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Post by Holy Moley! on Oct 26, 2011 17:39:46 GMT -5
I'm not really satisfied with ANY of the other Colby votors from yesterday, with the possible exception of Paul (for reasons given above). And my suspicions about the Scathach wagon haven't changed. What? I was never voting for Colby... I was against a Colby lynch.... you lost me here... I just waded through FIFTY-EIGHT posts of yours. I have you and Colby on the brain. And incidentally, when I said it was fun, I was being EXTREMELY IRONIC. AAAAAARGH! Too much mafia... not enough sleep...
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Post by moodymitchy on Oct 26, 2011 17:59:32 GMT -5
I'm listening to everyone's arguments for and against my case on Drain Bead... I still think that due to what I feel was the early "no pressure" claim on Day 1... I'd like more from them.
And as for the No Night kill Night one.... are people really thinking that SCUM chose to target the "claimed" power player... and the Doc did the protecting or was the Doc lucky enough to protect another player whom SCUM targeted or.... even though Drain Bead Feels that there's likely not a role blocker.
If there was one... were they lucky enough to block SCUM kill attempt Night one...
@Paulwhoisaghost my apologies for getting the method of a power wrong... If you feel that I am experienced enough know the difference and am doing this on purpose then please feel free to act on it...
It's late here and I'm just catching up so this might not make much sense but I hope some of it does.
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Post by peekercpa on Oct 26, 2011 20:24:18 GMT -5
I would like to say thank you to you all for your wishes even though you made me cry. What a wonderful family to belong to I would like to re-iterate what Ed said, we suck! 5 Town dead and not one scum uncovered. I want to go and read up on Ginger before I place a vote. catching up. and if you folks can't take a wee bit of fluff then that's your problem. this is one of the tightest and fun communities to be a part of. sure we chop newbies to see if they deserve to be included. but once you are in, well fuck we just lynch or NK your ass.
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Post by LightFoot on Oct 26, 2011 20:51:38 GMT -5
I'm listening to everyone's arguments for and against my case on Drain Bead... I still think that due to what I feel was the early "no pressure" claim on Day 1... I'd like more from them. And as for the No Night kill Night one.... are people really thinking that SCUM chose to target the "claimed" power player... and the Doc did the protecting or was the Doc lucky enough to protect another player whom SCUM targeted or.... even though Drain Bead Feels that there's likely not a role blocker. If there was one... were they lucky enough to block SCUM kill attempt Night one... @ Paulwhoisaghost my apologies for getting the method of a power wrong... If you feel that I am experienced enough know the difference and am doing this on purpose then please feel free to act on it... It's late here and I'm just catching up so this might not make much sense but I hope some of it does. still sick catching up too I am. I DID say something similar to this earlier ( the first part) . sick day and cold meds will probably type more tomorrow ( my time)
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Post by peekercpa on Oct 26, 2011 20:54:38 GMT -5
@ Pollux: well, my first instinct was that Scathach's lynch was a scum setup (right about that one) and that Colby's lynch wagon started too early and was unopposed for too long (apparently I was right about that one too, just wish I'd held my ground on Day Two.) As for DrainBead, my thoughts there haven't changed because the facts haven't. IF the scum were trying to keep one of their own off the block with Scathach's bandwagon then DrainBead is still the most likely candidate - hell, right now she's the ONLY candidate. Of course, we're still not in a position to actually do anything about it, unless she's somehow been confirmed by an investigator role. Nothing she did on Day Two "pinged" me, but that may be because I've been viewing her in the role of probable town tracker. Preconceptions breed more preconceptions. The lynch is still the town's best weapon, and DB is unlynchable, still. This bugs me a great deal. Not because I think she's scum but because I feel as though I'm relying on a role that I'm not even certain exists. What are we supposed to do here? If we think you're some kind of scum, or just not on our team, we kill you off and see what happens. Not an option with DrainBead - the town can't lynch her, and a vig (even assuming we have one) couldn't target her either. just got through with another 12 hour day and 7k pairs of boots. this post just pings the heck out of me. first, scum would know that sasquatch and sturm were not scum. so taking credit for being on the right side of that wagon is null. worse, it smells like scum trying to take credit for shit they would already know. and i know i have been busy but where does drain come off as unlynchable? that's a fucked up power if there is a doc. don't see it. so show me where she says she is unlynchable and then i try to lynch her ass. because, at the risk of repeating myself town wins if that is the case. so therefore she would be full of shit. and what's with this "our team" nonsense? like i said if drain is not lynchable and non Nkable then fuck it i can take the next month off and i win. i'll just go and play on the geeb and wait for my sticker. where the fuck is this conclusion coming from? and if i missed it just kind of point me in the general direction. thanks.
