|
Post by Hal Briston on Oct 8, 2007 17:44:54 GMT -5
I've got scored as: drain - 9 Cookies - 5 mhaye - 1 I'm leaning toward changing my Cookies vote, but I'm waiting to hear back from the mods on a rules clarification before doing so.
|
|
|
Post by dnooman on Oct 8, 2007 17:46:01 GMT -5
Vote DrainBead
I'm basing this off of the assumption that both she and Cookies can't both be telling the truth, plus I've gotten a scum vibe from her for quite some time now. I guess we'll see.
|
|
|
Post by NAF1138 on Oct 8, 2007 17:46:17 GMT -5
I've got scored as: drain - 9 Cookies - 5 mhaye - 1 I'm leaning toward changing my Cookies vote, but I'm waiting to hear back from the mods on a rules clarification before doing so. Did you count FCoD's vote for drain twice or did I miss a vote?
|
|
|
Post by dnooman on Oct 8, 2007 17:48:19 GMT -5
Hmm, we'd best get that discepancy rectified before someone unintentionally hammers, or means to but doesn't.
|
|
|
Post by dnooman on Oct 8, 2007 17:48:49 GMT -5
discrepancy even.
|
|
|
Post by NAF1138 on Oct 8, 2007 17:53:05 GMT -5
I am 99% sure that my count is accurate (by cross referencing Hal's spreadsheet) but if Hal saw one I missed I am happy to correct my count.
|
|
|
Post by Hal Briston on Oct 8, 2007 17:54:24 GMT -5
My screwup -- NAF's count is correct.
I gotta put a disclaimer on that sheet...
|
|
|
Post by NAF1138 on Oct 8, 2007 17:54:39 GMT -5
9- drainbead (Captain Spaceman Blam, Idle Thoughts, Cookies, atarus, Yattara/zeriel, Roosh, FCoD, CiaS, dnooman)
5- ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (Captain Klutz, drainbead, Pygmy, Hal Briston, Diomedes)
1- mhaye (hockeymonkey)
15 out of 23 votes cast with 23 alive it takes 12 to lynch
Meh, let's just call Hal psychic.
|
|
RoOsh
FGM
Former BatMod
[on:Wanna see a magic trick?][of:See You, Space Cowboy....]
Posts: 284
[ Exalt | Smite ]
Karma:
|
Post by RoOsh on Oct 8, 2007 18:11:26 GMT -5
That 1/x thing is an interesting point, dotchan, as a reason for why Cookie could have conducted a night action still. However, if it DID fail, the only way it'd do so, is if Cookies was scum (as i understand it).
So I'm willing to chance that risk. Because if we don't get the scum today, tomorrow we should have them.
Just out of curiosities sake: How do you feel about this 50-50 scenario? The question to both Drainbead and Cookies, basically how sure are you of the other's scumminess, is it worth your own life?
|
|
Death By Irony
FGM
The Former Mandate of Heaven/Current Gastard Night Mod
I'm my own mind-altering substance!
Posts: 109
[ Exalt | Smite ]
Karma:
|
Post by Death By Irony on Oct 8, 2007 18:41:27 GMT -5
That 1/x thing is an interesting point, dotchan, as a reason for why Cookie could have conducted a night action still. However, if it DID fail, the only way it'd do so, is if Cookies was scum (as i understand it). The way I read it was that she has a 1/x chance of blocking ANYBODY - but the chances goes up as the scum die. So right now my head hurts from the WIFOM: is drain bead telling the truth, and she will become a powerful protown role late in the game, or is she lying because she can excuse herself for failures for a couple of Days? Well, as far as straight suspicion goes, I'm leaning towards drain bead, but her claim gives me pause. As someone else has already mentioned, we're basically looking at four scenarios right now: 1) Both drainbead and Cookies are telling the truth: drain bead's block failed (very possible) or she herself was blocked (not very likely, but until we have a better idea of what other roles are in the game I'm not ruling this out yet). Obviously lynching either one of them would be very bad in this case, especially if we just wagon the other one on the next Day convinced that we have caught the lying scumbag. 2) drain bead is lying. She is either a scummy roleblocker (in which case she needs to die ASAP, even if her power does have a fractional success rate) or a run-of-the-mill goon. 3) Cookies is lying. She is either some kind of character specific killing role or a Lyncher. Neither of these possibilities would suggest that she is a protown role. 4) BOTH are lying, so that if one of them dies and is revealed as scum, the other gains massive townie cred. Or, both are selfish self-preserving townies so convinced the other is scum that they're willing to risk their own necks to implicate the other. (Less likely and incredibly dumb on their part to try it, but I've seen crazier gambits.) My roommate thinks I should play a different game...this one's making me paranoid...
