Santo Rugger
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The Obviously Innocent Townie
The Rugger formerly known as Pygmy[on:BYAHH!][of:BYAHH?]
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Post by Santo Rugger on Aug 21, 2007 18:01:39 GMT -5
Since BlaM asked why I voted Hal on Day One toDay, here it is: Color removed. Vote for who you think is most scummy, right? Well, I thought it was him, and I explained why. I just realized I failed to respond to this... Now I remember your vote reasoning. At least you had a reason, even if it wasn't very strong. I'll have to look more into this tomorrow if Dotchan shows up town. Bolding mine. It was day one. Nobody's reasoning was very strong.
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Post by capybara on Aug 21, 2007 18:20:11 GMT -5
Ok, regarding Dotchan. I'm not going to spend today defending her. I've said most of what I need to say about it, and I'm tempted to let her get strung up just so that this gets resolved once and for all (as I'm sure many of us are-- scum and town). But just to point out a couple of things. Votes for Dotchan Day 4: Roosh (at moments ambivalent) Mad NAF Diggit Other posters expressing strong suspicion that Dot's scum: Pygmy 5.57 (yesterday gave her benefit of doubt in 4.273) Blaster 5.12, 5.29 (vote) 5.32, 5.34, 5.54 Somewhat ambivalent: Nesta 4.244 Story 4.176-7, 4.294 Not posting against Dot: Capy Greedy That is, you will count, all 10 of us who are not Dotchan. Only two defending her at all, and only 2 additionally who have not actively sought her lynching but who have found her questionable. My point is not who is who, but rather that nearly EVERYONE is piling on her-- scum and town. Where is the scum defense? Have they decided to feed her to the fishes? Was the vehement argument for her lynching yesterday simply for an alternative scum? Both heads on the block yesterday were scum? I guess I'm not feeling comfortable with the pile on. Not all simultaneously, but cumulatively she's had no defense, and certainly none from scum (her only defenders are confirmed town). And other thoughts archived from yesterday, (sorry, don't know how to code!) psychopathgame.proboards106.com/index.cgi?board=asylumlane&action=display&thread=1187215009&page=9#1187412578In which I discuss her posting style and wonder whether it could happen at all if she were scum and psychopathgame.proboards106.com/index.cgi?board=asylumlane&action=display&thread=1187215009&page=9#1187461939In which I review how the day's discussion about her proceeded and the very-interested parties involved. And that's all I have to say on the topic. I'll be putting my efforts elsewhere.
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Post by capybara on Aug 21, 2007 18:23:28 GMT -5
Oh, and to follow up.
Yes, she certainly sounds scummy. I do not deny it.
I don't think she's scum,
in large part not because of anything she has said, but rather because of the way all of this has come down.
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Santo Rugger
Mome Rath
The Obviously Innocent Townie
The Rugger formerly known as Pygmy[on:BYAHH!][of:BYAHH?]
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Post by Santo Rugger on Aug 21, 2007 18:26:33 GMT -5
<snip>expressing strong suspicion that Dot's scum: Pygmy 5.57 (yesterday gave her benefit of doubt in 4.273) <snip> I didn't express strong suspicion, or any suspicion for that matter. I simply said it's useless to post summarys, and gave my reason why.
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Post by capybara on Aug 21, 2007 18:31:43 GMT -5
<snip>expressing strong suspicion that Dot's scum: Pygmy 5.57 (yesterday gave her benefit of doubt in 4.273) <snip> I didn't express strong suspicion, or any suspicion for that matter. I simply said it's useless to post summarys, and gave my reason why. Ok, that's fine. Diggit smudges her about info dumping, and you weakly agree. We'll put you in with the ambivalent crowd. Happier?