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 26, 2011 21:54:03 GMT -5
I suspect Moley is saying DB is not a viable lynch option at the moment and not that we can't ever consider lynching her ever.
(I apologize for missing the end of day Yesterday. I'm the worst kind of people.)
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Post by moodymitchy on Oct 27, 2011 0:35:30 GMT -5
@peekercpa is Sturm playing this game too now ?
Could I just put my reasoning another way.... If someone claimed Cop on Day one without much pressure on them.... By Day 3 , would we be expecting them to give us their results ? Or would we just let them carry on ?
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Post by Silver Jan on Oct 27, 2011 1:15:44 GMT -5
I have been pondering the no NK on N1 and I haven’t really got an answer as to why scum didn’t get their kill but Sinjin died from poisoning on N2, could she have been a remorseful Vig that flipped Town when she died because she killed another Townie. If that is the case then Scum haven’t yet had a kill and that just seems odd to me. I have also thought that maybe scum can just kill by poisoning which has a delayed effect or that scum could choose either a delayed poisoning or a straight out kill. If that is the case then Scum would have got their 2 Night kills. It doesn’t make sense if they can only use poison though, it would have to be a combination of poison and straight NK. It has made me very curious because the colour does suggest that Sinjin had something to do with Suburban Planktons death, but they were both Town.
I can’t see scum targeting a protected target 2 Nights in a row, the odds of that happening would be quite high I should imagine, maths not being my strong point. I’m not sure what to make of it all at the moment but I find it interesting.
Although I would like to know who DrainBead targeted, just because I am nosy, I don’t think it would help Town right now, if, as she said, her targets didn’t do anything. It would just give Scum more chance to find a Town power role.
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Post by Holy Moley! on Oct 27, 2011 5:43:02 GMT -5
@ Pollux: well, my first instinct was that Scathach's lynch was a scum setup (right about that one) and that Colby's lynch wagon started too early and was unopposed for too long (apparently I was right about that one too, just wish I'd held my ground on Day Two.) As for DrainBead, my thoughts there haven't changed because the facts haven't. IF the scum were trying to keep one of their own off the block with Scathach's bandwagon then DrainBead is still the most likely candidate - hell, right now she's the ONLY candidate. Of course, we're still not in a position to actually do anything about it, unless she's somehow been confirmed by an investigator role. Nothing she did on Day Two "pinged" me, but that may be because I've been viewing her in the role of probable town tracker. Preconceptions breed more preconceptions. The lynch is still the town's best weapon, and DB is unlynchable, still. This bugs me a great deal. Not because I think she's scum but because I feel as though I'm relying on a role that I'm not even certain exists. What are we supposed to do here? If we think you're some kind of scum, or just not on our team, we kill you off and see what happens. Not an option with DrainBead - the town can't lynch her, and a vig (even assuming we have one) couldn't target her either. just got through with another 12 hour day and 7k pairs of boots. this post just pings the heck out of me. first, scum would know that sasquatch and sturm were not scum. so taking credit for being on the right side of that wagon is null. worse, it smells like scum trying to take credit for shit they would already know. and i know i have been busy but where does drain