nights and would not be on again until after the day was over. Does that answer your question, Idle? I can even understand if he's seeing something the DOC is saying in here (like voting for me or something) that is making him think that the Doc DID protect zuma. But stay with me here in this line of thoughts for a moment....even if that is the case....COULD IT NOT BE that the Doc, too, was wrong?! I don't get that. Maybe the Doc DID protect zuma last Night. This just means that the Doc believed zuma saying that he's Steele. It doesn't mean zuma couldn't be lying and the Doc was fooled...but no... ArizonaTeach isn't even CONSIDERING this. He's obviously going under other (false) knowledge..and I hope he's got a good explanation the next Day for it. Seriously dude, no real crew member would fight back this hard. You're really grabbing at straws right now. In one of your posts, you asked how you're supposed to trust anyone if nobody will trust you. The answer to your question is: you're not supposed to trust anyone unless they're dead or confirmed town. You're not dead or confirmed town, so of course nobody is going to trust you. Here are some facts. If anyone can dispute them, please do so. This is what the town CAN trust: 1) AZTeach and I are officers. Idle, do you really think we could pretend to be officers for this long when a real officer could trade his/her life for two scum? The notion is preposterous! 2) The Doctor protected zuma last night. AZTeach and I know this 100%. Don't ask how, just trust us. If you believe 1) you must believe 2). 3) The Doctor knows if someone tried to kill his patient. We can reasonably assume that zuma was attacked last night, and here's why: If zuma was not attacked it means he's lying, and the Doctor would know. That means that zuma WAS attacked last night. Of course, zuma could have been attacked by someone else and he is framing you, Idle, but I don't see why he'd do that. It does not make SENSE! If Chewbacca lives on Endor, you must acquit! Idle, I'm sorry, but you must die. I will be VERY suspicious of anyone that doesn't vote for you. --FCOD
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Post by zuma on Jun 9, 2007 19:22:18 GMT -5
Hey, there, ah. . . Zuma? Nice of you to pop in. You wanna put your money where your mouth is, or at least explain to us why you aren't voting, by the way? It looks funny. Sure. Since it looks like we're going the full 96 hours. Even I don't want to speed-lynch Idle. The more information we have tomorrow, the better. vote: Idle Thoughts
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Post by capybara on Jun 9, 2007 19:28:45 GMT -5
Sure. Since it looks like we're going the full 96 hours. Even I don't want to speed-lynch Idle. The more information we have tomorrow, the better. I agree completely. And the most interesting information won't be about Idle Thoughts directly. I suspect there will be very interesting discussion until the end of the Day-- we'll see some interesting and valuable input and analysis.
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 19:33:09 GMT -5
Seriously dude, no real crew member would fight back this hard. Then that will be something the next Night that YOU will have to admit you're wrong about and (hopefully) start changing your game play insight on. Because I AM crew and I AM fighting back this hard so apparently A REAL CREW MEMBER WOULD do that. Then I should not be asked to trust anyone. I have no idea. All I can go on is what I know..which is that zuma is claiming to be C.S and HE'S lying....so it doesn't take a far reach in my mind to think it's possible with other roleclaims. Especially when one of them is so "sure" I'm a pirate. If that is the case then why are you not giving the possiblity that all three of you are beliving in something that is false. Okay, so the Doc DID protect him last night. And WHY did s/he do this? Because s/he OBVIOUSLY thought that he was Captain Steele. Does that mean that he STILL couldn't be lying about me? Does it? A simple yes or no will suffice. Because your fellow "mason" AZteach seems to think that it's a "yes". That that means zuma can't be lying about me. I say this is complete B.S. in the regards that it's incredible narrow minded and extreme tunnel vision. He's not even GIVING THE POSSIBLITY that the Doc and you all were WRONG. WHAT! How so? I didn't read this in the rules. HOW would the Doc know if someone they protected was attacked? HOW? HOW? Am I missing something here?!? What the heck? Why wasn't this explained pre game?
