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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 3:28:45 GMT -5
Post by harmless little bunny on Jan 30, 2009 3:28:45 GMT -5
We know that one of the masons is a scum. I agree with Rysto that voting all 3 might not be the best way to go from an information standpoint. We know a mason will most likely be lynched tonight. We should use our first votes to decide which one and use our other votes for information purposes. Of the three masons I am least suspicious of Zeriel. I like his aggressiveness. The best way to find scum, I would think, is to put them in stressful situations where they might accidentally reaveal something, and his aggressiveness does that. The only think that feels slightly off about him is this post: SpecialEd, you can save this right now by throwing your PM up there and it having "Town Mason" in the title. Unless that's another one of the things that Pede screwed up when he sent me the wrong PM first. He makes a show of trying to sound as confident as possible but then adds the disclaimer that Pede could have messed up. It's true that he could have messed up. It just pings me a little to have such contradicting messages within a message. I really don't know how to feel about Ed. He did suggest coming out first in the mason board which gives him a +, but he also posted a PM which conveniently didn't help us decide anything. It could be that it was just written that way by Pede, but I don't know. Mouse on the other hand has been just a little too suspicious. The magic bagging and wanting to wait are just a little too hard to overlook. I want to believe her because her reasons seem just, but I suppose that is the scums' job to seem just. The evidence is stacked just a little too much against her right now for me not to: Unvote Parzival 1Vote Mighty Mouse 1I agree with Senor Pants about Aubby. Something about the way she is playing is pinging me. She wasn't around at first and neither was Nanook, but Nanook's few posts have carried some weight. Aubby seems to be almost agreeing with everyone's reasons for voting her, and then she plays the "but I just don't know what to do or say" card. Her votes were pretty safe. So were a lot of other players, but something about Aubby just doesn't feel right. Vote Aubby 2I have to have a third vote and Hoopy is a placeholder vote. I don't really suspect him, but he hasn't said much in the last 4 pages. He has asked a couple of questions, but hasn't supported any particular side over the others. He might be just waiting for more information or he might be playing it safe. I would like to hear how he feels about the mason situation. (I think I might make a song called 'the mason situation' ) Vote Hoopy 3
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 6:29:10 GMT -5
Post by roxis on Jan 30, 2009 6:29:10 GMT -5
Plus, two vigs between roxis and Zeriel, even if one is 50% and one you have to wait every three Daysish? Well, technically, once I hit Ivysaur in the rotation, I could keep him out for the rest of the game, if I so choose.
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Merestil Haye
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[on:Slumming it in the Middle-Earth][of:In the halls of Manw
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 8:08:42 GMT -5
Post by Merestil Haye on Jan 30, 2009 8:08:42 GMT -5
This deadline shift has played havoc with my scheduling. Only a little, but even a little is an annoyance. Having thought on the PMs, I'm still wavering between Zeriel and MiteyMouse as the most suspicious of the three Masons, except that it definitely isn't Mr. Special Ed. TDPats, you do realise that the reason for my judgement that Zeriel looks more suspicious than Mitey is based on not only what I think about Zeriel but also what I think about Mitey? Your quote from my post focusses only on the latter. Ultimately what tilted the balance in Zeriel's direction was the thought that, if Mitey was SCUM, she'd have been advised against waving a Magic Bag by the others. She may also have been advised against claiming that a Watcher can find the SCUMmy Mason. At this point, my vote for Mr Special Ed is a placeholder vote to ensure my votes for the others count. Shaggy's vote post ( D01.462) raised my eyebrows a bit. His case was basically that (a) Zeriel's unilateral action was SCUMmy, (b) Zeriel only voted one of the two when he can't be sure the third isn't, ( c) Zeriel is also waving a Magic Bag, (d) MiteyMouse's power is capable of finding the SCUMmy Mason and that's why you want her dead, and (e) you just C&P the Generic PM and tweaked it a bit.. None of these points are particularly strong on their own, some collapse completely under scrutiny; Zeriel didn't Magic Bag, and like most people I'm not sure that a Watcher can unequivocally identify a SCUM. In any case, a sensible SCUM would craft a lie that would defeat a Watcher by claiming to have a power and having a legit reason to visit the player concerned. Others collapse to ambiguity; it's so easy to C&P the template and tweak it that Pedescribe might have done that to save time. That doesn't clear Zeriel though, because Pede might have consciously avoided putting both sets of information into one PM to reduce the chance of a crossposting outing the SCUMmy Mason to the others. Part of me wants to write this defence off to Shaggy's natural inclination not to think the worst about MiteyMouse (I've been blindsided that way once, and it was a perennial struggle in the last game we played together to remember that she might be on the other side) and/or not wanting to sleep on the couch for a week or so. However, if MiteyMouse turns up SCUM then I'll be revisiting Shaggy's posts. Writing this has been helpful, as it's enabled me to revisit my grounds for ranking the votes. I'm not going to change. I did think of removing my vote for Mr. Special Ed. It stands for two reasons; one, if I am wrong about both Zeriel and MiteyMouse then MrSE is clearly a SCUM, and two, there are less than 2 hours before the Dusk, and I need to leave the game alone for the next three hours or so. If I unvote Mr SE my vote won't count without a replacement. So consider the third vote a placeholder (so my vote counts) and a nod to Sherlock Holmes (we know one of you three are SCUM, so if neoither of the others are it must be the last.) Back after Dusk.
