Trepa Mayfield
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 18:50:21 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Feb 28, 2010 18:50:21 GMT -5
And so the frightened workers started to hunt for the moles in the bunch. An elaborate voting framework was proposed, but the group decided it was in their favor to use it as little as possible. Ed and Meeko ended up fighting again. Meeko was hounded by quite a few people, but he mollified them by explaining how he was really Pichu, back from the reject pile after a mystical hippie quest that totally failed to get him to evolve. Or something. Honestly, it wasn't worded very clearly, and certain omnipotent forces need to take a writing class. BillMC interrupted all of this to explain how he was a killer, and not aligned with the rest of them. In hindsight, perhaps it shouldn't have been that suprising when the mob decided to kill him. They backed him up in the corner. "Hey, um...how are we gonna kill him, anyway?" "I was thinking we could punch him." "Yeah, punching sounds good." A murmur of assent moved through the crowd, and they all punched him, drawing back quick lest they be exploded upon. But there was no explosion to be found. BillMC (Kirby), a Third Party Serial Killer, has been killed.The town hung back, watching the puddle that Bill had dissolved into. After all, Kirby tends to have a crapload of lives. But no, he stayed down. Not a shill, perhaps, but that gave the town a reason to celebrate anyway. Night 1 ends on Tuesday, at 6:50 PM EST. Get all Night actions in before then.
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 19:00:03 GMT -5
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Feb 28, 2010 19:00:03 GMT -5
SKs really have a hard time surviving the unluck of the Day 1 draws lately.
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 19:05:31 GMT -5
Post by special on Feb 28, 2010 19:05:31 GMT -5
What is a shill anyway? I mean, I get that it's the Scum in this game. I thought it was like a stooge you put in the crowd when you're trying to sell something, or someone you have bid up your items on eBay.
and, did Pede just pseudo-confirm Meeko by admitting the role was written badly?
Also, pity that Bill wasn't Scum, but at least there will be fewer deaths. And it seems Bill was right, he's not PFK, but 3rd party. Odd for a Serial Killer.
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 19:12:36 GMT -5
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Feb 28, 2010 19:12:36 GMT -5
Or pede just confirmed that whatever role was given to Meeko was poorly written.
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 19:54:16 GMT -5
Post by Red Skeezix on Feb 28, 2010 19:54:16 GMT -5
What is a shill anyway? I mean, I get that it's the Scum in this game. I thought it was like a stooge you put in the crowd when you're trying to sell something, or someone you have bid up your items on eBay. I assume if you can use a shill to influence a crowd in a positive manner, it would be possible to use a shill to influence a crowd in a negative manner. Although, this type of behavior is more often called a "concern troll". Using insiders to poison debates and discussion surrounding a strike, is a tactic right out of the Mohawk Valley formula for strikebreaking. And it does appear that whatever PM meeko got, has been confirmed to have been poorly worded. Whether or not the one he posted is the one pede sent to him, remains to be seen.
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 20:03:55 GMT -5
Post by shaggy on Feb 28, 2010 20:03:55 GMT -5
Hey everyone,
Sorry for not getting on earlier. Been busy between RL, getting my game going on the other site and being Canadian of coarse the final hockey game for the olympics.
Anyways it is good that he was in fact an SK. I do agree that usually they are PFK's and not 3rd parties, but hey since he was not town, it is still not bad at all.