come off as unlynchable? that's a fucked up power if there is a doc. don't see it. so show me where she says she is unlynchable and then i try to lynch her ass. because, at the risk of repeating myself town wins if that is the case. so therefore she would be full of shit. and what's with this "our team" nonsense? like i said if drain is not lynchable and non Nkable then fuck it i can take the next month off and i win. i'll just go and play on the geeb and wait for my sticker. where the fuck is this conclusion coming from? and if i missed it just kind of point me in the general direction. thanks. I will point you at the post I made responding to Paul about this. The first sentence was an editing mistake. I originally wrote that I thought there was no case on Scat or Colby, and was right; I changed the sentence somewhat but forgot to change the "I was right" part. I also clarified the DrainBead thing. For the rest though, you're reaching, Peek... for example, "our team" refers to the town, as I specifically said in the preceding paragraph and the next sentence. There's nothing unclear about that. As for "taking credit", I remember making two or three posts about the difference between "newbie tells" and "scum tells". I also wrote a large analysis of Moody's Colby case and how there was no substance to it. And FYI, I wasn't sure about Scathach at all, nor was I sure about Colby. This wasn't an "Ace" situation where there was one person with eight votes and nobody else had more than one or two with not even an attempt to create an opposing bandwagon. Both Scat's lynch and Colby's were opposed. I never said the two of them were definite town. What I DID say was that the cases on them didn't add up.
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Post by peekercpa on Oct 27, 2011 8:41:12 GMT -5
@ peekercpa is Sturm playing this game too now ? Could I just put my reasoning another way.... If someone claimed Cop on Day one without much pressure on them.... By Day 3 , would we be expecting them to give us their results ? Or would we just let them carry on ? carp on a shingle. s'what i get for playing two games at once and posting on close to zero sleep.
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Post by Deni on Oct 27, 2011 9:37:40 GMT -5
Could I just put my reasoning another way.... If someone claimed Cop on Day one without much pressure on them.... By Day 3 , would we be expecting them to give us their results ? Or would we just let them carry on ? Mostly I would say, yes I would expect results. However, one open game I was playing we had a cop and a doc. Our cop had claimed Day 2 but said nothing until the doc was killed 3 nights later. The difference here is, one, we don't know if we have a doc and second, a tracker isn't going to give us alignment. Interestingly enough if a scum was going to false claim a role a tracker would be a good one, not exactly useful information. I would think if you're willing to claim a role for what ever reason you should be willing to use/share your information with the town. Also my thoughts on the no NK on night one, I think Sister Coyote was night one's NK with a delayed reaction. I have considered that maybe Ed was the orginal target due to his pm "someone loved me more than life itself" but I don't know what kind of role that would be "a redirecting doc"..? Maybe Sister Coyote's death and Special Ed pm aren't related, just throwing my thoughts out there. The colour does make it seem that Suburban Plankton and Sinjin's death's were connected and was Sinjin's fault, but how does that make sense?
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Post by gnarlycharlie on Oct 27, 2011 10:40:37 GMT -5
still catching up.
too bad about Colby. he always gets killed before D3. the one time he did he was killed by an SK named Bill.