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Trepa Mayfield
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 8:11:43 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Jan 30, 2009 8:11:43 GMT -5
Hey guys. I'm not going to be here for the new deadline (I've got class) so FCoD's going to do the night post, unless he's not here, in which case it will go up around 10:10.
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 8:18:43 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 30, 2009 8:18:43 GMT -5
MiteyMouse, how did you expect your tracker ability to out the scum mason? I'm hoping that I can track one of the other Masons and see who they target...if that person dies then I found the Scum. Really? I see two major flaws with this: 1) You're expecting that the Mason would be chosen to do the killing. Since you masons are under the impression that the SCUM mason is in communication with the other SCUM, do you really expect they would tap a somewhat exposed Mason to do the killing? SCUM are rarely stupid. 2) Even if they did, you have a 50% chance on odds alone of guessing wrong. But you know what? Those two points above are irrelevant. Because.... 3) The SCUM kill is a joint kill. They don't designate a killer. It's in the opening color. And I've mentioned this fact before. Skim much? A watcher is considerably less useful to Town when scum don't designate the killer. But a watcher is always useful to scum. Particularly one who already knows that two townies have powers (i.e. your fellow masons). It's possible (as MisterBlockey says) that Mitey's role is overpowered if she's a SCUM and a Mason and a Watcher. However, the Watcher is a likely candidate for a SCUM investigative ability. Maybe it would be overpowered...if the SCUM were hidden. The fact that a SCUM is exposed among three players is a huge crippling factor. That SCUM likely won't live for long, but maybe long enough to out a fellow mason's power or to see if anyone targets the masons with an investigative ability or some other power. BTW, if we lynch Zeriel, and he is town, I highly suggest no town powers target Ed tonight. Keep yourselves hidden to the tracker. If scum whack Ed, well, they will out a scum. [/color] 1: You took it apon your self to out everyone, even though they wanted to, it does not seem to be team playing to go ahead with out everyone fully agreed to do so. 2: You only voted mitey even though you are supose to not know if ed is scum or town eigther. This seems odd to only vote the one, why are you so sure? ? 3: Your strongest and almost only argument is her magic bagging but first what are you doing with your power? oh yeah that is right magic bagging....guilty of the same thing you are trying to get us to lynch her on!!!!!! Seconed she came out to you guys as a investigator type role and would know who is the SCUM on day 2. So to me the only one who would want to come out and reveal knowing this would be the SCUM for they would be scared that she picks the right one tonight and finds out you are SCUM. Therefore by revealing to the town now and getting her lynched, you can save your self for a day or 2 longer. Where as the other town person maybe skeptical of her and her suposed role but I think they would be willing to go along with it, and wait till day 2. Possible reason for taking it on your self to out the masons maybe? ?[/quote] Really, so now you're drinking the "Mitey can find the scum killer by tracking" Kool-Ade as well? Is everyone here just skimming? And as others have said, how can you vote someone for a reason and then do the exact same thing yourself? I have to have a third vote and Hoopy is a placeholder vote. I don't really suspect him, but he hasn't said much in the last 4 pages. He has asked a couple of questions, but hasn't supported any particular side over the others. He might be just waiting for more information or he might be playing it safe. I would like to hear how he feels about the mason situation. (I think I might make a song called 'the mason situation' ) [Blue] Vote Hoopy 3[/color][/quote] Maybe you should call it 'the mason debacle'. I was waiting for more information. I also had a Cocktail/Dinner event for my workplace that went on all evening, so I couldn't get in until now. Odd, one person votes me for being active, another votes me for not. Apparently I can't win either way. But I've chimed in, and I'm going to vote. My third vote is kind of weak sauce, but I still stand by the original statement that your voting pattern where you split the lurkers earlier was just weird. But I find you overall considerably less scummy than the other two. Unvote 1. crazypunkerVote 1. MiteyMouse Vote 2. Shaggy Vote 3. crazypunker[/b]
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 8:22:19 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 30, 2009 8:22:19 GMT -5
there are less than 2 hours before the Dusk No there isn't. There's about 2.5. Dusk ends at 9:43 AM CST. (GMT 3:43 PM)
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 8:29:39 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 30, 2009 8:29:39 GMT -5
And in the future, can we kindly not trigger the countdown without agreement by the players on the whole?