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 20:15:53 GMT -5
Post by special on Feb 28, 2010 20:15:53 GMT -5
Or pede just confirmed that whatever role was given to Meeko was poorly written. I checked back in the previous version of the game. Scum were not given cover roles or even safe names. Though, honestly, that could have changed with this game. Some interesting facts about that game: 1. 24 Players 1a. 15 Town 1b. 6 Scum 1c. 2 3rd Party 1d. 1 PFK 2. All Power/No Vanilla game 3. Some powers were % powers that weren't always effective Here's a breakdown on the powers (based on roles, there could be odd variations) Town: KillingVigBomb Mason/Day VigInvestigativeMason/TrackerDetectiveProtectiveParanoid Doc/CommuterRoleblock/redirectRoleblockerMultipleCompletely random good/bad powersrotating power Doc/Vig/RedirectorOtherScotsman/double voterBackupMage???/Governor/Lover with ScumCoroner (as I recall, he got roles that weren't included in the game? is that right?)Empath (1 forget what this power was)Aegis (I don't think she ever used her power, no idea what it was)Scum:KillingPoisoner/InventorNinja/LoverInvestigativeGodfatherRoleblocker/RedirectorBus DriverMason/RoleblockerMultipleMinion Master PFK: Serial Killer/Redirector.Grugeholder/Hit List3rd Party: Mad Bomber/Jailer War/Survivor
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Trepa Mayfield
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Does Not Follow Directions
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 21:18:13 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Feb 28, 2010 21:18:13 GMT -5
A shill, unless I have my terms wrong, is a person who is paid off to take a certain position, usually by a corporation. Even if they don't actually believe in that position or are neutral on the position, they get paid to fight for it.
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 21:20:58 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Feb 28, 2010 21:20:58 GMT -5
yeh, i was godfather in that one, ed and i had some odd trophy making killing power. never figured out what in the world it was supposed to do except to break up the normal monotony of typical scum nks. the only thing that was kind of fauxed about that game is that as scum we got an additional nk by poisoning someone casually drinking in the Night thread.
plus the pimkins (?) were used in as effectively as any scum tool i have ever seen.
so, yeh, i'll be going to bed and not visiting the bar thank you very little.
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Trepa Mayfield
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 22:04:33 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Feb 28, 2010 22:04:33 GMT -5
the only thing that was kind of fauxed about that game is that as scum we got an additional nk by poisoning someone casually drinking in the Night thread. I can publicly confirm that there is no such effect or similar in this game, seeing as how unpopular (and unbalanced) it was in the original.
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 22:41:20 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Feb 28, 2010 22:41:20 GMT -5
Is Night strategy restricted?
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Night 1
Feb 28, 2010 23:00:35 GMT -5
Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Feb 28, 2010 23:00:35 GMT -5
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Mar 1, 2010 0:22:38 GMT -5
Here comes the fun part.
The compulsory Half and Halfer has to wait it out till the Morning.
Scum know he is Town.
Will Town realize it?
If only he had something else left to claim.
He Doesn't.
Remember: I got to choose tonight. Tommorrow night I do not have that benefit.
I would like to think that starting with my claim, I have been the most town that I could be.
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Post by Inner Stickler on Mar 1, 2010 1:35:00 GMT -5
Scum aren't going to kill you. Meeko as an alternating compulsory vig is too likely to be a boon for their side.
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Post by Inner Stickler on Mar 1, 2010 1:38:24 GMT -5
I will say this though, I strongly recommend a big part of your criterion for determining who to vig is to go by post counts for the day. If someone hasn't posted at all or posted only once or twice with meaningless pap, vig their lazy asses. I, for one, am tired of the tendency toward low participation in mafia and would like to reverse the trend. If someone has only posted a few times but the posts are indepth and useful, you could leave them alone. but nonparticipaters can be hanged for all I care.
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Meeko
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Post by Meeko on Mar 1, 2010 1:54:40 GMT -5
Scum aren't going to kill you. Meeko as an alternating compulsory vig is too likely to be a boon for their side.
quote author=innerstickler board=aggressivenegotiations thread=1308 post=60763 time=1267425504]I will say this though, I strongly recommend a big part of your criterion for determining who to vig is to go by post counts for the day. If someone hasn't posted at all or posted only once or twice with meaningless pap, vig their lazy asses. I, for one, am tired of the tendency toward low participation in mafia and would like to reverse the trend. If someone has only posted a few times but the posts are indepth and useful, you could leave them alone. but nonparticipaters can be hanged for all I care.[/quote]
I just wanted to bring to light certain things.
But, other things [your second part] may still be premature.
Can we hold off on "Who should Meeko Vig" till day 2?
As a complete and total guess here, Town might have another Vig.
I doubt the game would have a second Kirby.