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Post by diggitcamara on Aug 21, 2007 18:33:50 GMT -5
Ok, regarding Dotchan. I'm not going to spend today defending her. (snip) That is, you will count, all 10 of us who are not Dotchan. Only two defending her at all, and only 2 additionally who have not actively sought her lynching but who have found her questionable. My point is not who is who, but rather that nearly EVERYONE is piling on her-- scum and town. Where is the scum defense? Have they decided to feed her to the fishes? Was the vehement argument for her lynching yesterday simply for an alternative scum? Both heads on the block yesterday were scum? (snip) Well... The thing is: where did the "attack on dotchan" start? As far as I can tell, it was her post, yesterDay, which detonated in her persecution. And that post is a doozy indeed. I'll have to look back at some of the statements but, as far as I recall, there was one (by one of the veteran players) that stated something like "even when I was a rookie scum I wouldn't have made a mistake THAT big". It's a difficult post to overlook. And if there is even one veteran player in the remaining psychopath pool, their first reaction would have been "OH SHIT OH SHIT OH SHIT!!!" and then to hit the dirt (metaphorically speaking) and start shooting in her direction. And as to non-veteran psychopaths who at first would have tried to defend her... look at my "apologist" posts yesterDay. One of those previous apologists published a list of prime suspects yesterDay which toDay changed drastically.
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Santo Rugger
Mome Rath
The Obviously Innocent Townie
The Rugger formerly known as Pygmy[on:BYAHH!][of:BYAHH?]
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Post by Santo Rugger on Aug 21, 2007 18:39:26 GMT -5
I didn't express strong suspicion, or any suspicion for that matter. I simply said it's useless to post summarys, and gave my reason why. Ok, that's fine. Diggit smudges her about info dumping, and you weakly agree. We'll put you in with the ambivalent crowd. Happier? I strongly agreed about info dumping. As I said earlier, I'm willing to give dot a pass on a few things, since she's a newbie. I don't see how that's ambivalent, since it doesn't mean I'm not going to still call it as I see it.
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Post by capybara on Aug 21, 2007 18:40:19 GMT -5
Well... The thing is: where did the "attack on dotchan" start? As far as I can tell, it was her post, yesterDay, which detonated in her persecution. And it indeed was not, as my second link reviews-- it notes that you guys start the attack some time before her detonation. You might as well name the other apologist and start in on him-- save us some time.
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Santo Rugger
Mome Rath
The Obviously Innocent Townie
The Rugger formerly known as Pygmy[on:BYAHH!][of:BYAHH?]
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Post by Santo Rugger on Aug 21, 2007 18:40:58 GMT -5
<snip> And as to non-veteran psychopaths who at first would have tried to defend her... look at my "apologist" posts yesterDay. One of those previous apologists published a list of prime suspects yesterDay which toDay changed drastically. Can you expand on this one, I don't follow completely.
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Post by capybara on Aug 21, 2007 18:43:47 GMT -5
Ok, that's fine. Diggit smudges her about info dumping, and you weakly agree. We'll put you in with the ambivalent crowd. Happier? I strongly agreed about info dumping. As I said earlier, I'm willing to give dot a pass on a few things, since she's a newbie. I don't see how that's ambivalent, since it doesn't mean I'm not going to still call it as I see it. Ok, so do you suspect her or not? Go ahead and speak for yourself. Actually, I don't really care. That wasn't my point in the first place. There was some other stuff in that post on either side of the occurrence of your name, if you want to weigh in on that.
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Post by capybara on Aug 21, 2007 18:47:11 GMT -5
<snip> And as to non-veteran psychopaths who at first would have tried to defend her... look at my "apologist" posts yesterDay. One of those previous apologists published a list of prime suspects yesterDay which toDay changed drastically. Can you expand on this one, I don't follow completely. Oh, he's just setting up to smudge Roosh, if I'm not mistaken. He'll follow up here soon. Interested to see his case.
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Santo Rugger
Mome Rath
The Obviously Innocent Townie
The Rugger formerly known as Pygmy[on:BYAHH!][of:BYAHH?]
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Post by Santo Rugger on Aug 21, 2007 19:02:43 GMT -5
I strongly agreed about info dumping. As I said earlier, I'm willing to give dot a pass on a few things, since she's a newbie. I don't see how that's ambivalent, since it doesn't mean I'm not going to still call it as I see it. Ok, so do you suspect her or not? Go ahead and speak for yourself. Actually, I don't really care. That wasn't my point in the first place. There was some other stuff in that post on either side of the occurrence of your name, if you want to weigh in on that. Aww, did somebody miss nap time today? I spoke for myself in the post you quoted. I think dotchan has made a few newbie errors, though not necessarily newbie scum errors. If she is scum, I think diggit pretty much nailed it with his "Hit the dirt!" theory.