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Post by BillMc on Oct 27, 2011 10:55:29 GMT -5
I thought I was misreading the colour where it said Sinjin killed Plankton - decidedly weird. No that's not fishing it's just saying that IF we take what colby11 said as what he felt the numbers were... There's 5 SCUM... we've lost 5 Vanilla TOWN so that leaves what 10 TOWN left... do you really think there's that many powers in there ? . there are bound to be 4 other scum IF Drain Bead is scum. (based on the numbers) I can't see the logic behind Colby's assertion that if Drain is scum there must be 4 others. In a game of 21, we would expect 4 or 5 scum, and possibly third parties. If there are 5 scum, then town would need to have an extra power role to balance it out. So no deaths on N1, but SisC died at the end of D2. So either someone has a day kill, or it was a delayed kill. If it is a town day kill, then I can't see any solid reasoning why someone would use it on SisC, conversely, if the scum had a day kill, then that is a whole lot of extra power, so most likely then only 4 scum. But again, I cant see a good reason why they would use/waste this extra kill on SisC. So I would lean towards a delayed kill. As for Drain, Tracker is an easy one to false claim with, and with zero results, it doesnt add a lot of value to the claim. If she doesn't add value in the coming days then she has got to be lynched, but i see no reason to lynch her today. Pollux's case on Ginger is interesting. I need to have a re-read of d1/d2
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Post by BillMc on Oct 27, 2011 10:56:35 GMT -5
still catching up. too bad about Colby. he always gets killed before D3. the one time he did he was killed by an SK named Bill. I'll take that as a drive by smudge -- yes I killed Colby in Alice - on D2 actually (after failing to kill him on D1) -- after which I fulfilled my wincon - ie kill colby -- and became town.
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Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Oct 27, 2011 14:03:28 GMT -5
I thought I was misreading the colour where it said Sinjin killed Plankton - decidedly weird. No that's not fishing it's just saying that IF we take what colby11 said as what he felt the numbers were... There's 5 SCUM... we've lost 5 Vanilla TOWN so that leaves what 10 TOWN left... do you really think there's that many powers in there ? . there are bound to be 4 other scum IF Drain Bead is scum. (based on the numbers) I can't see the logic behind Colby's assertion that if Drain is scum there must be 4 others. In a game of 21, we would expect 4 or 5 scum, and possibly third parties. If there are 5 scum, then town would need to have an extra power role to balance it out. So no deaths on N1, but SisC died at the end of D2. So either someone has a day kill, or it was a delayed kill. If it is a town day kill, then I can't see any solid reasoning why someone would use it on SisC, conversely, if the scum had a day kill, then that is a whole lot of extra power, so most likely then only 4 scum. But again, I cant see a good reason why they would use/waste this extra kill on SisC. So I would lean towards a delayed kill. As for Drain, Tracker is an easy one to false claim with, and with zero results, it doesnt add a lot of value to the claim. If she doesn't add value in the coming days then she has got to be lynched, but i see no reason to lynch her today. Pollux's case on Ginger is interesting. I need to have a re-read of d1/d2 Tracker is NOT easy to false claim... unless of course you only lie about your alignment and not your role. A scum tracker would have it easy... but if you don't have a tracking ability, then tracker is probably the hardest role to false claim. DB has already told us that his first 2 targets did nothing... either DB hit vanillas, or he hit power roles that didn't act, or DB is lying. If DB is lying, then claiming that his first 2 targets didn't act is dangerous... his targets could easily counter and say they did act and it's all downhill from there for DB. If he names death revealed VTs.... well... then I'd start doubting his claim... until then it gets a grain of salt and my opinion that full reveals at this stage would help scum more than town.
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Post by Drain Bead on Oct 27, 2011 14:09:32 GMT -5
I posted the fact that my results strongly hinted at VT for a reason. I knew that it would likely bring out Scum. As others in this thread have pointed out, the information of who my targets were, once it was known I got "did nothing" results on both, will help Scum infinitely more than it will help Town. Town gets no info about my target's alignment, they just know that the person has no Night power. My targets could still be vanilla Scum, especially if the Scum assign one teammate to do the NK. But the Scum can rule that out, so if my targets were both Town, they'll know to look elsewhere for a Doc or Cop.
I told myself that for this reason, I'd vote for the first person to pressure me for names.
