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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 0:43:33 GMT -5
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 22, 2010 0:43:33 GMT -5
I should say inverted gambler's gallacy...or something...
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 1:09:38 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Sept 22, 2010 1:09:38 GMT -5
Marcel may not have done anything blatantly scummy, but all of his positions, and now his play is flat out anti-town. Vote: MARCEL You think me to be scum, as indicated by your vote. Yet, I voted for myself as well. Is that play anti-town too ? Seems flat-out has a few bumps in it. Boy, you already drank half your glass there Paul. Not to worry, plenty more where that came from. Wine for everyone, on me. No Charge, not even a single copper. Oh, wait, Digger isn't playing in this game. Drat. chitter ::sigh:: chitter chitter chitter Little Indian Girl: Ok, ok, calm down... I'll tell him. Marcel, YES IT'S EXTREMELY ANTI-TOWN! If you are town, then voting for yourself means you are voting for the only person you know isn't scum. Your vote could go towards someone you think is scum, but it's not... it's going to yourself... so yes, your move is very anti-town. The only thing that I think could possibly make sense here, is that you are scum and attempted some convoluted gambit that made sense to you.... but not to anyone else.
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Meeko
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 1:19:50 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 1:19:50 GMT -5
You think me to be scum, as indicated by your vote. Yet, I voted for myself as well. Is that play anti-town too ? Seems flat-out has a few bumps in it. Boy, you already drank half your glass there Paul. Not to worry, plenty more where that came from. Wine for everyone, on me. No Charge, not even a single copper. Oh, wait, Digger isn't playing in this game. Drat. chitter ::sigh:: chitter chitter chitter Little Indian Girl: Ok, ok, calm down... I'll tell him. Marcel, YES IT'S EXTREMELY ANTI-TOWN! If you are town, then voting for yourself means you are voting for the only person you know isn't scum. Your vote could go towards someone you think is scum, but it's not... it's going to yourself... so yes, your move is very anti-town. The only thing that I think could possibly make sense here, is that you are scum and attempted some convoluted gambit that made sense to you.... but not to anyone else. ::: Does Neo's Bullet Time Routine ::: What's really going to bake your noodle later on, is would you guys have voted me, if I hadn't said anything? Oh, and let's double up, nah we can do better..... triple up on the Wine: I'm Non-vanilla Town. I know I will learn something from this. I just hope you guys are at least open to seeing what it is you all need to learn.
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Meeko
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 1:42:50 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 1:42:50 GMT -5
::: Pushes an imaginary button on the table ::
Blockey's restriction is getting the better of me. I Can't recall who had the quote on the players being more gastard to themselves than the mod ever thought about being.
Didn't want to push this button. But fearing that my Death Reveal won't be given ::
I'm not calling this game gastard. But trust me, I am feeling the paranoia here. [To say nothing about the first day paranoia of pissing off a few Vigs.]
That being said, I want to say Five things:
1. I used my power last night. It worked just as I figured it would. - Even had to ask a couple questions to make sure it was the kill switch I thought it was.
2. Good call on the ability only being a single shot. This is indeed the case.
3. Complete and total hunch, but I am buying in 100% on the fact that there are no vanilla town roles in this game. [Guess I am a dead vanilla walking though.....]
4. Town Vigs, if you are out there, shoot true. I could only do so much.
5. Go Town.
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Meeko
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 1:46:58 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 1:46:58 GMT -5
::: Raises a Finger :::
But yes, I did indeed want votes on me. After all, I voted for myself, right?
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Total Ullz
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 4:30:04 GMT -5
Post by Total Ullz on Sept 22, 2010 4:30:04 GMT -5
You guys just might want to take note of the people voting me. That would be you... I'm not sure what you're doing or why you're doing it this way. Could you please try to explain why you have placed a vote on yourself?
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Natlaw
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 5:24:15 GMT -5
Post by Natlaw on Sept 22, 2010 5:24:15 GMT -5
1. I used my power last night. It worked just as I figured it would. - Even had to ask a couple questions to make sure it was the kill switch I thought it was. Are you claiming that you'll die as a result of using the mass block and that's why we should lynch you Today? How are we supposed to kill scum if you don't want vigilantes around and you want to lynch town (because they're vigs or going to die anyway)? It is ridiculous but I can see you making this play so I'm actually believing you're telling the truth. But lynching your supposed town self is helping us to find scum how?!
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 6:26:32 GMT -5
Post by sinjin on Sept 22, 2010 6:26:32 GMT -5
Grrrr, I hate playing with nut cases.
Marcel is claiming he did the full on block last night and is now vanilla and apparently doesn't want to play anymore because not everyone agrees with him that vigs should be insta-killed. He's also intimating that those who jumped on his band wagon are scum. Maybe yes maybe no, maybe they are voting for him because they've never played with him before and are overwhelmed by his anti-town behaviour. I personally would like to hit him with a clue stick but I think he's town.