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Post by diggitcamara on Aug 21, 2007 19:06:04 GMT -5
Funny. Now that I recapped it, I went looking for this quote (snip) that stated something like "even when I was a rookie scum I wouldn't have made a mistake THAT big". (snip) by an ex-scum. Guess what I foundPersonally I think that the "other 2 scum" is a rather classic scum tell and a hard one to avoid if you are scum. A new scum would very easily make this mistake. What I don't know is what it says about Pygmy and Diggit. I am going back and forth as to whether it exonerates or implicates them. Now... at first I wondered about this. It seems, after all, that NAF (known scum) is reinforcing the idea that dotchan is scum. But... he doesn't follow up on the theory. He... simply started talking about other stuff. Now, remember that from then on to the end of the Day his own life was on the line. I would have thought there would have been a lot more from him, indicting dotchan and whatnot. And his last posts? Pretty much gives up, tells the geniuses he thinks their coming out isn't really a good idea. Is that really what one expects from a psychopath who is fighting for his life?
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Death By Irony
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Post by Death By Irony on Aug 21, 2007 19:21:35 GMT -5
I'm not sure you're helping your case here... *MadtheSwine posited that the scum may have decided to sacrifice drain bead on Day One - when did this happen? Mad was the one who called her out at first for her posting behavior, then storyteller votes her. In fact, drain bead was the vote leader until dnooman and Greedy Smurf pops up as possible vote candidates, then Malacandra creates the 3-way-tie and draws attention to himself in the process. After that, the only voters for drain bead are confirmed town. Are you really saying that you don't think there's any scum on the Drainbead wagon? If so, that means that the two or three remaining scum are among you, Diggit, and Pygmy, which means the probability of you being scum is 66-100%. What I'm saying is that if MadtheSwine's theory is true and that some or all of the scum planned to sacrifice drain bead from the get-go, then the most suspicious are storyteller0910, Roosh, Mad The Swine, and you, Blaster Master. Malacandra is the #1 suspect, since he started the tiff with JSexton that got the back-and-forth voting action between them. #2, then, would be diggitcamara. Well, I name him because he was there first. But the post that really got me to analyzing nesta and putting the FoS on him belongs to storyteller. And yet a few people was at least willing to entertain the possibility that I was dumbass town who had a poor choice of words, whereas everybody else was like "OMG! Scummy!" Again, MadtheSwine gets named because he was there first. I'm just thinking out loud trying to organize my thoughts. I'm not sure what MadtheSwine's invovement in these events mean yet, hence my questioning.
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Post by nesta on Aug 21, 2007 20:58:36 GMT -5
I wasn't sure about dotchan either, and like capy I thought I might just let her sink or swim on her own because we've had a dotchan wagon most Days and it's getting a little tiring. I remembered, though, that Mal had jumped on Roosh's reasoning for voting dotchan on Day 2. Looking back, I now really don't think dotchan is scum, because Mal wanted her lynched. Roosh made his case against dotchan on Day 2 in post 2.130. Mal joins this conversation in post 2.134: (Hi. I just got back after some inconvenient IRL stuff. No cause for alarm.) Roosh, them's some great analysis, but it's getting late where I am. I'll sleep on it and post again maybe ten hours or so from now, but damned if you ain't got something there. Mal is happy that Roosh made this case, and I think here Mal is trying to push the bandwagon forward a little without getting his hands dirty. In post 2.149 Mal says: Aw, crappity-crap, dotchan. Which still leaves me (a) teetering between yourself and Roosh, and (b) wishing I'd got more sleep. One point to mention, I guess, is that dotchan just said that she has "followed many a game", and I think we should weigh any tendency to excuse noobishness very carefully on account of that. I still need to think it through some more before casting the Dreaded Third Vote though. Once again Mal is pushing the bandwagon forward while claiming to be unsure. He points out that dotchan is being inconsistent in her newbish behavior if she's watched other games. He doesn't want to be the third vote. I think if dotchan were scum he wouldn't be pushing the bandwagon, and if he was going to vote for fellow scum he would just jump on and be happy that when she was lynched it would help clear him. Post 2.151 is my favorite: First up, my earlier post, though brief, was composed before dnooman's effort, but posted after thanks to having to do some RW stuff just before 9am local time; so I didn't take dnooman's post into account, or fully digest posts #135 on. On re-reading, I share the suspicion of