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Post by capybara on Jun 9, 2007 19:34:34 GMT -5
Idle (and to Mad and Auto, if ya'll have theories concerning this as well), If Zuma is lying and setting you up in this elaborate setup that will sacrifice himself, can you suggest. . . why you? I think you suggested earlier that you suspect that he thinks you're a secret power role, is that right? I'm still trying to work out why, if this is the case, he'd/ they'd do it like this and not in some less fabulous manner--why not a simple night-kill. Why didn't they just take you out last night? Any thoughts, other than that they're completely insane?
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 19:34:35 GMT -5
You are also the one who originated the "two days" nonsense which Auto picked up on, I've noticed. And you can't seriously still be holding the opinion that FCOD and AZ aren't who they say they are, can you? The "real" officers could not possibly be so dense. If they wanted to remain hidden, they might not say anything other than just drop subtle hints. After all, I know that you're not the real C.S. and the real C.S. hasn't come forward yet, has s/he? It's not that s/he's dense. Just smart. This is misinformation. Here's zuma's claim. 10:14pm EDT on June 6. The day ended 4pm EDT on June 7. So he claimed, oh, about 16 hours before the end of the day. He's already explained that he works nights and would not be on again until after the day was over. Does that answer your question, Idle? The only answer I see is that either A: You've been taken in by his lies or B: You're scum yourself. I don't care if it turned out that he roleclaimed one minute before the last Day was up, he is NOT Captain Steele.
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 19:38:11 GMT -5
Idle (and to Mad and Auto, if ya'll have theories concerning this as well), If Zuma is lying and setting you up in this elaborate setup that will sacrifice himself, can you suggest. . . why you? I think you suggested earlier that you suspect that he thinks you're a secret power role, is that right? I'm still trying to work out why, if this is the case, he'd/ they'd do it like this and not in some less fabulous manner--why not a simple night-kill. Why didn't they just take you out last night? Any thoughts, other than that they're completely insane? Well, in Day Two, I expressed pretty hard that I thought he was lying. That I thought it was a false roleclaim and didn't believe it. So I'm thinking he thought I knew something he didn't. Like I was the real Captain Steele or something. I dunno. But that's the only thing that makes sense in my mind. So he's using his "Captain Steele" roleclaim to take me out and milk some extra crew deaths out of it. But see, I'm just crew. So I think he wasted it, due to him thinking I was something else.
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Post by capybara on Jun 9, 2007 19:49:55 GMT -5
Well, in Day Two, I expressed pretty hard that I thought he was lying. That I thought it was a false roleclaim and didn't believe it. So I'm thinking he thought I knew something he didn't. Like I was the real Captain Steele or something. I dunno. But that's the only thing that makes sense in my mind. So he's using his "Captain Steele" roleclaim to take me out and milk some extra crew deaths out of it. But see, I'm just crew. So I think he wasted it, due to him thinking I was something else. Ok, that's vague but fair. Another question-- You discredit the theory that the doctor might be aware that he has performed doctoring duties-- can you verify that this is your position? In the rules it notes "He saves by fixing wounds"-- this implies something like an active agent, narrative-wise (diegetically, I mean) (oh, never mind). You have moderated games before-- in your setup what kind of messages did doctor/blocker roles receive?
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Post by capybara on Jun 9, 2007 19:51:59 GMT -5
Hey, Idle, we have the same number of posts right now! I'm passing things on for the rest of the evening. Good night, sailors!