Speaking of clue sticks if monkeypeeks hadn't claimed mason at the last minute, FOR ABSOLUTELY NO GOOD REASON, yesterDay Mr. Stay Puft could have safely targeted me last night. Did you even think about that monkeyboy? If you had claimed anything but mason I would have figured you for scum.
Bah, I'm voting for the same person I voted yesterday for the same reason:
vote Pust/nphase
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:08:41 GMT -5
Post by BillMc on Sept 22, 2010 7:08:41 GMT -5
I really don't like marcel's play at all. If he is telling the truth then using his power last night was pretty anti-town - depriving us of information and essentially doing a day 1 rerun. On the other hand, he could be a miller or bomber and wants to be lynched.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:14:48 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 7:14:48 GMT -5
Could you please try to explain why you have placed a vote on yourself? ::: Looks to Galadriel ::: Even If I do ever understand you guys, you apparently wont be able to understand me. Look back to my 5 things post. I would have thought that would have been enough. Man, you guys would never, ever take the sure thing. Always feel the need to risk something. I really don't get why being conservative sucks this bad. AGAIN : I believe the game to not have any Vanillas. AGAIN : I believe that the Vigs should be taken out first. But it's apparent you guys don't see this. Ok, fine. Ignore the fact that Vigs can and do miss-vig. I will do what I can to stop them. [Check.] I will do what I can to make a conservative vote on Day 2. [Check.] Or do you guys want to mislynch again ? - Yes. I want out of this game. 1. The post restriction sucks ass for me. I'm posting on borrowed time as it is, in limbo between breaking it, and waiting for the Mod to catch up with me. 2. I became vanilla after I used my EMP last night.
2.5 Therefore, IF NOTHING ELSE HAPPENS you guys can vote for me, and you know what? It wont matter in regards to my power. I've already used it, I'm Vanilla
3. You won't have to risk misynching*. [ In terms of playing the game of who has the worst power among a pool of Town. ]
4. I won't be here IRL for a week in October.
5. I actually figured that you guys would have wanted Time. Time to figure stuff out. Time to understand that YES mislynching* is bad.
The way I see it, I gave you guys an extra day, and a person to lynch without worrying about mislynching.
It would figure that people who want to keep Vigs alive don't understand the conservative play.
* Mis-lynch : That is, you guys could chose to vote someone else. And I am flat out telling you, I see that as a worse play, given how I understand the game, and the math in terms of Town players V. Scum. Yes, I know that I'm technically a mis-lynch. Or did you guys skim past the part where I told you I became vanilla, and I am now exploiting that fact?
--
Yes, you guys can record me as voting myself.
I would love to see how you guys will use that information after I'm gone.
Or maybe, you know, you could record EVERYONE ONE ELSE that voted for me, and Dicks and what not would have a good place to start once I'm gone.
What is the point in recording MY name after I'm gone, again?
You guys wouldn't take a free cookie if God himself gave it to you.
For the last time, I tried to make a small foundation of information here, a shelter against being completely random* . A conservative move admist everyone mis-voting, and the inevitable mis-vigging.
I really thought that was obvious.
But no, don't take that cookie. Nothing is as it seems, mafia players must risk everything and overshoot [excuse the pun] things in terms of accepting theings, and in terms of vigging.
* Fuck me, you guys are going to now say "Meeko, you are always random, what do you mean here." because I have to spoon feed everything to you. It's getting old.
Random : lynching TwilightGirl was ""Random"" no real reason to do it.
You guys are gonna go off and Vote other people randomly. Not random in the sense that you guys don't understand me, or how I think. You guys will probably never understand how I think. That's apparent. It bugs me more than you guys, because as I see it, I will never learn how to play a game so............. broken. -- Not over powered mind you, just flat out broken as to PERMANENTLY INSIST that the best play the always the least Optimal.
I put forth a LONG and what I thought was Mutually agreeable post on Expediency.
I REALLY thought that was one of my better posts.
Nope. No one gave a shit, and I got votes on it too.
When will you guys take a cookie from God?
What else do you guys need to know?
Because damn it, I've run out of ways to be conservative here.
And I wonder if that is me as role, or me as Player saying that.
I am doomed to NEVER get this game. And to think, it is because I think too much about things.
Yeah lets go here :: How often has Lynch the Lurker failed you? How often will Scum Bus oither Scum to the point that they start up a bandwagon?
No. Don't consider that both of these """ tactics """ are flawed from the get go.
They have gotten you REAL Far.
[Fuck me. Sarcasm people, Sarcasm.]
Because it is perfectly Sane to do the same things over and over again, expecting different results.
[Double Fuck me if you don't see this one.]
This game is best played by Idiots. Never go for a play that is new or exciting. Never go for a conservative play in exchange for Time.
Because apparently, Town doesn't like time.