cowgirl and I find it odd the way her vote and dotchan's switched targets, agreed, but I'm not sure whether that means they're in cahoots or one of them is taking advantage of the other one conveniently jumping in the direction they want. As well as digesting the implications of Genii being able to strategise off-board, I think we're still getting to grips with the scum having full latitude during the Day, and for my part I haven't made up my mind whether that means we're going to see them play more cautiously and "sensibly", or more riskily. Darned WIFOM again! I move we not assign it much weight either way, but I'm open to being corrected, especially if we have players on board who've either used or seen used a similar condition in another game. On the whole I am far from convinced that scum would dare pull anything so obvious as a block vote this early in the game, when there are plenty of Days left for it to come back and bite them, so I sorta figure that if one of this pair is scum it's less likely that the other one is, and if I have to choose between the two of them, I think it's got to come down to this: vote dotchanPart of me would like to be convinced to change my mind though. He finally votes for dotchan, but notices dnooman has made a case against cowgirl. He sets up a scenario where if dotchan is lynched it sets up cowgirl as scum, and if the cowgirl wagon goes through it makes dotchan look like scum. These either/or between two townies is a common way for scum to sit in the background and try to orchestrate town lynch after town lynch. And who gets the blame with both turn out to be town? The players that started the bandwagon, not the scum pushing on them both. So, although I was still on the fence about dotchan being scum, I'm now putting her on the probably town side of my suspicion list. Maybe I've been duped and this was scum trying to gain town cred when a fellow scum gets lynched, but the way he tries to subtly push the bandwagon on rather than making his own case doesn't seem like scum-on-scum to me.
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Post by storyteller0910 on Aug 21, 2007 21:42:40 GMT -5
OK. I just spent almost two full hours reading. The idea I originally had turned out to be a total nonstarter. I am basically back to zero now, and am very frustrated. I will try to compose a more useful post in the morning, but right now I'm going to bed; hopefully I won't be dreaming about this game.
Gah!!!!!
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RoOsh
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Post by RoOsh on Aug 21, 2007 22:37:24 GMT -5
2. I don't understand your point regarding mhaye and MadtheSwine. The whole point of that donnybrook in my head is that for the scum, the possibility of the Therapist returning would have very nearly ended their game at that point. In that context, it didn't matter what JSexton did, as long as he didn't kill Blaster. Accordingly, Mad's vehement support for going with mhaye's plan - and the reasonable way he presented it, which indicated to me that he actually wanted to be taken seriously - seems on balance pro-town. In this context, I do not understand the connection you've drawn between Blaster and The Kooky Piggie. Could you elaborate? Just that the earlier thought that you just said is exactly what I was thinking. Except it just hit me, why would scum believe a role such a Mad BingoMaster? If they thought Mhaye might have been doing something completely out there, it'd be reason to suspect The Kooky Piggy The original post was mostly just a warning to myself and others then that I shouldn't make such easy "pro-town" generalizations. That's all really. And Diggit, If I'm the "One of those previous apologists published a list of prime suspects yesterDay which toDay changed drastically." That you're mentioning. Jeez, I can't renumber the list a little bit? they're still the same 5/6 people i pointed out yesterday, and I'm still sticking with that list. I do like to shuffle them around, and group them as I see fit. "Drastic" changes? I don't think so. Mr. Smudger
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Blaster Master
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Post by Blaster Master on Aug 21, 2007 22:48:07 GMT -5
I'm not sure you're helping your case here... Are you really saying that you don't think there's any scum on the Drainbead wagon? If so, that means that the two or three remaining scum are among you, Diggit, and Pygmy, which means the probability of you being scum is 66-100%. What I'm saying is that if MadtheSwine's theory is true and that some or all of the scum planned to sacrifice drain bead from the get-go, then the most suspicious are storyteller0910, Roosh, Mad The Swine, and you, Blaster Master. Malacandra is the #1 suspect, since he started the tiff with JSexton that got the back-and-forth voting action between them. #2, then, would be diggitcamara. Well, I name him because he was there first. But the post that really got me to analyzing nesta and putting the FoS on him belongs to storyteller. And yet a few people was at least