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 19:54:15 GMT -5
Well, in Day Two, I expressed pretty hard that I thought he was lying. That I thought it was a false roleclaim and didn't believe it. So I'm thinking he thought I knew something he didn't. Like I was the real Captain Steele or something. I dunno. But that's the only thing that makes sense in my mind. So he's using his "Captain Steele" roleclaim to take me out and milk some extra crew deaths out of it. But see, I'm just crew. So I think he wasted it, due to him thinking I was something else. Ok, that's vague but fair. Another question-- You discredit the theory that the doctor might be aware that he has performed doctoring duties-- can you verify that this is your position? In the rules it notes "He saves by fixing wounds"-- this implies something like an active agent, narrative-wise (diegetically, I mean) (oh, never mind). You have moderated games before-- in your setup what kind of messages did doctor/blocker roles receive? Not only in MY hosted games, but all the games so far held on the SDMB, the Doctor of the games does NOT EVER KNOW if they were the reason there was a no-kill. Not only that but they CERTAINLY don't know if someone they chose to protect was attacked or not. That is absurd. I really hope Mal can come in and clear this up because what FCOD just said, as far as I know, is completely false game-wise. Therefore the Doc WOULD NOT know if the person they protected was attacked and I don't know why he would say that and claim that is the case. I'm starting to think that it was a major slip up on his part. < ---- very suspicious look, not anger.
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Post by ArizonaTeach on Jun 9, 2007 20:16:31 GMT -5
** PLEASE READ THIS CAREFULLY **I have a few minutes back in the comfort of my home before I go off to dinner and Ocean's 13, so here's a couple quick responses. I am going to ask Mal some questions, so I hope he answers. I'm also going to make Idle's day here. So let's clear up a few details. Please, nobody but Mal answer these - no "Well, I think that..." from the peanut gallery. MAL - IF STEELE IS ATTACKED, HIS KILLER IS SUPPOSED TO SHOW SIGNS OF A VIOLENT ALTERCATION. REASONABLY, THAT SHOULD HAPPEN IF THE DOCTOR SAVES STEELE SINCE THAT WOULD OCCUR "AFTER" THE ATTACK. IF STEELE IS SAVED BY THE DOCTOR, WILL THERE STILL BE SIGNS ON THE KILLER?
MAL - DOES THE DOCTOR KNOW IF A PROTECTION IS A SUCCESS?
MAL - DOES THE VICTIM KNOW HE OR SHE HAS BEEN ATTACKED AND SAVED BY THE DOCTOR?
MAL - MAY STEELE EXPLAIN WHAT HAPPENED LAST NIGHT IN DETAIL?
MAL - MAY THE PIRATES CHOOSE NOT TO ATTACK AT NIGHT?First point. I'm going to state as fact that zuma was attacked. You may not believe me, but bear with me. I will also state as fact that zuma was protected last night. This, you may also not believe, but bear with me. If both of those facts are true, zuma cannot be a pirate. If he was attacked by Dick, there would have been another kill - a pirate kill. Therefore, the pirates must have attacked him. There is no chance of zuma being a pirate, unless the pirates can simply choose not to kill, which is why I asked that question. Second point. If zuma is not Steele, he would have had to guess two things correctly: 1) that he was attacked last night 2) that the Doctor protected him. The only way he would know both of those facts is if he were Steele or a really lucky guesser. Is that possible? I'll let you ponder that one. That is, however, why I asked if the victim knew he or she was attacked and saved by the Doctor. If Mal answers in the affirmative, things are a little tricker, but again, short of the pirates choosing not to kill, the attacker on zuma had to have been pirates. Therefore, once again, zuma cannot be a pirate. If you choose to believe that zuma is not Steele, I think I have proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that he IS NOT A PIRATE. That leaves a couple of other choices, though. Could he be a crew desperate to survive? Well, he's playing the game wrong then, and I don't think he's that ignorant. Could he be another type of scum? Well, if that's the case, and I said this before, I'd seriously call him out on his sportsmanship when he threw some personal insults my way when I suggested that in Day Three. I can forgive getting a little frustrated when you're innocent, but when you're calculating it "as part of the game," or something, I expect Mal to mod-kill someone like that. At least Idle is getting frantic, but he's not tossing insults. Again, if zuma is truly scum, then I am very, very disappointed with how he spoke to me in Day Three, simply because I caught him, and no dismissals of "it's just part of the game" is going to satisfy me. Anyway, somebody asked earlier if I was seriously suggesting asking Steele to step forward if zuma isn't Steele. Yeah, I actually am suggesting that. Obviously, the ship isn't picking up any "breadcrumbs" from Steele if it's not zuma, so I would rather have a role revealed than screw up again. Don't do it right now, though. I do not think it out of the realm of possibility that he is non-pirate scum who falsely role-claimed, got targetted by the pirates anyway, and got incredibly lucky that the Doctor protected him. Not bloody likely, but inside the realm of possibility. There is one thing that can answer this question for me, though: I want an answer on if Steele's attacker shows signs of a violent altercation as it says in the rules. I also want to know how the Night went down with Steele, though. What information is he allowed to share with us about what happened? Until I get that confirmation and information, I am going to have to unvote Idle Thoughts. I don't want a speed lynch. - I DO NOT REQUEST ANYBODY ELSE UNVOTE - IN FACT, I WOULD RATHER YOU DIDN'T.