And fuck me again if you take that as a slant. Take offense if you want. I don't have words beyond this.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:15:26 GMT -5
Post by storyteller0910 on Sept 22, 2010 7:15:26 GMT -5
Ugh, having a pretty intense week at work. I will definitely make time to read and post later today, and apologize for my inattention so far toDay.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:16:39 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 7:16:39 GMT -5
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:22:48 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 7:22:48 GMT -5
Ugh, having a pretty intense week at work. I will definitely make time to read and post later today, and apologize for my inattention so far toDay. :: Makes a Campain Poster :: Vote Marcel, the Conservative vote.* * In the strictest non-political sense: I'm Liberal, and look at the Libertarians with interest on occasion. I seriously wonder if my life isn't conservative in terms of gambles due to how I was brought up. Screw innate ability, if your uprbring is out of whack, IT WILL Dictate your life after. [Not sure if that is Nature or Nurture] But yeah, if you are never given a chance to naturally flex muscles you are given, and trained by force one way or another into a certain way of thought it will haunt you for the rest of your life. .... Thats waaaay another time, but it is how I feel about things.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:33:23 GMT -5
Post by Drain Bead on Sept 22, 2010 7:33:23 GMT -5
What. The. Fuck.
That having been said, the last time I voted for myself I was angry Town (and the person I got a bunch of bandwagon votes for voting for was Scum), and I'm getting strong frustrated Town vibes off of Marcel. What I don't understand, and would like him to answer for me, was why he chose to blow his wad on Night One.
Oh, and one more thing, Marcel--you are saying that you're not a mislynch. But if you are Town, and the person who was getting the most votes before you lost your shit was Scum or Third Party, do you still think you've been acting in a pro-Town manner?
Daddy bless you, Buddy
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:33:56 GMT -5
Post by Drain Bead on Sept 22, 2010 7:33:56 GMT -5
Crap.
Insert the following into the previous post:
Daddy bless you, Buddy
Daddy bless you, Buddy
Sure thing--- Your Father
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Meeko
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:37:41 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 7:37:41 GMT -5
I really don't like marcel's play at all. If he is telling the truth then using his power last night was pretty anti-town - depriving us of information and essentially doing a day 1 rerun. On the other hand, he could be a miller or bomber and wants to be lynched. :: Looks to Batman :: Did I not hit the "Kill Vigs Now" argument enough for you? Nope, in spite of the fact that everything about this game screams at me that I am quite a bit "" Off "" apparently, you guys continue to talk out of both sides. Either I am someone who, what was the word, .... Inept and really not understanding strategy.... to the [implied point] that I fundamentally don't get this game. OR I am someone, who in spite of tons of evidence against it, Can actually steer the entire game in to what I want. Does a Bomb/Jester have to vote for himself?
Really, I might not know this game, but I know that votes will find me on their own. I wouldn't force the issue if I was a bomb.
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Total Ullz
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:44:39 GMT -5
Post by Total Ullz on Sept 22, 2010 7:44:39 GMT -5
Could you please try to explain why you have placed a vote on yourself? ::: Looks to Galadriel ::: Even If I do ever understand you guys, you apparently wont be able to understand me. Look back to my 5 things post. I would have thought that would have been enough. I did see that post. I even read it. Twice. What I got from it was you claiming to be vanilla Town. Now you seem to put the emphasis on "vanilla" where as I'd like to put it on "Town". So if it all boils down to you being frustrated, I personally think it's more fair to all (including the moderators) that you ask to be subbed. But that just me personally. And just for the record: My remark regarding us looking more closely at you was made tongue in cheek.
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Meeko
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 7:55:55 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 7:55:55 GMT -5
What. The. Fuck. That having been said, the last time I voted for myself I was angry Town (and the person I got a bunch of bandwagon votes for voting for was Scum), and I'm getting strong frustrated Town vibes off of Marcel. What I don't understand, and would like him to answer for me, was why he chose to blow his wad on Night One. Oh, and one more thing, Marcel--you are saying that you're not a mislynch. But if you are Town, and the person who was getting the most votes before you lost your shit was Scum or Third Party, do you still think you've been acting in a pro-Town manner? ::Holds up a few fingers, suggesting he will take them one at a time :: What I don't understand, and would like him to answer for me, was why he chose to blow his wad on Night One. I pissed off a Vig. Paranoia. I have a post restriction. Paranoia and Beat the Clock. I figured if I got my action in before I got my punishment, the action would go through. If I can't kill the vigs, I can at least deprive them of their vigging. [But apparently, this game wants townies dead.]I probably submitted my Night 1 Action PM in under 10 minutes from the start of the night. It might possibly have had a :12 timestamp. Also, How many deaths did I prevent? How many of those were probably going to be Town? But again, you guys don't like time. But, Nope. I'm the villian for this game, and all games. Screw what ever charity I offer. The ""Reason"" that I Actually gave Blockey, in my PM, was that I figured stopping the MOST number of actions with my power would be the BEST use of my power. IIRC, we found out that the game has more than one Vig after, and possibly because of, my actions. Yeah, I would much rather have stopped two mis-viggings NOW than one mis-vig later. [ Obligatory, if not already used pun] : And I have no mis-viggings on that course of action. I would like to think that a TRULY uneventful night would be a boon to town. That Scum pissed themselves at least once since day break. And yes, I wanted some lulz too. But it's apparent that Mafia will never wear a Haggle dress. Did I not earn town a couple of extra days here? Don't all Mafia games work down to "Days Until Ly/Lo ?" [[ I will not use this time to argue for a town compulsory vig lynch. I will not use this time to argue for a town compulsory vig lynch. I will not use this time to argue for a town compulsory vig lynch. I will not use this time to argue for a town compulsory vig lynch. I will not use this time to argue for a town compulsory vig lynch. I will not use this time to argue for a town compulsory vig lynch. ]] -- But if you are Town, and the person who was getting the most votes before you lost your shit was Scum or Third Party, do you still think you've been acting in a pro-Town manner? Let me go look up the term Expedient. Let me go make a VERY long post about being Expedient in light of having very little information [Even if we were on a Normal Day 3 right now, among 25 roles, we would still have relatively little information.] Oh wait, I already argued for Expediency. You might want to go back in read it. I'm not sure how you guys could all skim that big piece of posting real-estate. [Oh hey look, Meeko is a Mime in this game? That would be Ironic, if I didn't already Mute him to begin with..... Fuck me in my attempts to explain my self as it is then. I thought I was fighting uphill so steep it was already 90 degrees. Now you are going to tell me that the hill is invisible too? ] Expediency as it is defined, as it is being used by someone that is town is self serving. YES. I am Acting Pro-Town.