(Yeah, I'm looking at you shaggy.)
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 8:42:38 GMT -5
Post by harmless little bunny on Jan 30, 2009 8:42:38 GMT -5
I have to have a third vote and Hoopy is a placeholder vote. I don't really suspect him, but he hasn't said much in the last 4 pages. He has asked a couple of questions, but hasn't supported any particular side over the others. He might be just waiting for more information or he might be playing it safe. I would like to hear how he feels about the mason situation. (I think I might make a song called 'the mason situation' ) Vote Hoopy 3Maybe you should call it 'the mason debacle'. I was waiting for more information. I also had a Cocktail/Dinner event for my workplace that went on all evening, so I couldn't get in until now. Odd, one person votes me for being active, another votes me for not. Apparently I can't win either way. But I've chimed in, and I'm going to vote. My third vote is kind of weak sauce, but I still stand by the original statement that your voting pattern where you split the lurkers earlier was just weird. But I find you overall considerably less scummy than the other two. Unvote 1. crazypunkerVote 1. MiteyMouse Vote 2. Shaggy Vote 3. crazypunkerI explained why I split them earlier, but it doesn't matter. My reason for voting you is gone now. I don't believe he is scummy, but since Sinjin is the last one to not have complete votes: Unvote Hoopy 3Vote Sinjin 3
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Trepa Mayfield
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 8:45:01 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Jan 30, 2009 8:45:01 GMT -5
I'm hoping that I can track one of the other Masons and see who they target...if that person dies then I found the Scum. Really? I see two major flaws with this: 1) You're expecting that the Mason would be chosen to do the killing. Since you masons are under the impression that the SCUM mason is in communication with the other SCUM, do you really expect they would tap a somewhat exposed Mason to do the killing? SCUM are rarely stupid. 2) Even if they did, you have a 50% chance on odds alone of guessing wrong. But you know what? Those two points above are irrelevant. Because.... 3) The SCUM kill is a joint kill. They don't designate a killer. It's in the opening color. And I've mentioned this fact before. Skim much? A watcher is considerably less useful to Town when scum don't designate the killer. But a watcher is always useful to scum. Particularly one who already knows that two townies have powers (i.e. your fellow masons). Maybe it would be overpowered...if the SCUM were hidden. The fact that a SCUM is exposed among three players is a huge crippling factor. That SCUM likely won't live for long, but maybe long enough to out a fellow mason's power or to see if anyone targets the masons with an investigative ability or some other power. BTW, if we lynch Zeriel, and he is town, I highly suggest no town powers target Ed tonight. Keep yourselves hidden to the tracker. If scum whack Ed, well, they will out a scum. Really, so now you're drinking the "Mitey can find the scum killer by tracking" Kool-Ade as well? Is everyone here just skimming? And as others have said, how can you vote someone for a reason and then do the exact same thing yourself? I have to have a third vote and Hoopy is a placeholder vote. I don't really suspect him, but he hasn't said much in the last 4 pages. He has asked a couple of questions, but hasn't supported any particular side over the others. He might be just waiting for more information or he might be playing it safe. I would like to hear how he feels about the mason situation. (I think I might make a song called 'the mason situation' ) [Blue] Vote Hoopy 3[/color][/quote] Maybe you should call it 'the mason debacle'. I was waiting for more information. I also had a Cocktail/Dinner event for my workplace that went on all evening, so I couldn't get in until now. Odd, one person votes me for being active, another votes me for not. Apparently I can't win either way. But I've chimed in, and I'm going to vote. My third vote is kind of weak sauce, but I still stand by the original statement that your voting pattern where you split the lurkers earlier was just weird. But I find you overall considerably less scummy than the other two. Unvote 1. crazypunkerVote 1. MiteyMouse Vote 2. Shaggy Vote 3. crazypunker[/b][/quote] Um...no, the SCUM designate a killer.
