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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 14:49:58 GMT -5
Post by Hal Briston on Mar 18, 2008 14:49:58 GMT -5
As a corollary to this point, we also cannot assume even if they are masons that they are on our side. It would certainly fit the theme of this game to have a seperate mason win condition. I have a fearless prediction (otherwise known as a half-assed guess): This will be like M3 -- the masons can win with town, or they can shoot for an individual victory. However, they're not alone...they're henchmen for a specific player (one of the biggie villains). How it all works gamewise, I couldn't tell you, but for flavor it makes the most sense (especially if mole is being straight about them having lousy role names).
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:09:09 GMT -5
Post by Rysto on Mar 18, 2008 15:09:09 GMT -5
As a corollary to this point, we also cannot assume even if they are masons that they are on our side. It would certainly fit the theme of this game to have a seperate mason win condition. Personally, I'd call such a group a scum group rather than a mason group, but that's just terminology and not particularly important.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:15:34 GMT -5
Post by tdpatriots12 on Mar 18, 2008 15:15:34 GMT -5
Eh, this post has more to do with speculation regarding the roles in this game than actually finding scum, but since I'm bored in class and Hal Briston raised it I might as well post my thoughts. if mole is being straight about them having lousy role names). I'm thinking that the masons are the police. All the other significant groups in Batman canon are represented. Batman we know is scum. His primary targets are usually crazies like Joker and Penguin and they are probably the town (or town-ish). But it would make sense, the masons being cops, if they had generic names. Cops are often identified with <rank> <lastname> so if molefan is Officer Lame, we're going to know his role is police. Even if they don't have their job title or rank in their names, the "generic" or "normal" nature of their names alone, like "James Gordon" might betray them. Given what molefan said about name-claiming, I bet he's closer to Officer Lame. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotham_City_Police_Department#Current_roster
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:17:27 GMT -5
Post by tdpatriots12 on Mar 18, 2008 15:17:27 GMT -5
No idea what happened there, will PM Dio. My NoScript (I guess?) was acting up and apparently "preview" wasn't doing what I told it to. Good thing I had already written most of it and the content didn't really change.
Roosh's Mod Note: The Triple post above will be deleted, and only 1 copy will be kept. Remember, a Neat Asylum is a Happy Asylum! Cheers!
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:22:57 GMT -5
Post by Hawkmod on Mar 18, 2008 15:22:57 GMT -5
Eh, this post has more to do with speculation regarding the roles in this game than actually finding scum, but since I'm bored in class and Hal Briston raised it I might as well post my thoughts. if mole is being straight about them having lousy role names). I'm thinking that the masons are the police. All the other significant groups in Batman canon are represented. Batman we know is scum. His primary targets are usually crazies like Joker and Penguin and they are probably the town (or town-ish). But it would make sense, the masons being cops, if they had generic names. Cops are often identified with <rank> <lastname> so if molefan is Officer Lame, we're going to know his role is police. Even if they don't have their job title or rank in their names, the "generic" or "normal" nature of their names alone, like "James Gordon"might betray them. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gotham_City_Police_Department#Current_rosterExcept the alleged masons would be villians. It does not seem logical that a police scum group would be separate from Batman and Co.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:27:40 GMT -5
Post by tdpatriots12 on Mar 18, 2008 15:27:40 GMT -5
Except the alleged masons would be villians. It does not seem logical that a police scum group would be separate from Batman and Co. There's little in the Batman universe I'm familiar with (but I'm no expert) to assume that the cops are going to be completely in league with the Bat, besides Commissioner Gordon. But I wasn't intending to turn this thread into a discussion of Batman canon or hypothesizing about the potential role of masons (although that might be tangent to finding scum).
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:29:06 GMT -5
Post by storyteller0910 on Mar 18, 2008 15:29:06 GMT -5
Y'know...
One possibility that would answer a lot of the issues so far would be if Batman is not the scum in this game. What if Batman is more of an SK figure - like the Rogue Blade Runner in my game, with investigative and killing powers but no connection to anyone else?