Expedient. On the short term there might be more pro-town moves, to be sure. But Apparently, you can't chose to play it safe. You just fall into being sub-optimal by dumb luck. Not helping my overall opinion of this game. Or at the very least, the ruts that our group continually play in.
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Meeko
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 8:04:25 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 8:04:25 GMT -5
::: Looks to Galadriel ::: Even If I do ever understand you guys, you apparently wont be able to understand me. Look back to my 5 things post. I would have thought that would have been enough. I did see that post. I even read it. Twice. What I got from it was you claiming to be vanilla Town. Now you seem to put the emphasis on "vanilla" where as I'd like to put it on "Town". So if it all boils down to you being frustrated, I personally think it's more fair to all (including the moderators) that you ask to be subbed. But that just me personally. And just for the record: My remark regarding us looking more closely at you was made tongue in cheek. :: Moves the tray of cookies from TotalLost ::: We just had someone pass on the FREE COOKIES here. Something about the cookies not being the right flavor or something. FWIW : I had a few PMs to Mods regarding the fact that I would not be here Mid-October. I had a few PMs to Mods regarding the fact that "I will let you know when I make a move [in regards to my self voting Gambit, or whatever you want to call it] I had a Few PMs to Mods on the order of "It's not you, it's me" in terms of how I Feel about this game. I was of the impression that in light of ALL of that, I Was doing nothing wrong. I really enjoy the flavor of this game, even with the Post restrictions. AGAIN : It would not surprise me that EVERYONE has a power role. Vigs really shouldn't be firing into this party. Someone should argue for that. I will get on that immediately. But apparently, I am taking all the wrong parts of the game too heavily, and other parts too lightly. Apparently we still work at the company party.Fuck me naked, if you guys don't understand that metaphor. Peeker, enjoy your rise back up. It's been fun looking down on you, in more ways than one. I just wish the stay was permanant, and that I wasn't in the process of packing it up.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 8:09:59 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 8:09:59 GMT -5
:: Holds an invisible camera, and hits the shutter :: Gotta love the picture on the Wiki Article. Irony.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 8:19:56 GMT -5
Post by storyteller0910 on Sept 22, 2010 8:19:56 GMT -5
If I can't kill the vigs, I can at least deprive them of their vigging. But apparently, this game wants townies dead. Obviously not. None of us want Townies dead. No one is arguing that your use of your power is anything but pro-Town; a Night without deaths is essentially an extra lynch - that's a great thing! I think some people are arguing that you used the power too soon - but I frankly disagree with them and agree with you. Why conserve the power, when you might die? A Night with no actions will yield roughly the same benefit no matter when it happens (give or take), but if it never happens - if you die or are lynched - then it yields no benefit at all. I think you made the right call here. But I disagree with your stance on Vigs. I think you need to work on accepting that someone can understand your argument, acknowledge your arugment, be smart enough to grasp your argument, and yet still disagree with your argument. Look, Vigs will kill Town. This is certain, assuming Vigs that kill consistently. And for every two Townies killed by a Vig at Night, the Town loses one mislynch from its allotment. That's bad. But now read the next sentence; try to look past the fury you feel that people won't agree with you and think about what I'm saying here: 1. For every two Townies a blundering Vig kills at Night, the Town loses one mislynch from its allotment. 2. But for every Vig that is lynched - as you would have us do - the Town loses one mislynch from its allotment. Ergo: 3. A Vig would have to kill two Townies to do the same damage to Town as we would do by lynching that Vig. 4. A Vig would have to kill FOUR Townies without ever hitting Scum in order to do more damage (in terms of mislynch allotment) than we would do to ourselves by lynching him/her. 5. A mislynch of a Vig has zero upside. Allowing the Vig to live and work as (s)he sees fit has multiple potential pieces of upside: (s)he can eliminate unconfirmeds and narrow the pool of Scum hiding places. And of course, 6. (S)he has an excellent chance of eventually killing Scum. By my rough math, a Vig who attempts a completely random kill every Night for the first three Nights of a fairly standard game has somewhere in the neighborhood of a 65% chance of hitting at least one Scum. Assuming that the Vig isn't a total mook, the actual chance that one out of the first three kills will be Scum is probably closer to 75%. So in summary: lynching a Vig who