Vote: moodymitchy
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Post by moodymitchy on Oct 27, 2011 14:42:11 GMT -5
I posted the fact that my results strongly hinted at VT for a reason. I knew that it would likely bring out Scum. As others in this thread have pointed out, the information of who my targets were, once it was known I got "did nothing" results on both, will help Scum infinitely more than it will help Town. Town gets no info about my target's alignment, they just know that the person has no Night power. My targets could still be vanilla Scum, especially if the Scum assign one teammate to do the NK. But the Scum can rule that out, so if my targets were both Town, they'll know to look elsewhere for a Doc or Cop. I told myself that for this reason, I'd vote for the first person to pressure me for names. Vote: moodymitchy [/color][/quote] Because you can't build a better case on anyone else or because Honest Moley has already made a slight smudge on me earlier on saying that my case against colby11 (now known to have been TOWN) held little substance... IF not believing your claim makes me SCUM then so be it...
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Post by BillMc on Oct 27, 2011 14:47:58 GMT -5
Tracker is NOT easy to false claim... unless of course you only lie about your alignment and not your role. A scum tracker would have it easy... but if you don't have a tracking ability, then tracker is probably the hardest role to false claim. DB has already told us that his first 2 targets did nothing... either DB hit vanillas, or he hit power roles that didn't act, or DB is lying. If DB is lying, then claiming that his first 2 targets didn't act is dangerous... his targets could easily counter and say they did act and it's all downhill from there for DB. If he names death revealed VTs.... well... then I'd start doubting his claim... until then it gets a grain of salt and my opinion that full reveals at this stage would help scum more than town. As it stands, Drain has provided no other information. So saying "I'm a tracker" and providing no corroborating evidence is an easy claim. Even easier several days in where you can easily claim to have watched folk who are now dead.
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Post by Drain Bead on Oct 27, 2011 14:55:26 GMT -5
Neither of my two targets are currently dead.
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Post by JustBeingGinger on Oct 27, 2011 15:00:39 GMT -5
Pollux could you please state what your case is about me. People are finding it interesting but I don't think it holds weight and would like a refresher on that.
I will ask this of you Bill and Drain you two are the ones that stated it is interesting. What to you is interesting and do you care to elaborate?
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Post by Silver Jan on Oct 27, 2011 16:06:09 GMT -5
Pollux could you please state what your case is about me. People are finding it interesting but I don't think it holds weight and would like a refresher on that. I will ask this of you Bill and Drain you two are the ones that stated it is interesting. What to you is interesting and do you care to elaborate? To be honest, I would love to see a case against you too, so far I haven't found one. The person that is pinging me the most is Moody and next in line is Moley
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Post by LightFoot on Oct 27, 2011 16:10:03 GMT -5
Neither of my two targets are currently dead. Arg there are too many of us in two games YOu can admit that they can't verify your claim because you have not named them. Not pressuring for that = stating a fact.
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Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Oct 27, 2011 16:36:27 GMT -5
Neither of my two targets are currently dead. Arg there are too many of us in two games YOu can admit that they can't verify your claim because you have not named them. Not pressuring for that = stating a fact. Maybe, but it does put more pressure on himself. By telling us they are still alive he eliminates the possibility of claiming he targeted someone that is now dead. It forces him to name someone that can counter his claim if necessary. Which makes it a lot harder for him to be false claiming.
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Post by LightFoot on Oct 27, 2011 16:44:23 GMT -5
Arg there are too many of us in two games YOu can admit that they can't verify your claim because you have not named them. Not pressuring for that = stating a fact. Maybe, but it does put more pressure on himself. By telling us they are still alive he eliminates the possibility of claiming he targeted someone that is now dead. It forces him to name someone that can counter his claim if necessary. Which makes it a lot harder for him to be false claiming. except for the number of words I don't see your comment different from mine.
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Post by Holy Moley! on Oct 27, 2011 17:23:09 GMT -5
Because you can't build a better case on anyone else or because Honest Moley has already made a slight smudge on me earlier on saying that my case against colby11 (now known to have been TOWN) held little substance... Here's what I was referring to: psychopathgame.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=gotopost&board=paranoia&thread=1751&post=82903Off the top of my head I can't recall anything else you posted in the first two days or so that "pinged" me about you, but your Colby case did. FTR I apologise for the smudge, assuming you're not "playing for keeps". I don't think you're scum, largely because I think Texcat probably is, and I can't see you two on the same team. Also, regarding this... still catching up. too bad about Colby. he always gets killed before D3. the one time he did he was killed by an SK named Bill. I'll take that as a drive by smudge -- yes I killed Colby in Alice - on D2 actually (after failing to kill him on D1) -- after which I fulfilled my wincon - ie kill colby -- and became town. This was the first thing I thought of about Sinjin's reveal. Don't see anybody coming forward with a way to confirm it though.