I think you can understand why I want to hold off on speculation.
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Post by luvbwfc on Mar 1, 2010 3:55:09 GMT -5
Woo, day one ends with no Town dead!
Question - Tactically, is the SK a better lynch than a scum at this point? I am not sure how to work it out.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Mar 1, 2010 4:58:36 GMT -5
IMHO few things are 'better' than a scum lynch, but who knows how individual luck, personalities and biases might affect the ripples of an SK in the game. Maybe, if we had let Bill live, he would have taken out half the scum within a few Days. Since there are more Town than Scum an SK is more likely to kill Town than Scum when and if they do open fire, though.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 10:49:28 GMT -5
Post by fluiddruid on Mar 1, 2010 10:49:28 GMT -5
Personally, I'll take an SK kill. The problem with a game with a (presumable) lot of powers is that the body count piles up awfully fast, often too fast to get a lot of info. While yes, a scum kill on day 1 is a nice gimmee, I'd just as soon draw the game out longer - long games skew Town. And, by the numbers, the SK is going to hit more Town than Scum.
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Total Ullz
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You can take the girl out of mafia - but you can't take mafia out of the girl
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 11:04:31 GMT -5
Post by Total Ullz on Mar 1, 2010 11:04:31 GMT -5
I can live with this. I'd rather have seen scum-lynch, but not losing Town Day 1 is rare and I like it very much. Puts us a bit ahead in this game.
The sad part is however we don't really get any data for the lynch to analyze Day 2. Both Scum and Town will all to happy have voted for BillMC - leaving us a bit short of data. But still - better that losing Town IMO.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 11:15:27 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on Mar 1, 2010 11:15:27 GMT -5
Hey, everybody. Sorry to have vanished. My modem decided to crap out this weekend.
So, we're down one third party and no town. Yeah, I'll take it.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 14:43:42 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 1, 2010 14:43:42 GMT -5
I will say this though, I strongly recommend a big part of your criterion for determining who to vig is to go by post counts for the day. If someone hasn't posted at all or posted only once or twice with meaningless pap, vig their lazy asses. I, for one, am tired of the tendency toward low participation in mafia and would like to reverse the trend. If someone has only posted a few times but the posts are indepth and useful, you could leave them alone. but nonparticipaters can be hanged for all I care. Meeko, another option here is to Vig whomever happened to be in second place vote count wise. It essentially gives us a second lynch every other cycle. Of course, i don't think scum is going to kill you because they are relying on you to go off half cocked and use some method of choosing your targets that only you will understand. I think they fully expect that we will decide to take care of you ourselves after a couple of days of town showing up dead with reasoning behind it that we disagree with or just plain don't understand.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 14:56:49 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 1, 2010 14:56:49 GMT -5
Peeker, at the end of Day you said this....
"and you don't want to risk yourself if he is a bomb? it doesn't take a fucking einstein to figure out that you are either scum or just outed yourself. so he needs to be gotten rid of but you don't want to get your hands dirty. this is a very poor attitude and play for a townie."
Maybe you think it was poor play, I disagree. I don't remember if you played in the first game, but as Ed has already pointed out it was all powered game. I fully anticipate that this game would follow that theme. It doesn't make much sense to have a game on this theme with vanilla characters... especially following the precedence that the last game set. So lets suppose I am wrong, and that there are Nillas in this game. Meeko had already outed himself and you didn't say boo about his claim, why chime in about me not claiming but supposedly outing myself?
Like I said, my reluctance to vote for Bill was not in any part to dodge accountability. I agreed he needed to die. I just didn't want to risk going down with him. So maybe that's selfish, and you can think that it wasn't in town's best interest. But you don't know the setup, so you don't know what roles everyone has. Each player should have considered the possibility that they would have died for their vote against Bill before voting for him. You say my refusal to throw my vote on top of the already massive number of votes was poor play, I would counter that anyone that is vital to town was playing fast and loose by taking the risk of doing so. Further more, my not voting for him provided the rest of you with something to hold me accountable for. I could have easily hidden in the masses and voted for Bill and left it at that, but I voted for Red. Whether or not my suspicions of Red are gonna pan out is yet to be seen, but i stand by my play.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 15:42:22 GMT -5
Post by Drain Bead on Mar 1, 2010 15:42:22 GMT -5
So what's the difference between 3rd party and PFK? I've always used the terms pretty much interchangeably, but it appears others do not.