|
|
|
Post by Drain Bead on Oct 8, 2007 18:58:41 GMT -5
That 1/x thing is an interesting point, dotchan, as a reason for why Cookie could have conducted a night action still. However, if it DID fail, the only way it'd do so, is if Cookies was scum (as i understand it). So I'm willing to chance that risk. Because if we don't get the scum today, tomorrow we should have them. Just out of curiosities sake: How do you feel about this 50-50 scenario? The question to both Drainbead and Cookies, basically how sure are you of the other's scumminess, is it worth your own life? If I go to the gallows Today, at least I know that Tomorrow, Cookies is a goner. I look at this in the same way as I'd view trading a Vig for a scum...my role is an ostensibly pro-town role that could end up hurting town immensely if I screw up. If it means that I go out to get rid of scum Cookies, so be it.
|
|
Hockey Monkey!
Borogrove
This is supposed to be a happy occasion. Let's not bicker over who killed who.
Posts: 371
[ Exalt | Smite ]
Karma:
|
Post by Hockey Monkey! on Oct 8, 2007 19:00:39 GMT -5
Unvote Mhaye Looks like that is not a lynch that is going to happen today.
Between drainbead and Cookies, I think that drainbead is the scummier of the two. Cookies claim was just too damned detailed for me to think it was made up.
vote drainbead
|
|
RoOsh
FGM
Former BatMod
[on:Wanna see a magic trick?][of:See You, Space Cowboy....]
Posts: 284
[ Exalt | Smite ]
Karma:
|
Post by RoOsh on Oct 8, 2007 19:04:20 GMT -5
Hey Drainbead, Dotchan brings up an odd but good point: how's that 1/x thing work?
is the blocking in regards to everyone or to just Scum? Ie: does your role really suck that badly??? Because dotchan's views on the role seem crazy to me.
|
|
|
Post by whatthefrak on Oct 8, 2007 19:30:15 GMT -5
I believe this is going to bring the count to 11.
I'm Voting for Drainbead for one reason that several have touched on...the slim chance that both cookies and her claim are true and another of my own. At the beginning of both days Drain comes out with some really great questions about what could have happened overNight. They're questions that lead me to believe she actually knows what happened.
Please no one else have voted while I was typing this
|
|
Gir!
FGM
EVIL Demon Goddess Mod
What? Kat is sweet and innocent!
Posts: 691
[ Exalt | Smite ]
Karma:
|
Post by Gir! on Oct 8, 2007 19:43:27 GMT -5
Last Minute Vote Count: drainbead (11): Captain Spaceman Blam, Idle Thoughts, Cookies, atarus, zerielV2, Roosh, FCoD, CiaS, dnooman, hockeymonkey, whatthefrak Cookies (5): Captain Klutz, drainbead, Pygmy Rugger, Hal Briston, Diomedes
16 of 26 votes cast.
|
|
|
Post by dnooman on Oct 8, 2007 19:49:06 GMT -5
Hey Pygmy, what's a tool commonly used for driving nails into things and otherwise impacting force on them? Ham-sammich, no. Ham-fisted, no. Ham-radio, no. Errrr...
This is all meant in good fun of course
|
|
Merestil Haye
FGM
Grudge Keeper
[on:Slumming it in the Middle-Earth][of:In the halls of Manw
Posts: 1,077
[ Exalt | Smite ]
Karma:
|
Post by Merestil Haye on Oct 8, 2007 19:49:49 GMT -5
Roosh, here is what Drainbead said about her role. I am Kaylee Frye, Roleblocker. I am aligned with Crew, I win when all Alliance are dead. Once per night I may use my skills to trap a person in their room, blocking their night action. I have a 1/x chance of blocking a Night kill if I block scum, with x being the number of remaining Alliance. I think that's quite clear, even at 1:30am. DB claims that if she blocks a member of a group, then she has a 1/x chance of blocking that group's Night action, where x is the number of living players in the group. It's just that most town-aligned roles are solo jobbies and thus blocking the roleholder completely blocks the action. I'm trying to analyse the interactions of the roleclaims, and I must say I'm having a hard job believing DBs right now. I still need to think a bit before hammering the last nail though. And at 2am with a 7am start that's not going to be easy.