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 8:57:07 GMT -5
Post by harmless little bunny on Jan 30, 2009 8:57:07 GMT -5
I think that part of the opening color was the cause for confusion. I don't really understand what it means, but I guess I know what it doesn't mean.
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 9:17:58 GMT -5
Post by The Real FCOD on Jan 30, 2009 9:17:58 GMT -5
The opening color said night where it should have said, "a joint kill by DAY," meaning the lynch. I fixed it for posterity. Dusk in ~30 minutes. Votes: Player | Vote 1 | Vote 2 | Vote 3 | Aubby | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | brokentree | Zeriel | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | crazypunker | MiteyMouse | Aubby | sinjin | Hal Briston | Zeriel | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | Hoopy Frood | MiteyMouse | shaggy | crazypunker | Kat | MiteyMouse | Aubby | molefan | KidVermicious | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | Merestil Haye | Zeriel | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | misterblocky | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | MiteyMouse | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | molefan | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | Nanook | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | Zeriel | Parzival | roxis | peekercpa | Zeriel | peekercpa | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | Pollux Oil | MiteyMouse | shaggy | brokentree | roxis | MiteyMouse | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | Rysto | MiteyMouse | shaggy | Rysto | Sachertorte | Nanook | Koldanar | Hal Briston | shaggy | Zeriel | Koldanar | shaggy | sinjin | | Parzival | | TDPatriots | MiteyMouse | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | Zeriel | MiteyMouse | crazypunker | brokentree |
Totals: Votee | Total | Voters (#1) | Voters (#2) | Voters (#3) | MiteyMouse | 44 (44) | crazypunker, Hoopy Frood, Kat, molefan, Mr. Special Ed, Nanook, Pollux Oil, roxis, Rysto, TDPatriots, Zeriel | brokentree, Hal Briston, Merestil Haye | Aubby, KidVermicious, misterblocky, MiteyMouse, peekercpa | Zeriel | 36 (36) | Aubby, brokentree, Hal Briston, KidVermicious, Merestil Haye, misterblocky, MiteyMouse, peekercpa, shaggy | Mr. Special Ed, roxis, TDPatriots | molefan, Nanook, Parzival | Mr. Special Ed | 20 (20) | | Aubby, KidVermicious, misterblocky, MiteyMouse, molefan, Nanook, peekercpa | brokentree, Hal Briston, Merestil Haye, Mr. Special Ed, roxis, TDPatriots | shaggy | 7 (7) | | Hoopy Frood, Pollux Oil, Rysto | shaggy | Koldanar | 4 (4) | | Sachertorte, shaggy | | Aubby | 4 (4) | | crazypunker, Kat | | roxis | 3 (3) | Parzival | | | Nanook | 3 (3) | Sachertorte | | | crazypunker | 3 (3) | | Zeriel | Hoopy Frood | Parzival | 2 (0) | | sinjin | | brokentree | 2 (2) | | | Pollux Oil, Zeriel | peekercpa | 2 (2) | | Parzival | | Hal Briston | 1 (1) | | | Sachertorte | molefan | 1 (1) | | | Kat | sinjin | 1 (1) | | | crazypunker | Rysto | 1 (1) | | | Rysto |
Not Voting: Koldanar --FCOD
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 9:18:02 GMT -5
Post by sachertorte on Jan 30, 2009 9:18:02 GMT -5
I lost track of the vote count, and I have group meeting this morning so I'll miss end of Day. My personal opinion is that the mason situation could best be handled by Vigging at night, but that clearly isn't going to happen. Of the three I'll push for the lynch of miteymouse.
Magic Bags don't bother me too much as long as the Bag gets opened with relative haste. The main issue I have is her pushing for a Day Two reveal of the Masons. It's is clearly self-serving so I don't trust that move. On top of that, as many have pointed out, a Tracker can't determine SCUM simply by tracking. Finally, even if she could determine Z or E were SCUM 100% to herself, WE don't know anything. She could still be SCUM just saying that she saw Z or E doing something bad. At best this is bad Town play, at worst it is a SCUM plot. Either way, it is anti-Town.
unvote 2. Koldanar vote 2. miteymouse
I put her in position two because my other two votes are on lurker placeholders. The net effect is the same as if I voted 1.MM, 2.SpEd. 3. Z.