- SOME OF THE INFORMATION I ASKED FOR WILL NOT EVEN MAKE A DIFFERENCE TO ANYONE BUT THE OFFICERS.
- IF YOU FEEL YOU MUST UNVOTE, PLEASE DO NOT CHANGE YOUR VOTE UNTIL WE HAVE THE INFORMATION I HAVE ASKED FOR - DOING SO WILL ONLY CONFUSE THE ISSUE.
- I BELIEVE THIS INFORMATION IS THE KEY TO THE GAME AT THIS POINT.
[/b] [/li][/ul]
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Post by ArizonaTeach on Jun 9, 2007 20:23:46 GMT -5
Not only in MY hosted games, but all the games so far held on the SDMB, the Doctor of the games does NOT EVER KNOW if they were the reason there was a no-kill. Not only that but they CERTAINLY don't know if someone they chose to protect was attacked or not. That is absurd. Not in my experience (the Doctor NOT being aware of a save, I mean As fasr as my understanding of the rules, the Doctor knows - how could the Doctor not know?!?), but I asked that question of Mal myself anyways because I figured you were going to make a big deal out of it. And the only reason you want to do that is to try to get as much intelligence for your fellow scum. Regardless, the fact that you are so desperately trying to get information on the Doctor is NOT helping your case here. My unvote for you was symbollic at best, and now I'm already thinking of putting it back. I say this as perhaps the only person you can count on right now to actually give you a break - stop talking. Every word you say is sounding more and more suspicious.
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 20:42:39 GMT -5
First point. I'm going to state as fact that zuma was attacked. Then you're wrong. End of story. I don't even have to go any further. You are plain. One hundred percent wrong. And I have NO idea how you can state this as "fact". I KNOW you're wrong. Because zuma said that he saw ME attack him last Night and I'm a crew member. So that ends that. Your "fact" is not fact at all. That's your first and biggest mistake. Either it's a mistake or you're a pirate yourself. And I wouldn't think a mason would make a mistake of that caliber because it is SO harmful to the good side. But I will accomadate you and go on. What's this "you may" crap? I DON'T. Plain and simple. Because I know something YOU DON'T know. That I'm crew. Something that apparently you're FORGETTING that you don't know for certain. Now that I can possibly believe, although I have no idea how YOU know this for a fact because, as far as I know, officials are not allowed to communicate OUTSIDE this thread. So I'm guessing it's probably based on something either: you read in here or you made up because you're scum. But let's say it's the former. So what? So what if the Doc protected him? Why couldn't it still be that he's lying? Then there you go. Fact ONE is not true. I KNOW THIS and soon, you and everyone else will too. zuma is a pirate. I am crew. What's to ponder? Of course it's possible. Two is already easily possible and even deduced if the Doc took his word at him claiming C.S. So..uh..am I missing something here? That only leaves number one that would have to be a lucky guess, which it is. It doesn't matter. zuma wasn't attacked last night. Zuma is a PIRATE. If Zuma was attacked, it was by either DD making a mistake and believing him too (that he's C.S.) or BG (who was activated and didn't believe he was C.S.). Either way, it doesn't matter because A. He's not C.S. and B. I'm not either of the other two. He specifically said that I attacked him. Me. Idle Thoughts. Since I'm crew, he's lying. Pure and simple. There was no attack on zuma yesterday. I don't see or understand WHYYYYY you keep saying this and insisting things and proclaiming this and repeating this. ZUMA CLAIMED I ATTACKED HIM. I AM CREW. ZUMA IS LYING. ZUMA IS A PIRATE. How easy can it be? Therefore: ZUMA WAS NOT ATTACKED LAST NIGHT. He COULDN'T have been and I DON'T UNDERSTAND OR KNOW OR COULD EVEN GUESS WHY YOU KEEP ON INSISTING THIS. YOU'RE WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!For Christ's sakes, man. THINK OUTSIDE THE FREAKING BOX THAT YOU'VE JUST CREATED FOR YOURSELF. You're either a very crappy mason player or your a very obvious pirate. Coincidentally, that was me. Must be false then because I'm crew. But let's wait on Mal to set us straight.