willing to entertain the possibility that I was dumbass town who had a poor choice of words, whereas everybody else was like "OMG! Scummy!" Again, MadtheSwine gets named because he was there first. I'm just thinking out loud trying to organize my thoughts. I'm not sure what MadtheSwine's invovement in these events mean yet, hence my questioning. Okay, I'm completely and utterly confused now. First you start with postulating that MadTheSwine's theory is true, which implies that you think he can be trusted, but then use that very same theory to indict him. Then you spend the rest of the post pointing things out about MadTheSwine. Do you REALLY think that the two or three remaining scum just lined up and voted 1, 2, 3 for one of their own right at the beginning? Surely, I have to believe that the psychos are smarter than that, because it's just too simple of a pattern. If you can provide any sort of evidence, other than MadTheSwine's mad theory to justify why there may be more than one in that group, I'd like to see it otherwise, as I explained earlier, the chance of hitting scum in that group is likely LOWER than a random shot at all 7 unknowns (ie, 1/4 < 2/7). But then, if you're find Storyteller, Roosh, Mad, and Me more suspicious, why do you then go on the offensive against Diggit? Maybe it would help if you were a little more concise...?
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Blaster Master
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Post by Blaster Master on Aug 21, 2007 23:05:21 GMT -5
... Where is the scum defense? Have they decided to feed her to the fishes? Was the vehement argument for her lynching yesterday simply for an alternative scum? Both heads on the block yesterday were scum? Do you really expect scum to come to her defense? Let's theorize for a moment that she is, indeed, scum. Isn't that quite the damning slip? If you were a fellow scum with her, with the ability to talk to her during the day, would you A) Risk outting yourself as well to save her or B) Pick it up and run with it, and try to gain some townie cred? Now let's theorize that she's not scum, would you seriously suggest that they'd throw their necks on the line to save her? Sure, there'll be people, town or scum, who just don't buy it, there always is, short of being caught red-handed, but an outright defense would seem to suffer from Perfect Information Syndrom. Further, since we KNOW that NAF was a psycho, as I think Diggit pointed out, knowing she had a slip like that, if she wasn't scum, why the hell didn't he dog her harder for it? In fact, his attack on her was utterly lacking, as was hers on him. The only explanation for this of which I can conceive is, as I mentioned earlier, that BOTH were scum, and one was trying to gain townie cred, but not by attacking eachother (perhaps, giving fuel for a lynch the next day).
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RoOsh
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Post by RoOsh on Aug 22, 2007 1:56:16 GMT -5
That i can agree with BM. If Diggit turns up scum, I will still be even more suspicious of Dotchan and her "Ooh Shiny!"
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Death By Irony
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Post by Death By Irony on Aug 22, 2007 7:43:44 GMT -5
Well... The thing is: where did the "attack on dotchan" start? As far as I can tell, it was her post, yesterDay, which detonated in her persecution. Actually, on Day Two I was already drawing suspicion for A) my non-vote on Day One and B) my sudden shift to the offensive. I kept posting anyway because I figure that as long as enough discussion gets generated we townies can gain useful data. And yeah, I feel very persecuted right now, especially because I know I'm innocent. The scum also know this.
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Post by Mad The Swine on Aug 22, 2007 9:10:35 GMT -5
Jeez...this Day ends today. I gotta read. BRB
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Post by capybara on Aug 22, 2007 9:13:57 GMT -5
Also, VERY IMPORTANT. I made a mistake in the times that Day ends. I thought it was Sunday yesterday at the time I ended Night. Heh, it wasn't. So rather then just give you all less than 26 more hours to vote and stuff, Day now ends Thursday at 11am. That is about a full 48 hours away, or two full days.
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Santo Rugger
Mome Rath
The Obviously Innocent Townie
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Post by Santo Rugger on Aug 22, 2007 9:34:54 GMT -5
Well... The thing is: where did the "attack on dotchan" start? As far as I can tell, it was her post, yesterDay, which detonated in her persecution. Actually, on Day Two I was already drawing suspicion for A) my non-vote on Day One and B) my sudden shift to the offensive. I kept posting anyway because I figure that as long as enough discussion gets generated we townies can gain useful data. And yeah, I feel very persecuted right now, especially because I know I'm innocent. The scum also know this. We townies, huh? PS We know what persecute means.