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 9:19:10 GMT -5
Post by The Real FCOD on Jan 30, 2009 9:19:10 GMT -5
D'oh! Votes: Player | Vote 1 | Vote 2 | Vote 3 | Aubby | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | brokentree | Zeriel | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | crazypunker | MiteyMouse | Aubby | sinjin | Hal Briston | Zeriel | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | Hoopy Frood | MiteyMouse | shaggy | crazypunker | Kat | MiteyMouse | Aubby | molefan | KidVermicious | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | Merestil Haye | Zeriel | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | misterblocky | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | MiteyMouse | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | molefan | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | Nanook | MiteyMouse | Mr. Special Ed | Zeriel | Parzival | roxis | peekercpa | Zeriel | peekercpa | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | MiteyMouse | Pollux Oil | MiteyMouse | shaggy | brokentree | roxis | MiteyMouse | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | Rysto | MiteyMouse | shaggy | Rysto | Sachertorte | Nanook | MiteyMouse | Hal Briston | shaggy | Zeriel | Koldanar | shaggy | sinjin | | Parzival | | TDPatriots | MiteyMouse | Zeriel | Mr. Special Ed | Zeriel | MiteyMouse | crazypunker | brokentree |
Totals: Votee | Total | Voters (#1) | Voters (#2) | Voters (#3) | MiteyMouse | 46 (46) | crazypunker, Hoopy Frood, Kat, molefan, Mr. Special Ed, Nanook, Pollux Oil, roxis, Rysto, TDPatriots, Zeriel | brokentree, Hal Briston, Merestil Haye, Sachertorte | Aubby, KidVermicious, misterblocky, MiteyMouse, peekercpa | Zeriel | 36 (36) | Aubby, brokentree, Hal Briston, KidVermicious, Merestil Haye, misterblocky, MiteyMouse, peekercpa, shaggy | Mr. Special Ed, roxis, TDPatriots | molefan, Nanook, Parzival | Mr. Special Ed | 20 (20) | | Aubby, KidVermicious, misterblocky, MiteyMouse, molefan, Nanook, peekercpa | brokentree, Hal Briston, Merestil Haye, Mr. Special Ed, roxis, TDPatriots | shaggy | 7 (7) | | Hoopy Frood, Pollux Oil, Rysto | shaggy | Aubby | 4 (4) | | crazypunker, Kat | | roxis | 3 (3) | Parzival | | | Nanook | 3 (3) | Sachertorte | | | crazypunker | 3 (3) | | Zeriel | Hoopy Frood | Parzival | 2 (0) | | sinjin | | Koldanar | 2 (2) | | shaggy | | brokentree | 2 (2) | | | Pollux Oil, Zeriel | peekercpa | 2 (2) | | Parzival | | Hal Briston | 1 (1) | | | Sachertorte | molefan | 1 (1) | | | Kat | sinjin | 1 (1) | | | crazypunker | Rysto | 1 (1) | | | Rysto |
Not Voting: Koldanar --FCOD
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 9:24:48 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 30, 2009 9:24:48 GMT -5
there are less than 2 hours before the Dusk No there isn't. There's about 2.5. Dusk ends at 9:43 AM CST. (GMT 3:43 PM) D'oh! I don't know how I saw CST when it clearly said EST.
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 9:29:48 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 30, 2009 9:29:48 GMT -5
The opening color said night where it should have said, "a joint kill by DAY," meaning the lynch. I fixed it for posterity. Sure, invalidate a large part of my case by clarifying confusing color the opposite way of how I read it. (I stand by my other two points, though). Was anyone else under the impression that scum designated their killer? If so, why? What did I miss that indicated such, since even the publicly posted scum PM doesn't really say they do?
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 9:32:45 GMT -5
Post by roxis on Jan 30, 2009 9:32:45 GMT -5
I was under the same impression as you because of the color.
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Day 1
Jan 30, 2009 9:43:13 GMT -5
Post by The Real FCOD on Jan 30, 2009 9:43:13 GMT -5
That's it for toDay.
--FCOD
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