you believe to actually be a Vig is a very bad idea. You single-handedly do as much damage to the Town's mislynch allotment as the Vig could do in three Nights! And you sacrifice a better than 65% chance that the Vig would actually be beneficial in those three Nights by nailing a Scum. ---- You would get better responses, in general, if you didn't keep assuming that the reason other people disagree with you is because you are right and they are stupid. You want me to change my opinion on lynching Vigs? Take a look at the argument above. I did the math. Screaming, "but the Vig will kill Town!!!!" doesn't move me, because I already accounting for that in my thinking. The Vig will kill Town. Town will kill Town, by lynching, because that's the way the game is structured. You accept short-term failures as building blocks for long-term successes. Honestly, you act as if no Town has ever won a game before. ----------- I'm pretty sure Marcel is Town, y'all. If he's not, this is magical performance art.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 8:39:12 GMT -5
Post by Renata on Sept 22, 2010 8:39:12 GMT -5
I am feeling distinctly unloved. Is it the votes on me yesterday? My unfortunate proscecution of Big Sister? Did the mule piss in somebody’s cornflakes? I’m not doing this for my health, you know. I’m trying to keep us all from being MURDERED IN OUR SLEEP. Maybe spelling it all out in small words will help. And if that doesn’t work, I can summon the Hounds. Why are they looking at me like that? Small words are not a threat. Maybe they think I’m insulting their intelligence. Maybe I am, heehee! <font style="font-size: 12px;">Do you think the cape is a bit much? And would you believe that I don't have a bottle opener on this utility belt? Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;">
Do you think the cape is a bit much?
And would you believe that I don't have a bottle opener on this utility belt?
Oh, wow, Batman? I mean, the Batman? Sir, I just want to tell you that I'm a huge fan--huge fan. I used to read all those comic books when I was a kid. I don't suppose I can get your autograph? hang on, I think I've got something to write on.. lemme see... no, that won't work... maybe... ah, here, my grocery list, yeah, that'll do. I--uh, I don't suppose you have a pen or something to write with? I'm always losing mine, you see... ...No? Nothing at all? Oh, well, that's alright, that's alright. I can come back another time.That's ok, when you come back, I don't suppose you could read us all a chapter of The Princess Bride, you look uncannily like the narrator in that movie. Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> SQUEEK!
(I'm all set)
* holds up small sickle to Batman to use as a bottle opener. Holy Ratman Robin! Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;">Batman: "The green button will turn the car a la escarda o a la drecia." Robin: "To the left or right. Threw in a little Spanish on me, huh, Batman?" Batman: "One should always keep abreast of foreign tongues, Robin." Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;">
Batman: "The green button will turn the car a la escarda o a la drecia." Robin: "To the left or right. Threw in a little Spanish on me, huh, Batman?" Batman: "One should always keep abreast of foreign tongues, Robin."
Are you suggesting that you're orally gifted then Batman?The true crimefighter always carries everything he needs in his utility belt. Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> :: Takes a "" balloon "" from batman's belt and makes it into a balloon animal. :: That wasn't a balloon Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> Okay, I need my mafia-fix now
Could we please move past all the introducing ourselves and get on with playing now? Elves are so darn serious! Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> It's no secret that I'm very often a late voter and therefore I tend to see this behavior as best (:: really, I act in a manner I find okay). Still... based on the costumes and the role-playing I find it a good idea to discuss matters like this once more. So we get it out there: What is color, fun and jokes - and what is "real" play-style and hard-corn mafia? tho isn't that part of the point of a costume game, to play "in character"? Not quite fluff, but almost. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> good idea homicidal maniac.
however, i am going to laugh a touch every time i see billmcbatman. Do you think a tartan cape would be a bit too much? Or would a kilt work with the black rubber/kevlar look? Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> You can play in character all you want to. As long as you remember that you're still responsible for the game you play. This Day started out with a bit of fun, fluff and Halloween-parting. That quite all right.
But we also have to make sure that votes and stuff like smudges or snuggling isn't allowed in the entire game due to "hey, I was just playing in character". I hope you see the difference.
I'm not trying to ruin the fun. But 3 pages of fluff just seems to me as enough. I'm not trying to be a party pooper.