And then, the actual scum - the ones analogous to the Mafia or the Werewolves - are just canonical villains, same as the Town. So there would be no Robin or Gordon or whatever; it would be (say) the Joker, Harley Quinn, and the Riddler (scum) versus the rest of the Rogues Gallery.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:32:21 GMT -5
Post by storyteller0910 on Mar 18, 2008 15:32:21 GMT -5
Nope, never mind, it doesn't fit with the opening color. Oh, well. I liked the idea.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:33:51 GMT -5
Post by ryjae on Mar 18, 2008 15:33:51 GMT -5
We're assuming all we have been told to be truth. That's fine for now but if we are going to believe this* we need to start discussing another plan of attack.
* Not saying we all, or I, believe everything thats been played out so far.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:36:58 GMT -5
Post by tdpatriots12 on Mar 18, 2008 15:36:58 GMT -5
Maybe I shouldn't have expanded on Hal's post. Batman and his ilk have been around since 1939, that's over 60 years of characters, alliances, and situations (not to mention reboots and times they tossed continuity out the window) from RoOsh and Dio to draw inspiration from. We could spend weeks trying to figure out exactly who is aligned with who and why. But it would be a dangerous sidetrack. It's easy for scum to hide in a debate over which side Two-Face is gonna take.
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Koldanar
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:43:08 GMT -5
Post by Koldanar on Mar 18, 2008 15:43:08 GMT -5
I would like to bring a question to the listed (insane) masses....roOsh and co. are running a bastard mod platform, would it be like them to lie in the role PMs? Not about your role, or powers, but about other details listed? Can we put that past them?
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RoOsh
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:46:12 GMT -5
Post by RoOsh on Mar 18, 2008 15:46:12 GMT -5
:Hugs storyteller0910:
My, you've all had a rough Day so far! Stay happy though! As we would love a nice clean game (I'm sure Dio would like that too, even if he IS yelling about trying to kill one and all of you). If anyone has a problem with someone, lets be nice about it, and apologize out of game or such for any issues. This is just a game after all. ;D
Play nice, kiddies, and have fun!
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:50:30 GMT -5
Post by Rysto on Mar 18, 2008 15:50:30 GMT -5
Well, I for one am going to trust that the Mods wouldn't directly lie to us. They might attempt to mislead or lie by omission, but I don't think that they'd tell out-and-out falsehoods to us.
I'm rather curious as to what's in your role PM that you think the Mods might be lying about.
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Koldanar
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:51:42 GMT -5
Post by Koldanar on Mar 18, 2008 15:51:42 GMT -5
Honestly, nothing. But I've never even sidelined on a Bastard mod game. I was wondering whats fair
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 15:56:48 GMT -5
Post by brewha on Mar 18, 2008 15:56:48 GMT -5
Well, I'm at a loss here. Talking is the only way to get any info out of anyone. At least talking about role revelations got some converstation going.
It seems we've come to a screeching halt here - which isn't all bad. I probably would've have been fired if I had to keep up the pace that we were at.
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Koldanar
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:05:27 GMT -5
Post by Koldanar on Mar 18, 2008 16:05:27 GMT -5
Hell I feel so just...left behind. I got to make a few comments in there but they were just breezed (or steamrolled) over by the masses on our Mole's ass.
I want to go back to something for a second though. A few have been mentioning that there might be more than one thing (scum vs. town) going on here. Here we are on day one, and we need something to discuss. Batman is a vigilante, so he may or may not be working with the cops. Who is to say there aren't villains in here that aren't town oriented as well; they might have their own agendas to pursue.
Forgive me if this has been brought up, but holy jesus batman, 11 pages on day 1 !
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:07:14 GMT -5
Post by NAF1138 on Mar 18, 2008 16:07:14 GMT -5
Honestly, nothing. But I've never even sidelined on a Bastard mod game. I was wondering whats fair A real bastard mod game, all is fair as long as it is fun/funny. This, I am guessing, is not a real bastard mod game, but just a wacky game that may have some slightly unfair elements in it. If this is a true bastard mod game the mods have been surprisingly hands off till this point.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:09:40 GMT -5
Post by NAF1138 on Mar 18, 2008 16:09:40 GMT -5
Hey Story, what do you think of this instead of a name claim...we have explicitly been allowed to quote the mods...what if we all claim out win condition as stated in the pm?
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:21:42 GMT -5
Post by Rysto on Mar 18, 2008 16:21:42 GMT -5
I can see two outcomes from that:
a) The wording of win conditions varies between different town members. The claim doesn't do us much good. b) We have identical wordings of win conditions. The claim only helps us if a scum is randomly selected first.