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Meeko
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 15:46:37 GMT -5
Post by Meeko on Mar 1, 2010 15:46:37 GMT -5
So what's the difference between 3rd party and PFK? I've always used the terms pretty much interchangeably, but it appears others do not. If PFK is play for keeps, then I think the answer should be self evident. A Third party can be anything. PFK seems to me to have a more limiting wincon, either survivor, or perhaps a more complicated win con. WAG, someone that has to obtain X of something. something that will snowball. If you follow me there.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 15:56:16 GMT -5
Post by Nanook on Mar 1, 2010 15:56:16 GMT -5
PFK is generally used nowadays to mean a win stealing third party, ala SK that wins alone and no one else can if they do.
Third party generally means not-town, not-scum, but not stealing wins from either. Survivor types, or stranger roles that can win alone, but don't stop others from doing so as well.
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Trepa Mayfield
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 16:00:39 GMT -5
Post by Trepa Mayfield on Mar 1, 2010 16:00:39 GMT -5
So what's the difference between 3rd party and PFK? I've always used the terms pretty much interchangeably, but it appears others do not.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 16:12:01 GMT -5
Post by Paulwhoisaghost on Mar 1, 2010 16:12:01 GMT -5
Just to throw in my personal definition. 3rd Parties win with whichever other alignment wins. PFKs prevent any other players or alignments from winning.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 16:36:16 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on Mar 1, 2010 16:36:16 GMT -5
Just to throw in my personal definition. 3rd Parties win with whichever other alignment wins. PFKs prevent any other players or alignments from winning. This is pretty much my understanding as well.
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Night 1
Mar 1, 2010 17:02:29 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Mar 1, 2010 17:02:29 GMT -5
Peeker, at the end of Day you said this.... "and you don't want to risk yourself if he is a bomb? it doesn't take a fucking einstein to figure out that you are either scum or just outed yourself. so he needs to be gotten rid of but you don't want to get your hands dirty. this is a very poor attitude and play for a townie." Maybe you think it was poor play, I disagree. I don't remember if you played in the first game, but as Ed has already pointed out it was all powered game. I fully anticipate that this game would follow that theme. It doesn't make much sense to have a game on this theme with vanilla characters... especially following the precedence that the last game set. So lets suppose I am wrong, and that there are Nillas in this game. Meeko had already outed himself and you didn't say boo about his claim, why chime in about me not claiming but supposedly outing myself? Like I said, my reluctance to vote for Bill was not in any part to dodge accountability. I agreed he needed to die. I just didn't want to risk going down with him. So maybe that's selfish, and you can think that it wasn't in town's best interest. But you don't know the setup, so you don't know what roles everyone has. Each player should have considered the possibility that they would have died for their vote against Bill before voting for him. You say my refusal to throw my vote on top of the already massive number of votes was poor play, I would counter that anyone that is vital to town was playing fast and loose by taking the risk of doing so. Further more, my not voting for him provided the rest of you with something to hold me accountable for. I could have easily hidden in the masses and voted for Bill and left it at that, but I voted for Red. Whether or not my suspicions of Red are gonna pan out is yet to be seen, but i stand by my play. while i hear what you are saying i still stand by my statement. ok, so you think we are all power roles, mabye, maybe not. but not all power roles are created equal. and ed pointed out the previous games setup after the end of the Day so that doesn't get a whole lot of traction with me. and i believed bill so i figured the possibility of a bomb as small unless he happened to be scum which really didn't make sense. so yeh, not standing with your town brethren and sistren (if that's what you are) is pretty self serving. now for the most part self preservation is to be kind of expected. because even nillers serve town's best interest if they can defend against a mis lynch. it's the more "he's gonna die anyways so i will hedge my bets" attitude that is alarming.
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