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Post by capybara on Aug 22, 2007 10:37:08 GMT -5
Ugh. I just did a re-read of my top candidates. The scum are playing very carefully. I don't have a lot of time today-- I'll be out for most of the day (and I'm not sure why everyone doesn't just pony up and vote for Dotchan instead of just pointing at her-- let's just get it over with and move on)-- but the scum aren't slipping up in their posts in any clear manner, so the best thing I see as evidence of everything is the collection of certain, undeniable facts in the voting record. On that basis I make an unpopular vote for Diggitsubject to change. Meanwhile, Mad, whenever you want to address this, that would be great, since you sort of blew it off last Night. Got any names? You were positive that MAL/NAF was town; any fruits of re-analysis of the situation? I think NAF's remark was what we might call "scum morale." Ah, so it's #Town+1 for a scum win. Excellent. That puts us in better position. Yes I have one...but you know that already. Where did I say I was positive MAF was town? Where did I say I was positive MAF was town? Ok, you didn't use the word 'positive' but it was back when you were smudging me for voting for MAL instead of Jsexton when I cut in on your smudging Nesta for voting JSexton: I am well aware you didn't vote for Jsex.Thanks for pointing that out. I think it should be obvious why I didn't vote for him...I think MALF is pro-town. Also 4.52, in which you answer a question-- the opposite of what was actually asked, <snipped> On the other side, I understand the case against me/Mal, and I don't. Does someone (nesta, I am looking at you) want to come in and tell me why Mal was, and I am still, so high on your suspicion list? Ok. My intention isn't to make you guess what I am thinking,I put that vote out there because I think nesta is scum and have reasons for it.I would think that somebody might actually investigate and voice their own thoughts,then I can see if they think the same things(or at least some of them). I see it is an unpopular way to play,I won't do it anymore. As far as to why I don't think you are scum MAF,at one point earlier in the game I thought you might be a power role.Am I sure?No,but there was enough of a doubt in my mind not to cast a vote for you. Like I said,I need to look back over the MAF posts and see if I change my mind. Nesta comes first though Also,FWIW(which isn't much apparently),I think there are only 3 scum left,could be 4,no way there is 5. and earlier (3.48) you use Mal's description of your play style as a defense of yourself. And now you distance yourself from all of this?
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Post by diggitcamara on Aug 22, 2007 11:18:34 GMT -5
Ugh. I just did a re-read of my top candidates. The scum are playing very carefully. I don't have a lot of time today-- I'll be out for most of the day (and I'm not sure why everyone doesn't just pony up and vote for Dotchan instead of just pointing at her-- let's just get it over with and move on)-- but the scum aren't slipping up in their posts in any clear manner, so the best thing I see as evidence of everything is the collection of certain, undeniable facts in the voting record. (snip) Actually, you're right (not about your vote, though ;D ). I think dotchan's scumminess is pretty strongly documented by now. I haven't seen many counterarguments that poke a hole in that. Vote dotchan
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Post by diggitcamara on Aug 22, 2007 11:20:31 GMT -5
Actually, on Day Two I was already drawing suspicion for A) my non-vote on Day One and B) my sudden shift to the offensive. I kept posting anyway because I figure that as long as enough discussion gets generated we townies can gain useful data. And yeah, I feel very persecuted right now, especially because I know I'm innocent. The scum also know this. We townies, huh? PS We know what persecute means. Actually, I wasn't aware of its exact meaning. So, consider my ignorance fought.
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Post by nesta on Aug 22, 2007 11:36:45 GMT -5
I think dotchan's scumminess is pretty strongly documented by now. I haven't seen many counterarguments that poke a hole in that. Now that you're voting for dotchan, what do you think of the fact that Mal was trying to get her lynched on Day 2? Or do you interpret those posts of Mal's that I quoted differently than I do?