|
|
|
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 8, 2007 19:54:05 GMT -5
The question to both Drainbead and Cookies, basically how sure are you of the other's scumminess, is it worth your own life? I don't really see the second half of your question as being relevant. My vote is only a portion of the reason why drain claimed and why she's so close to the hammer. It isn't going to solve this dilemma for everyone if I take my vote off of her either. If drain is scum and my death can help confirm that for the town, I would say that my death in exchange for her death would absolutely be worth it. I'm not completely convinced that drain is scum, but I'm convinced enough to keep my vote on her with the others. At the same time, choosing the wrong way in her regard could kill a pro-town power role. There are other possibilities that seem to have some odd (alleged) precedents, like Hal's Easter Bunny, Dio's fuzzy screens, and the strange yet failed attempt on panamajack's life. There are quite possibly some very different roles at work in this set up compared to the other games I've played in. I don't have a more passionately confident answer for you, Roosh. I don't want the consensus to be wrong again, it would be wrong if I'm lynched, and I want us to kill some scum.
|
|
|
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 8, 2007 19:57:50 GMT -5
NETA: "it would be wrong if I'm lynched", "it" being "the consensus", not some sort of moral commentary, like how using Miracle Whip is wrong (10,000 kinds of WRONG).
|
|
|
Post by Boozahol Squid, P.I. on Oct 8, 2007 20:12:11 GMT -5
How creepy is it that the suspense of this is half-way driving me to putting the hammer down on a player that I know is town? I think after this and Conspiracy are over, I might retire from online Mafia. I don't think I have the temperamant for it.
|
|
|
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 8, 2007 20:13:39 GMT -5
Peri-mafiasal depression?
|
|
|
Post by Hal Briston on Oct 8, 2007 20:15:43 GMT -5
Earlier, I said this: I'm leaning toward changing my Cookies vote, but I'm waiting to hear back from the mods on a rules clarification before doing so. While I was waiting for the rules clarification, I typed up the post I was going to make, depending on the answer I received. The problem is, I didn't get a straight answer. Let's step back a sec... It seems to me that there are two ways things can be set up for the scum with regards to how they make their nightkill: A) Scum vote at night on their board, decide on a target, and they try and kill the person they decide to go after. B) Scum vote at night on their board, and also choose one of their own who must be the one to go and try to make the hit. This is the way things were done on the Hispaniola. I had asked for clarification as to if this game were set up as "A" or "B". The answer I received was basically "Not tellin'". Let the meta-gaming on that one begin. Now then, if the answer I had gotten back been "A", then no problem, I'd have moved on. However, if it had been "B", then I had a post all typed out and ready to go: ----------------------------------------------------------------- Something just isn't adding up here for me: I am Kaylee Frye, Roleblocker. I am aligned with Crew, I win when all Alliance are dead. Once per night I may use my skills to trap a person in their room, blocking their night action. I have a 1/x chance of blocking a Night kill if I block scum, with x being the number of remaining Alliance. Now, this game is set up with Hispaniola-style scum -- they have to choose one of their own to leave the safety of their bunk and go make the hit. So, why does drain say she only gets a 1/ x chance to block a nightkill? If she can trap someone in their room, wouldn't it stand to reason that trapping the player heading out to make the scum hit would be blocked with certainty? Something smells awfully fishy to me... ----------------------------------------------------------------- That, of course, would've been finished with a Cookies unvote and a vote for drain. Now, however, I have no idea what to do. I cannot fathom the meaning behind this mod silence on the "scum night" issue. It seems to me, however, that it cannot be a simple "A".
|
|
|
Post by dnooman on Oct 8, 2007 20:16:37 GMT -5
story's case for drain not blocking me on subsequent nights to night one/zero/0.5 only would fail if both drain and I were scum together. Because I'm not scum, I'm going to put drain on my permanent non-scum list... or putting him on the infinitely-crafty-scum-who-ought-to-win just by her cojones of not blocking me as the obvious scum-block role. I mean, hell, if I'd come back with fuzzy screens again and again, the scum could very easily do away with me without wasting their time night-killing me. story's analysis convinces me that either drain is (and therefore I am) scum, or Cookies is scum. So I'll roll with it. Hammer someone you know is town? WTF? Did I miss something here?