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Post by texcat on Oct 27, 2011 19:08:58 GMT -5
I'm listening to everyone's arguments for and against my case on Drain Bead... I still think that due to what I feel was the early "no pressure" claim on Day 1... I'd like more from them. Why do you persist in saying that it was a no pressure claim? This from our mod, with less than an hour to go: 56 by mine. Doing a vote count right now, although a cursory glance tells me with these votes that Drain Bead would be lynched. and the next post was 7 minutes later, from Drain: I'm the Town Tracker. Unvote someone. It seems clear that Drain must have thought she was going to be lynched. That seems like a pressure situation, not "no pressure" as you keep saying.
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Post by Drain Bead on Oct 27, 2011 20:01:19 GMT -5
I'm a her.
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Post by Drain Bead on Oct 27, 2011 20:09:55 GMT -5
I'm listening to everyone's arguments for and against my case on Drain Bead... I still think that due to what I feel was the early "no pressure" claim on Day 1... I'd like more from them. Why do you persist in saying that it was a no pressure claim? This from our mod, with less than an hour to go: and the next post was 7 minutes later, from Drain: I'm the Town Tracker. Unvote someone. It seems clear that Drain must have thought she was going to be lynched. That seems like a pressure situation, not "no pressure" as you keep saying. Thank you for pointing that out again. Both LightFoot and moodymitchy seem to think that a claim there was inappropriate. It was pretty much my only choice at that point. There wasn't enough time left in the Day to fuck around. Perhaps if I'd known that our mod was wrong I'd have abstained, but then if I picked up another vote my claim would have been even more "11th hour" and I might not have gotten enough unvotes to live. I find the aforementioned two posters' mischaracterizations of what happened at the end of Day 1 to be very suspicious.
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Post by LightFoot on Oct 27, 2011 20:16:51 GMT -5
Why do you persist in saying that it was a no pressure claim? This from our mod, with less than an hour to go: and the next post was 7 minutes later, from Drain: It seems clear that Drain must have thought she was going to be lynched. That seems like a pressure situation, not "no pressure" as you keep saying. Thank you for pointing that out again. Both LightFoot and moodymitchy seem to think that a claim there was inappropriate. It was pretty much my only choice at that point. There wasn't enough time left in the Day to fuck around. Perhaps if I'd known that our mod was wrong I'd have abstained, but then if I picked up another vote my claim would have been even more "11th hour" and I might not have gotten enough unvotes to live. I find the aforementioned two posters' mischaracterizations of what happened at the end of Day 1 to be very suspicious. Hooray for you. What I said and re stated was the truth. I'm assuming you read my comment when you didn't like mine. In that moment your claiming was all you could do. That changes NOT the timing ( through perhaps no fault of your own) or my lack of open arms acceptance of same. I ain't givin you an ice cream cone for claiming when you discovered you were about to be lynched.
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 27, 2011 21:13:05 GMT -5
I don't understand what's got feathers so ruffled about this. Town or scum, drain's gonna do approximately the same thing either way so a claim by itself is a null tell. Which means we should not be treated Drain as if she were confirmed town but neither should we be sharpening our lynching sticks. When someone claims, the best course of action, in my opinion is to nod and file the claim away. When more claims are made and there is more discussion of night time activities then we can take all the claims out and compare them. Perhaps Drain's will stand up or perhaps she'll be called out on lies. Either way, making plans to kill her now is foolish. You don't lynch claimed roles without more than gut feelings and general paranoia.
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