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Post by ArizonaTeach on Jun 9, 2007 20:45:28 GMT -5
And finally, Idle, I direct you to THIS post by Mal: Mal, Will we know when Ben Gunn is "activated"? Does anyone get to know when a player gets targeted for a night kill but protected by the Doctor? I ask this only because in our game, you can't be protected by the Doctor twice in a row. Thanks! --FCOD 1) Only by implication. The would-be killer can't distinguish his failure from a Steele block, and Dick may believe he missed all by himself. 2) Livesey, the intended victim, and the intended killer, all know what happened. (A deadly blow was struck but thanks to Livesey's preparedness, death was averted.) Steele, if watching, will have seen everything, including the Doctor at work. so knock it off. It took awhile for me to remember where that was posted, when that question was answered.
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Post by ArizonaTeach on Jun 9, 2007 20:47:47 GMT -5
The Doctor saved zuma from an attack. No matter how many times you scream, that's fact.
I will ask you to not scream at me again, please.
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Post by ArizonaTeach on Jun 9, 2007 20:50:01 GMT -5
And while I'm still steamed at that, and seriously considering voting for you again because I think you're a liability, pirate or not, with your histrionics, I just posted an entire post trying to give you some kind of benefit of the doubt, and you tell me to "think outside the freaking box?"
Don't you dare, don't dare call me a "crappy mason player" because you don't agree with me.
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Post by Pleonast on Jun 9, 2007 21:05:00 GMT -5
And finally, Idle, I direct you to THIS post by Mal: 1) Only by implication. The would-be killer can't distinguish his failure from a Steele block, and Dick may believe he missed all by himself. 2) Livesey, the intended victim, and the intended killer, all know what happened. (A deadly blow was struck but thanks to Livesey's preparedness, death was averted.) Steele, if watching, will have seen everything, including the Doctor at work. so knock it off. It took awhile for me to remember where that was posted, when that question was answered. That quote from Mal seems to wrap things up. Any more scum want to out themselves by voting for zuma?
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 21:17:13 GMT -5
The Doctor saved zuma from an attack. No matter how many times you scream, that's fact. That is NOT fact! Zuma said he was attacked by ME specifically. Since I am a CREW MEMBER, I don't see how him being attacked is FACT, since he's lying and I know he is. If you really "know" this as "fact" then put together to what I know as fact, it's either got to be: A. Zuma is a pirate and was attacked by BG or DD or B. Zuma is a pirate and he's just lucky in the guess that he was protected by the Doc. Either way you look at it, Zuma is either a pirate or a pirate aligned role. Then please stop saying things are "facts" when A. You're not saying HOW you know them to be facts and B. They are IMPOSSIBLE to be factual. Because I'm not screaming at you in the yelling/screaming sense. I'm trying to make you UNDERSTAND that you are literally, truly, actually, really, sincerely, undoubtly wrong here. You don't seem like you can admit it or that it's even a REMOTE possiblity.