|
|
|
Post by Boozahol Squid, P.I. on Oct 8, 2007 20:20:51 GMT -5
Hammer someone you know is town? WTF? Did I miss something here? I'm not actually going to do it. But it looks pretty dim for drain's living out the end of the day, and I kinda just want the suspense to end.
|
|
|
Post by dnooman on Oct 8, 2007 20:29:15 GMT -5
How creepy is it that the suspense of this is half-way driving me to putting the hammer down on a player that I know is town? I think after this and Conspiracy are over, I might retire from online Mafia. I don't think I have the temperamant for it. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the above quote say that you know DB is town, and the quote from my above post say These do not jive, mon ami.
|
|
|
Post by Boozahol Squid, P.I. on Oct 8, 2007 20:31:48 GMT -5
How creepy is it that the suspense of this is half-way driving me to putting the hammer down on a player that I know is town? I think after this and Conspiracy are over, I might retire from online Mafia. I don't think I have the temperamant for it. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the above quote say that you know DB is town, and the quote from my above post say These do not jive, mon ami. Perhaps -know- was too strong a word for it. But for all intents and purposes, I'm buying drain's claim of pro-town roleblocker, based on the fact that I know I'm pro-town.
|
|
|
Post by dnooman on Oct 8, 2007 20:48:15 GMT -5
Perhaps -know- was too strong a word for it. But for all intents and purposes, I'm buying drain's claim of pro-town roleblocker, based on the fact that I know I'm pro-town. I agree that it was. "Know" as opposed to "buy" is a much more severe slip than "a" as opposed to "the" IMO. FOS Diomedes
|
|
Death By Irony
FGM
The Former Mandate of Heaven/Current Gastard Night Mod
I'm my own mind-altering substance!
Posts: 109
[ Exalt | Smite ]
Karma:
|
Post by Death By Irony on Oct 8, 2007 20:57:03 GMT -5
After rereading drain bead's claim a couple of times, I'm parsing her abilities like this as having the following limitations:
A) They only work on scum ("if I block scum") B) They only work on Night kills ("blocking a Night kill") C) They only have a 1/x chance of succeeding on top of all of that ("I have a 1/x chance...")
I'm still trying to figure out what this means for Diomedes' fuzzy screens result...
|
|
|
Post by Boozahol Squid, P.I. on Oct 8, 2007 21:07:06 GMT -5
Perhaps -know- was too strong a word for it. But for all intents and purposes, I'm buying drain's claim of pro-town roleblocker, based on the fact that I know I'm pro-town. I agree that it was. "Know" as opposed to "buy" is a much more severe slip than "a" as opposed to "the" IMO. FOS Diomedes See the Karma score, over the on the left? I've got a Right Cross of Suspicion on me right now, I don't need any more fingers. Hopefully, when drain dies and turns out to be a pro-town roleblocker, my exasperation here won't do me in. If it does, I'm totally switching teams and rooting for the scum when I get to the sidelines.
|
|
|
Post by dnooman on Oct 8, 2007 21:36:24 GMT -5
I agree that it was. "Know" as opposed to "buy" is a much more severe slip than "a" as opposed to "the" IMO. FOS Diomedes See the Karma score, over the on the left? I've got a Right Cross of Suspicion on me right now, I don't need any more fingers. Hopefully, when drain dies and turns out to be a pro-town roleblocker, my exasperation here won't do me in. If it does, I'm totally switching teams and rooting for the scum when I get to the sidelines. Now you're just outright saying that you're scum. Perfect knowledge, a slip that is less than negligible, and now a "hands in the air, I'm rooting for the other team" post. BTW, we've already established that some people are manipulating Karma points just to see what happens. Mr. Universe is a coward? Doesn't seem to fit the canon very well. Infected person that might have been thought to be town? The scum are most likely going to run away with this game, but I'm not willing to take it lying down. I'd say that you have a martyr complex, if only it didn't sound so hippocritical coming from me. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. Scum deaths, we need 'em.
|
|