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Post by storyteller0910 on Aug 22, 2007 11:37:38 GMT -5
I think at this point we’ve dwelled a good deal on the dotchan issue, and frankly I’m as uncertain of her alignment as when we all started. In the absence of new evidence on that front, I’d like to change the subject a bit. I have a theory. It may be a hundred miles off target, but at this stage of the game it may at worst stimulate discussion of a fresh sort; at best, it may be correct, and net us a tricky scum. So:
I start with the following proposition. Scum playstyles are of course going to be as varied as the scum who utilize them. However, I’d say that every scum’s strategy is going to fall into one of two broad categories.
The Active Scum: These are the players who are actively trying to accomplish things. They are the risk takers, the ones who subtly or unsubtly push townie lynches, try to ferret out pro-town power roles, make absolutely lunatic false claims (hi, Idle!), and, when someone needs to fall on the sword for the good of the scum team, point the blade at their own sternum and take one for the team. They may not specifically want to get lynched, but if they are, the loss is minor - they were active, and they hopefully (from the scum perspective) accomplish their goals before they go.
But there is also:
The Survivor: This player has only one goal: not to get lynched. Remember, always remember - although the game may fool you into thinking the overall scum strategy is essentially active, it is not. All the scum have to do in order to win is have just one of their number never get lynched, and they win. The Survivor is That Scum - the one who establishes a trustworthy air, tries to avoid overt tells, plays cautiously, and is always ready to drop the hammer on one - or even all - of his fellows if it will preserve his or her own life or increase his or her own townie cred.
I submit that up until this point, we have concentrated our efforts on rooting out the Active Scum - and well we should, because they are the ones who make the more dramatic tells. But my instincts tell me that the Survivor is out there, too, and if we don’t pull back from analyzing only the really active moves, the Survivor’s just going to coast along to the finish unseen.
So who is it? It’s not me, although none of you can know this. It’s not MadtheSwine, dotchan, or Roosh, all of whom have remained too prominent on the town radar to play this role. It’s obviously not capy or nesta.
So - it’s diggit. Or it’s Blaster Master. Or I guess, it’s both.
<deep breath>
This is a difficult step for me. If I am wrong, this could derail the town altogether. But I’m going to count on the other townies in the crowd to spot the flaws in my arguments before that happens. If I don’t say anything, and one of those players coasts through the endgame utterly unexamined, I think we’ll probably lose.
So here it is: I think Blaster Master is scum.
And because I think that, I will now vote Blaster Master.
My reasons and evidence will be outlined in a forthcoming post, but it’s going to take a little while. I wanted to get my vote on the record early enough to be a real part of the Day’s discussion.
<exhales>
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Post by diggitcamara on Aug 22, 2007 12:17:27 GMT -5
I think dotchan's scumminess is pretty strongly documented by now. I haven't seen many counterarguments that poke a hole in that. Now that you're voting for dotchan, what do you think of the fact that Mal was trying to get her lynched on Day 2? Or do you interpret those posts of Mal's that I quoted differently than I do? Well, undeniably there is a vote from Mal against dotchan. However... is it just me, or was Mal framing his arguments very, very carefully? It gives me the sense of trying to vote against someone, but avoiding to convince anyone else to follow suit at the same time. Stuff like Aw, crappity-crap, dotchan. Which still leaves me (a) teetering between yourself and Roosh, and (b) wishing I'd got more sleep. (snip) and As well as digesting the implications of Genii being able to strategise off-board, I think we're still getting to grips with the scum having full latitude during the Day, and for my part I haven't made up my mind whether that means we're going to see them play more cautiously and "sensibly", or more riskily. Darned WIFOM again! I move we not assign it much weight either way, but I'm open to being corrected, especially if we have players on board who've either used or seen used a similar condition in another game. On the whole I am far from convinced that scum would dare pull anything so obvious as a block vote this early in the game, when there are plenty of Days left for it to come back and bite them, so I sorta figure that if one of this pair is scum it's less likely that the other one is, and if I have to choose between the two of them, I think it's got to come down to this: vote dotchan Part of me would like to be convinced to change my mind though. (underlining mine) doesn't sound like someone who is really, really convinced about his vote. And it definitely doesn't sound like someone who tries to convince others about his vote. I'll take a look at the arguments known scum gave against known scum to see if the pattern repeats itself. I'd have to look at the specific vote counts at the time of those posts to further my thoughts.
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