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 21:24:16 GMT -5
And while I'm still steamed at that, and seriously considering voting for you again because I think you're a liability, pirate or not, with your histrionics, I just posted an entire post trying to give you some kind of benefit of the doubt, and you tell me to "think outside the freaking box?" Don't you dare, don't dare call me a "crappy mason player" because you don't agree with me. Listen, here is what it is: You're saying you know things that are, for SURE, fact. I'm saying that what I know is, for SURE, fact. The things I know are facts make the things you know as facts, impossible to be facts. Now me, all my cards are on the table. I'm crew, he's lying, and that's all there is that is under my coat. So if you really don't want to look so terrible the next Day, I suggest YOU start explaining now how YOU are so sure that your things are facts as well. And don't give me this "trying to out the Doc" stuff. I'm sure you can very easily tell me what it is that makes you so sure that I'm the one that attacked him last night without comprimising the Doc's identity. Because either way, you either are going to explain it now or be forced to explain it tomorrow or the next Day when it's found that I am crew and your "facts" were wrong or misinformed all that time. Seriously. Think about you. YOU ponder that awhile. What if, bear with me, I DO turn out to be crew? What then? Go on and grace me with an answer with that, with you, for once, pretending you do realize I'm crew.
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Post by The Real FCOD on Jun 9, 2007 21:53:07 GMT -5
The Doctor saved zuma from an attack. No matter how many times you scream, that's fact. That is NOT fact! Zuma said he was attacked by ME specifically. Since I am a CREW MEMBER, I don't see how him being attacked is FACT, since he's lying and I know he is. If you don't want to believe that AZTeach and I are officers, than you obviously reject logic, so there's no point in arguing with you. However, everyone else needs to vote for you (eventually), so I will say this for their benefit: The Doctor knows if his patient was attacked. FACT. Listen, here is what it is: You're saying you know things that are, for SURE, fact. I'm saying that what I know is, for SURE, fact. The things I know are facts make the things you know as facts, impossible to be facts. Now me, all my cards are on the table. I'm crew, he's lying, and that's all there is that is under my coat. So if you really don't want to look so terrible the next Day, I suggest YOU start explaining now how YOU are so sure that your things are facts as well. And don't give me this "trying to out the Doc" stuff. I'm sure you can very easily tell me what it is that makes you so sure that I'm the one that attacked him last night without comprimising the Doc's identity. Because either way, you either are going to explain it now or be forced to explain it tomorrow or the next Day when it's found that I am crew and your "facts" were wrong or misinformed all that time. We've already explained this to you, but here goes again: AZTeach and I both picked up on the Doctor's hints that he/she protected zuma last night and that zuma was attacked by someone. That all that I can say without compromising the Doctor's identity. The Doctor protected zuma last night, and zuma was attacked by someone. FACT. Our facts are undeniable. You will not live past Today. --FCOD
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 22:10:42 GMT -5
The Doctor knows if his patient was attacked. FACT. The Doctor protected zuma last night, and zuma was attacked by someone. FACT. Our facts are undeniable. You will not live past Today. --FCOD Yeah well. Zuma claimed he's Captain Steele. FACT. Zuma said I attacked him. FACT. I am a crew member with NO role. FACT. Zuma is lying about that. FACT. You will all soon see that I'm a crew member. FACT. SO, put them together and there is only one likely cause. Anybody familiar with Sherlock Holmes? He states that once every possible notion has been looked at and eliminated, the last solution, HOWEVER UNLIKELY, is the one. The ONLY way I can see that what I'm saying is fact and what you're saying is fact is this: That Zuma, a pirate, was protected by the Doc, thinking he was Captain Steele. He (zuma) then was attacked by someone. Knowing that it couldn't be another pirate, obviously and either was Ben Gunn or Dick Deadeye, he assumes it was Dick Deadeye, person who will soon be a future pirate anyway (and take his (zuma's) place. So he implicates, the next Day (this one) someone he knows to be a strong town player. Me. I'm found to be crew. Everyone, the next Day, goes for zuma. And in the end, DD takes zuma's place as a pirate, making everyone back at square one pirate-wise...but having lost about eight or nine people crew wise. And that's the only defense I have.