I just really - very much - like it when we also play mafia Of course, engaging my "reading something into everything mafia mode" - that could be read as you fishing for someone to say "oi, it wasn't just fluff". hmmmmmmmm I don’t know what in the Elder Warrens this is. <font style="font-size: 12px;">I said "play in", not "step in"! Fluff. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> Raj finds himself choked up with embarrassment. He is unable to talk for 24 hours from the time of this post.
This was a very lenient Day 1 post restriction punishment. For your random information the mods reserve the right to punish as they see fit in intensity, variation, and variety. In addition not all punishments will be public. KAAAPPOWWWW! Well that at least confirms that there are post restrictions. Obvious sentence is obvious. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> I was planning to vote for Batman yesterday before I ran out of time to post, and I think there's no reason for me not to do that now. Batman has posted five times since things got moving on the game front, and not one of those posts has had any content to it (the closest was something like "well, at least now we know there are post restrictions" after Ramesh was punished). Bill's never been a prolific poster, but this has the look of someone who wants to show himself as present but can't find anything to say.
vote: Bill/Batman Holy post count! ...replays the day on the BatMonitor...HDbyTivo...we're not beyond corporate sponsorship now. ...uh huh...fluff, fluff, hey that Colombo guy is quite funny, so is the guy in the other mask, tho it could do with a wash ...uh huh, has the sound gone? oh no, Ed's just got a post restriction. So a lot of waffle, so in short, your vote looks like someone reaching for reason to vote the Batman. Robin, looking at Batgirl: "You know something, Batman?" Batman: "What's that, Robin?" Robin: "She looks very pretty when she's asleep." Batman: "I thought you might eventually notice that. That single statement indicates to me the first oncoming thrust of manhood, old chum." ....wonders if I should post 1001 Batman quotes just to keep you happy with something to say. Ahah! We have a game-related post, finally, after I chuck on vote on him! Only it boils down to only that there’s been nothing to comment on, which is absurd on its face – if the post restriction discussion was so pointless, then you vote for someone who’s talking about it too much, like I did, you know?; and a complaint that it “looks like” my own vote was only an excuse to vote for “Batman”. And more fluff. So there’s not really any substance there at all – he doesn’t even commit to the OMGUS, not that it would improve the post if he did. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> i also am inclined to let puffy dude live. i mean depending on what happens during the Night then we get some information. if his target goes kaput then most likely scum don't have a redirector (good knowledge by the way). and if it goes wandering around then we just string him tomorrow. or if he fails to kill then maybe we get information about rbs in the game (additional information that is nice to have). and if he doesn't get redirected we can just use him to get rid of lurkers along the way. that way we can focus on the participants who are the most scummy as opposed to deciding on the whole lurker stuff. and the first time that he kills a non lurker we string him.
sorry puffy but at this point your most useful impact, if you live (which i kind of doubt), is going to be helpful busboy. I'd generally agree with that. Killing non-participants is a perfectly good strategy for an sk/compulsory vig. At the start of the game a compulsory vig does result in addtional information for Town - assuming he fesses up on who the target is/was. The flip side however, is that he is more likely to hit town than scum - so it would be unlikely that scum would be pushing for his lynch. More game comment, but there’s no real scum-hunting in it as it is mostly comments on strategy/policy. He sort of gives a bit of town cred (which I don’t think is warranted, but never mind) to the (unnamed) people who are pushing for Stay Puft’s lynch. <font style="font-size: 12px;"> a fullspeed spinny Merry-Go-Round covered in marshymallows, though. That's quite an image - and make me hungry! But as I said, I'm good with keeping the marshmallow around Vote: twilight fangirl His only vote. So to sum up day one: PLENTY of fluff at the outset, so he’s definitely present and willing to make his presence known, but he goes quiet once the actual business of the Day begins. When called on it, he offers a vague OMGUS smudge against the person who voted him. Later, he also offers a vague endorsement of the unspecified people who are pushing for Stay Puft to die. His vote is policy only. That’s IT! There is no scum-hunting here, none. He is not absent; he is making an effort to appear as if he is present and accounted for (he was omnipresent in the first few fluffy pages), but he comments on little that’s actually game-related and commits to nothing at all. Day Two <font style="font-size: 12px;"> Looks like some kind of mass roleblock, then? The only other time I saw one was in the Batman game, and I believe that was a one-shot. Very interesting. The mazalan game had something similar as well. Town motivation for using a mass block...well it keeps folk alive, but would prevent any investigator(s) gaining any information. Scum motivation for using a mass block...possibly that they would be targeted by the marshmallow or that they had attracted too much attention on day 1 and would be a target for an investigator. so a bit of a null tell overall Obligatory comment on the day’s primary oddity that, if it is not a smudge on me or Stay Puft, says nothing at all. Five sentences to say “null tell”. I’m being oversensitive, but my case is a “steaming pile of batshit”. And yet *another* instinuation, without commitment, that I’m acting in a scummy fashion. I also respond to this question, in the very next comment, but Batman doesn’t acknowledge it. <font style="font-size: 12px;">I really don't like marcel's play at all. If he is telling the truth then using his power last night was pretty anti-town - depriving us of information and essentially doing a day 1 rerun. On the other hand, he could be a miller or bomber and wants to be lynched. I swear, calling weird stuff “anti-town” to justify a lynching is the biggest scum scam there is. As Magi of the highly deceptive House of Shadow, I am ashamed for you, Batman. Shadowthrone wouldn't be so unsubtle even on one of his bad days. And they're all bad days, hee. And yet again there’s no vote. Day Two summary: an initial comment that either says nothing or is smudgy, an over-aggressive (and smudgy) response to my vote, a *lack* of response to my answer to his leading question, and a nice little boot to the Marcel bandwagon (again with no vote commitment) to polish it all off. No commitment, no scum-hunting beyond the one question to me (which he didn’t follow up on), focus only on weirdness and “antitown”. Can we get some votes on this sucker, please? Hood’s breath.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 8:49:57 GMT -5
Post by Mahaloth on Sept 22, 2010 8:49:57 GMT -5
Great, now I'm wrestling with this:
Is Meeko(marcel) crafty enough to be scum asking to be killed? Or is he just Town who is tired?