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Koldanar
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:23:45 GMT -5
Post by Koldanar on Mar 18, 2008 16:23:45 GMT -5
I can see two outcomes from that: a) The wording of win conditions varies between different town members. The claim doesn't do us much good. If they're still the same win conditions, that should be determinable, no? What I would be more worried about is the scum / any other factions waiting, then just copying the town win conditions. This would be something I'd want done randomly.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:24:39 GMT -5
Post by Rysto on Mar 18, 2008 16:24:39 GMT -5
My point there is, if the wording is different then the scum could just make it up and we'd have no idea.
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Koldanar
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:29:56 GMT -5
Post by Koldanar on Mar 18, 2008 16:29:56 GMT -5
Fair enough, but if the win statements are consistent, we gain information. If they're inconsistent, we should be able to see that and throw the information away.
Then again we all tend to latch on like some sort of rabid wolverine and don't let go of issues easily either.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:30:22 GMT -5
Post by NAF1138 on Mar 18, 2008 16:30:22 GMT -5
My point there is, if the wording is different then the scum could just make it up and we'd have no idea. So then no loss no gain. I do wonder if there is any way to do it so there is a guaranteed gain. I am not sure that there is.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:38:10 GMT -5
Post by Rysto on Mar 18, 2008 16:38:10 GMT -5
So then no loss no gain. I do wonder if there is any way to do it so there is a guaranteed gain. I am not sure that there is. Well, supposing that you and mole have identical win conditions, and a couple of other people claim to have the same one, but it's different from everybody else's? It'd be pretty obvious who the Masons are, wouldn't it?
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:39:35 GMT -5
Post by NAF1138 on Mar 18, 2008 16:39:35 GMT -5
So then no loss no gain. I do wonder if there is any way to do it so there is a guaranteed gain. I am not sure that there is. Well, supposing that you and mole have identical win conditions, and a couple of other people claim to have the same one, but it's different from everybody else's? It'd be pretty obvious who the Masons are, wouldn't it? Dammit! Stop poking holes in my perfectly good plan! Hrmm...ok, so maybe it was not a great plan. Anyone else got ideas on how to break the game?
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:50:36 GMT -5
Post by brewha on Mar 18, 2008 16:50:36 GMT -5
Build a bridge out of her!
Sorry, that's all I got.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 16:58:30 GMT -5
Post by ryjae on Mar 18, 2008 16:58:30 GMT -5
I'd personally like some experienced views on how many "groups" there are. I am following the game on the other board but have never played before so wouldn't mind some background. I was operating under the impression, scum and town, until reading many of your posts earlier in the thread. If there are more than 2 groups what most likely are there goals, are they sorta town, or sorta scum. (Can there actions be totally against both or more for one side than the other etc) I know we cannot delve to deep into because there are other things that need to be hammered out, but a little briefing would be nice.
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Koldanar
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 17:00:36 GMT -5
Post by Koldanar on Mar 18, 2008 17:00:36 GMT -5
Me? I believe there's at least 2 groups opposing town right now.
Why? The way things are worded to me. I'm willing to share that line, but will it honestly help us out?
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 17:12:34 GMT -5
Post by Rysto on Mar 18, 2008 17:12:34 GMT -5
Well, I won't speculate on what's likely, because I'm not Dio or Roosh, but here are the different types of scum groups I've seen in games:
Mafia/Werewolves/Whatever: A group of scum working together. Can night-kill and sometimes have extra powers. They win when they outnumber all other groups, including townies
Serial Killer: A single player who can night-kill. Wins(and everybody else loses) if he's alive when some other group reaches their win condition.
Cabal: From Pleonast's conspiracy game. They won if at least two witches(a town power role) had been killed and at least one of them survived and all of the other scum groups had been wiped out.
I didn't play in any of the themed games here, so I can't tell you about any more exotic scum groups that might arise. And we can't discount the possibility of the Mods inventing something completely new.
My reading of the colour agrees with the information that Koldanar claims: there are at least two "scum" groups out there, and by "scum" I mean the Townie must eradicate them to win.
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Day 1
Mar 18, 2008 17:15:45 GMT -5
Post by NAF1138 on Mar 18, 2008 17:15:45 GMT -5
Me? I believe there's at least 2 groups opposing town right now. Why? The way things are worded to me. I'm willing to share that line, but will it honestly help us out? My PM says a similar something. So I sorta feel the same way.
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