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 22:17:20 GMT -5
*shakes head*
I just can't wrap my head around it. It just doesn't make sense.
Posted by Mal.
That is really how it goes down, I guess.
But here...let's say that all of that is true. That zuma is C.S. That he was protected by the Doc..and that attacked him.
Okay? I'm actually going to look at it from that way.
But something doesn't make sense.
The Doc, therefore, IF HE REALLY PROTECTED ZUMA and ZUMA REALLY DID GET ATTACKED..would then KNOW who attacked him, right? Correct? Please correct me if I'm wrong.
And, furthermore, from what you and AZteach say, you see something (from the Doc, I'm guessing) that verifies that it WAS ME. Right?
Then I can't understand it. Because I am Crew. So when it's seen that I am...what will be the explanation, FCOD, AZ? I'm asking you both seriously. HOW could that be?
It's an impossible situation.
I think zuma, FCOD, and AZteach are all scum. I'm sorry if that's strong but I can see no other way about it. Not unless someone can explain to me how it's possible that the Doc know knows who "attacked" zuma and still think it's me. Because it wasn't.
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 22:19:40 GMT -5
But here...let's say that all of that is true. That zuma is C.S. That he was protected by the Doc..and that attacked him. Sorry, that last one should read "and that I attacked him".
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Post by The Real FCOD on Jun 9, 2007 22:26:45 GMT -5
The Doc, therefore, IF HE REALLY PROTECTED ZUMA and ZUMA REALLY DID GET ATTACKED..would then KNOW who attacked him, right? Correct? Please correct me if I'm wrong. And, furthermore, from what you and AZteach say, you see something (from the Doc, I'm guessing) that verifies that it WAS ME. Right? No, nobody said this. The Doctor would not know who attacked zuma. So we don't know for a fact that you attacked zuma, only that someone attacked zuma. But we know that zuma cannot be a pirate. If he is a pirate, and he was attacked by Dick or Gunn, the pirates would have killed someone else. Therefore, the pirates must have attacked zuma, and he is not a pirate. If zuma is not a pirate, why would he pretend that you attacked him? It doesn't make sense. --FCOD
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Post by Idle Thoughts on Jun 9, 2007 22:34:07 GMT -5
No, nobody said this. The Doctor would not know who attacked zuma. So we don't know for a fact that you attacked zuma, only that someone attacked zuma. So then WHY do you think it's me? Why couldn't the case be what, the only thing I can think of is both of what we say are facts, I outlined in the first post of mine above (of the three in a row)? Wait a minute. run that by me again? If zuma is a pirate himself, then why couldn't their kill have been the one that activated Ben Gunn? See, if DD tried for zuma, pirate. (but he (zuma) was protected by the doc), that would explain ONE no kill, correct? And the other would be explained that zuma and the other pirates attempted to kill whoever Ben Gunn was. Viola. NOT ONLY DOES IT MAKE BOTH OF WHAT WE SAY AS FACT...but it also explains very reasonably why there were no kills the Night before. Seriously. It's something to look at. Even I'm seeing and realizing it could have worked out that way for the first time. I didn't know that the Doc didn't know who it would be that attacked zuma. Thank you for clearing that up. Now that I know, I don't think so strongly that you and AZ are scum. And really, what I just outlined in this post seems like it explains everything.