Thing is, Meeko(marcel) has gone on about wanting to die(in game, heh) before. Sometimes, he has claimed games are broken and so forth, even without knowing the setup.
I think we should keep him alive and if he wants out, let him get subbed.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 8:50:00 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Sept 22, 2010 8:50:00 GMT -5
Hmm, so we have a sort of counterclaim on stay puft. I'm not willing to throw my hat in with Raj right now because Raj is Ed and Ed is fond of gambits. I wouldn't put it past Ed to claim vig and try to get stay puft lynched with the follow through of "I guess there was two vigs". Yeah, so color me skeptical on the whole. There is nothing so scummy as trying to get a player that you admit that you think is town, lynched. Marcel, if you believe stay puft is what he claims to be, then you think him town. And you are trying to get a player who you think is town lynched. I can see no protown motivation in that, only pro-scum motivation. All your arguements about how much damage a vig can do sound a lot more like self preservation or scum preservation to me. :: Sets out two dozen Wine Glasses. :: Or you know, it could just be Town preservation. But, the game has turned now. We have crossed the rubicon. UnvoteVote Marcel Much to say, not any of it for now. Cheers. Enjoy the Wine.So long, and thanks for all the fish. i think this is where jesus chimes in.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 8:57:36 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Sept 22, 2010 8:57:36 GMT -5
Grrrr, I hate playing with nut cases. Speaking of clue sticks if monkeypeeks hadn't claimed mason at the last minute, FOR ABSOLUTELY NO GOOD REASON, yesterDay Mr. Stay Puft could have safely targeted me last night. Did you even think about that monkeyboy? If you had claimed anything but mason I would have figured you for scum. vote Pust/nphase<snipped> actually i thought you enjoyed playing with me. and i have my reasons for claiming when i did. i will say that there was a wee bit of disagreement on the mason board but in the end they went along with it.
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Total Ullz
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You can take the girl out of mafia - but you can't take mafia out of the girl
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 8:59:27 GMT -5
Post by Total Ullz on Sept 22, 2010 8:59:27 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure Marcel is Town, y'all. If he's not, this is magical performance art. I tend to agree. But I somehow fail to see why he'd be yelling "Kill the vig so we don't lose townies" and then vote for himself (who I would assume he *knows* the alignment of). The logic seems just as flawed as my own But I read and read and read - and the scum motivation behind what he's done isn't showing up on my screen.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 9:03:44 GMT -5
Post by Mahaloth on Sept 22, 2010 9:03:44 GMT -5
But I read and read and read - and the scum motivation behind what he's done isn't showing up on my screen. Unless he's crazy like a fox. I think he's Town, but I'll fee like an idiot if he just convinced me to not kill him because of his wackiness.
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 9:11:04 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Sept 22, 2010 9:11:04 GMT -5
and i somehow fucked up that last post tremendously.
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Total Ullz
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 9:14:29 GMT -5
Post by Total Ullz on Sept 22, 2010 9:14:29 GMT -5
Can we get some votes on this sucker, please? Hood’s breath. Didn't anyone tell you? We don't vote for Bill until Day 3. Standard procedure! (yes, that was a joke)
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Meeko
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I raccoon it's time to play Mafia
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Day 2
Sept 22, 2010 9:17:48 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Sept 22, 2010 9:17:48 GMT -5
:: Does a Jumping Jack ::
Obviously not. None of us want Townies dead. No one is arguing that your use of your power is anything but pro-Town; a Night without deaths is essentially an extra lynch - that's a great thing!
What of my gambit getting votes to lynch me.
Is there value in that? If you buy on to the fact that I am ex post facto vanilla, is my reasoning to exploit that fact sound? What if there are no pure vanilla townies in the game?
I think some people are arguing that you used the power too soon - but I frankly disagree with them and agree with you. Why conserve the power, when you might die? A Night with no actions will yield roughly the same benefit no matter when it happens (give or take), but if it never happens - if you die or are lynched - then it yields no benefit at all. I think you made the right call here.