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Post by The Real FCOD on Jun 9, 2007 22:43:00 GMT -5
Wait a minute. run that by me again? If zuma is a pirate himself, then why couldn't their kill have been the one that activated Ben Gunn? See, if DD tried for zuma, pirate. (but he (zuma) was protected by the doc), that would explain ONE no kill, correct? And the other would be explained that zuma and the other pirates attempted to kill whoever Ben Gunn was. Viola. NOT ONLY DOES IT MAKE BOTH OF WHAT WE SAY AS FACT...but it also explains very reasonably why there were no kills the Night before. Seriously. It's something to look at. Even I'm seeing and realizing it could have worked out that way for the first time. I didn't know that the Doc didn't know who it would be that attacked zuma. Thank you for clearing that up. Now that I know, I don't think so strongly that you and AZ are scum. And really, what I just outlined in this post seems like it explains everything. You make a point that deserves some discussion. I'm too tired to fully analyze it at the moment, but that scenario seems possible. --FCOD
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Blaster Master
Mome Rath
The player formerly know as BLAM!
Now 34.788% less repellant to Sharks! :( [on:I WANT TO DIE!][of:I WANT TO LIVE!]
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Post by Blaster Master on Jun 9, 2007 23:22:27 GMT -5
Holy crap! This thread has exploded!
First, Idle Thoughts, for the love of God, please stop posting in massive font, it makes it a real pain in the ass to read the thread.
Second, I'm going to go ahead and vote Idle Thoughts. I think the logic behind this is unnecessary to get into.
Idle Thoughts:
Your death today is essentially a foregone conclusion. Even if you're telling the truth, this "liar liar pants on fire" isn't going to convince anyone. We know for a fact that at least one of the two of you is lying giving us a 50/50 chance of getting a pirate today. If it weren't for the fact that Zuma has claimed to be Captain Steele, I'd have no reason to believe either of you, and I'd let it sit for a while until we figured it out another way. However, if we believe you, we (who have no way of knowing whether or not you're telling the truth) run the risk of killing the best pro-town role in the game. Bad trade.
Further, you had, at one point, put your name behind the idea of "taking one for the team". If you really believe that, and you're pro-town, you should know we'll get Zuma tomorrow, and you should instead be airing your suspicions so you can bequeath us your wisdom. Instead, you're pulling about specious math to try to get us to spare you.
Even more convincingly, it is a 99% a fact that Zuma was attacked last Night, assuming the pirates didn't no-kill (as it makes NO SENSE). Here's some scenarios: DD, knowing that he HAS to kill three people before he dies or he loses, would take a huge risk to go after Zuma knowing that he already has a 50% failure rate, and a high probability of being protected, he'd essentially be wasting his night. I think, instead, he targetted someone else (or possibly even him, hoping to get a double kill), but I think he failed.
OTOH, the pirates could easily be willing to take that risk, knowing that the doctor MAY not have protected him because it was so obvious that he should, that maybe they thought that he thought that he didn't need to. Besides, as you mention, the pirates are already up considerably so risking a no-kill night to take out a major pro-town role was probably deemed a worthwhile risk.
Plus, the officers likely have good reason to believe Zuma was protected by the doctor, and seeing that they both believe he protected him, I'm willing to buy that. Thus, it's perfectly reasonable to believe that Zuma was attacked. That doesn't make him not Ben or Dick, but it would almost certainly make him not a pirate.
That all said, you DID raise an interesting point that Ben could have been activated last night. Thus, I think if he was activated, I think he should role claim. Because if Zuma IS telling the truth, because the doctor saved him last night, he's almost certainly a goner. However, if he was activated last night, he could easily say that that accounts for one of the kills and, if it was the pirates, it could mean the kill from which the doctor saved Zuma was DD.
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