Again, I really believe balls to bones here that this game is New York or Las Vegas - The Town Never Sleeps. [That is, again, I think there are a TON of actions that occur at night.]
What do you think about my call to use my power, in light of waiting for an impending punishment from lack of post restriction, and from the legitimate [if not overestimated] paranoia of pissing off a Vig?
But I disagree with your stance on Vigs. I think you need to work on accepting that someone can understand your argument, acknowledge your arugment, be smart enough to grasp your argument, and yet still disagree with your argument.
This would run counter to a majority of what I see. This Utopia sounds wonderful. You and I might could live there, but two people do not a Mafia game make... even If I could shed my reputation.
Would you personally opt for a more conservative move over a "random" move based on information [true or false] given to you? If so, what would be the context leading to that play?
I'm obviously getting now where fast with my crusade. We could hijack this game more that it has been already.
Yes or No Question : Do you think in Principle our group plays Mafia to the best we can possibly be playing it?
Has one event ever TRULY caused Mafia to turn on a Dime? Or has our change been gradual? We cite previous games, but to what end?
Not so sure if I spelled this out yet or not. I didn't think I had to :
There could be a LOT worse people to vote for today. Yes, I'm not scum, but I guess the former of this pair doesn't hold any water at all.
Look, Vigs will kill Town. This is certain, assuming Vigs that kill consistently. And for every two Townies killed by a Vig at Night, the Town loses one mislynch from its allotment. That's bad. But now read the next sentence; try to look past the fury you feel that people won't agree with you and think about what I'm saying here:
1. For every two Townies a blundering Vig kills at Night, the Town loses one mislynch from its allotment.
I barely follow this. Are we arriving at 2 after counting a mis-lynch by town, and a scum NK that successfully hits town ?
That is, I don't follow why this is anything but 1:1
2. But for every Vig that is lynched - as you would have us do - the Town loses one mislynch from its allotment. Ergo:
3. A Vig would have to kill two Townies to do the same damage to Town as we would do by lynching that Vig.
Same argument here as for 1. I bet it has to do with the same issue on the multiples, and not being a 1:1 correspondence.
4. A Vig would have to kill FOUR Townies without ever hitting Scum in order to do more damage (in terms of mislynch allotment) than we would do to ourselves by lynching him/her.
Not sure how to ask this. Let me try : If Vig A has killed 2 Townies, and Vig B has killed 2 townies, would this be identical to Vig A making 4 townie kills?
5. A mislynch of a Vig has zero upside. Allowing the Vig to live and work as (s)he sees fit has multiple potential pieces of upside: (s)he can eliminate unconfirmeds and narrow the pool of Scum hiding places. And of course,
I thought we both agreed that Vigs kill Town. I would like to think that I could understand your Math in grand total at some point. However, it does not remove the fact: To Err is Human.
6. (S)he has an excellent chance of eventually killing Scum. By my rough math, a Vig who attempts a completely random kill every Night for the first three Nights of a fairly standard game has somewhere in the neighborhood of a 65% chance of hitting at least one Scum. Assuming that the Vig isn't a total mook, the actual chance that one out of the first three kills will be Scum is probably closer to 75%.
Eventually. And the spouting of 65 and 75 percent. Why does Town have to roll over and accept these odds? Personally I'm not comfortable with 65%.
I once read that the best Gamblers don't care when they are betting, if the bet has equal chance of 10 bucks or 30 bucks, for a risk of 20.
I would immediately act on an 85% chance at something.
I can understand that you should take 51% or better immediately, but there is a disconnect there for me.
Personally, I therefore dismiss 65% as being closer to 50% than 100%. I would compromise at 75%
So in summary: lynching a Vig who you believe to actually be a Vig is a very bad idea. You single-handedly do as much damage to the Town's mislynch allotment as the Vig could do in three Nights! And you sacrifice a better than 65% chance that the Vig would actually be beneficial in those three Nights by nailing a Scum.
Again, this is assuming a "Normal" game. Correct?
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You would get better responses, in general, if you didn't keep assuming that the reason other people disagree with you is because you are right and they are stupid.
Doesn't make my options less valuable.
You want me to change my opinion on lynching Vigs? Take a look at the argument above. I did the math. Screaming, "but the Vig will kill Town!!!!" doesn't move me, because I already accounting for that in my thinking. The Vig will kill Town. Town will kill Town, by lynching, because that's the way the game is structured. You accept short-term failures as building blocks for long-term successes.
I think we could both agree Mafia is most of the time a Failure.
Honestly, you act as if no Town has ever won a game before.
Honestly, you act as if Town always plays optimally.
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I'm pretty sure Marcel is Town, y'all. If he's not, this is magical performance art.
Can't pass the comment here, that its ironic. But you probably said this to play to that, right?
OOG - Related :
If I can't hack it playing Mafia, do I at least make for acceptable Comic relief? -- Of the Laugh WITH Me variety ?
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