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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:00:10 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 16, 2012 12:00:10 GMT -5
***SNIP*** Vote Mahaloth Vote Suburban Plankton +1 Vote Mahaloth Vote Suburban Plankton
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:07:42 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Jan 16, 2012 12:07:42 GMT -5
May I ask why analyzing the numbers that YOU posted means that I am scum? Seriously, I took what you had, and tried to apply the basic setup (since this is game 5 of a series) to this game, to see if we can figure out the player ratios. That was a question for peeker to try to clarify what he meant. oh ffs are we back to where we have to give people step by step instructions. you came up with some analysis. it was not particularily helpful to me. i mean i run numbers all day long but i don't know that this game distills itself to a purely mathematical solution. so to a great extent i just blow through this kind of shit. especially coming from you. when someone kind of gloms onto it and wants to refine it or question underlying assumptions it just makes my hackles get a wee bit stand upish. because not town would love for us to go down some type of discussion that looks like participation, takes up a fuck load of space, confuses some, pisses others off and accomplishes not jack shit. so it's a perfect avenue of scum discussion. capiche?
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:11:42 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 16, 2012 12:11:42 GMT -5
That was a question for peeker to try to clarify what he meant. oh ffs are we back to where we have to give people step by step instructions. you came up with some analysis. it was not particularily helpful to me. i mean i run numbers all day long but i don't know that this game distills itself to a purely mathematical solution. so to a great extent i just blow through this kind of shit. especially coming from you. when someone kind of gloms onto it and wants to refine it or question underlying assumptions it just makes my hackles get a wee bit stand upish. because not town would love for us to go down some type of discussion that looks like participation, takes up a fuck load of space, confuses some, pisses others off and accomplishes not jack shit. so it's a perfect avenue of scum discussion. capiche? Yes, that's what I was asking. You weren't clear about if he was a misled Townie drinking the kool-aid or a devious Scum drinking the Kool-aid. I figured you meant the latter, but the analogy lends itself better to the former.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:12:18 GMT -5
Post by peekercpa on Jan 16, 2012 12:12:18 GMT -5
...I don't support voting for people who make distracting posts. I see other votes for peeker, but based on something.... <snipped, bolding and sizing mine> can you tell me what the something is? it might be helpful, at least to me.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:12:30 GMT -5
Post by scáthach on Jan 16, 2012 12:12:30 GMT -5
Mahaloth comes in after Suburban to say the same thing again. Plus the question itself is odd, Ed says, true or not, that he'd rather be dead than a wolf (lol for melodrama incidentally). Then Mahaloth either deliberately misunderstands, or is actually referring to one of Ed's earlier posts. I mean the explanation for the sentence he's questioning is literally the next sentence in Ed's post. I really did not understand the sentence. It was the wording. I didn't even get that the next sentence was clarification/expanding on the same idea. I don't even know what would be scummy about asking for clarification. I'll be back in a bit. It's not quite the asking for clarification - it's the repetition of a point already made. An attempt to look like you're scum hunting by using the reasoning of others. Combined with the fact that the post you quoted contains Ed's answer to your question. I'm explaining this badly, but it just read wrong to me.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:22:41 GMT -5
Post by Nanook on Jan 16, 2012 12:22:41 GMT -5
Reads wrong to me too. Also, his interactions with Peeker are making me feel like someone has decided to try out the old Meeko baiting strategy with peeker instead. That is, poke at someone that is likely to respond vehemently in an effort to derail useful discussion.
Vote: Mahaloth
Also Vote: Idle Thoughts
He seems to have a pretty good idea of exactly how many Undead there are. Even in his "clarification" post he reiterates an exact number again. It is no unprecedented for the undead to know who at least one other undead is, so it could very easily be a slip.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:30:23 GMT -5
Post by Mahaloth on Jan 16, 2012 12:30:23 GMT -5
can you tell me what the something is? it might be helpful, at least to me. Ed voted you for making preemptive move to avoid votes on yourself. I guess I should have said "vote" not votes. I don't see another vote for you aside from the ones I listed.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:30:40 GMT -5
Post by Mahaloth on Jan 16, 2012 12:30:40 GMT -5
Oh, and I don't think my comment was "hinky", peeker.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:41:15 GMT -5
Post by Mahaloth on Jan 16, 2012 12:41:15 GMT -5
Vote deon Vote gnarly
Vote Nanook
For not talking.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:41:49 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 16, 2012 12:41:49 GMT -5
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:42:27 GMT -5
Post by Mahaloth on Jan 16, 2012 12:42:27 GMT -5
Reads wrong to me too. Also, his interactions with Peeker are making me feel like someone has decided to try out the old Meeko baiting strategy with peeker instead. That is, poke at someone that is likely to respond vehemently in an effort to derail useful discussion. Who did I poke? Peeker? How? I baited him? How? I don't see that at all.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:46:17 GMT -5
Post by septimus on Jan 16, 2012 12:46:17 GMT -5
Thus it might appear that, ranking from most happy to least happy about Day 1 No Lynch, the order is Cabal, Town, Wolves, Undead. But I'm quite unsure of this. Comments? On reconsideration, I wonder if I've got this backward! On Day 1 specifically, the Lynch doesn't help Undead so much ... because Vicar will Bless that victim anyway. Cabalists, OTOH, are always eager for Lynching as long as they're the meek unlikely-to-be-lynched sort. They are happy to see a Town Power go down. Since we're odds-on favorite to misLynch a Townie toDay (Wolves won't vote each other and Cabal is laying low), I'm far from certain now that No Lynch is even anti-Town. As a half-way measure, I'll vote three people who seem to be Lurking: Vote: Nanook [/color] Vote: hirkatbawa [/color] Vote: gnarlycharlie [/color]
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:52:39 GMT -5
Post by Nanook on Jan 16, 2012 12:52:39 GMT -5
Lurking? How do you figure that? Because I didn't post over the weekend? I never post on weekends, or very little. But hey, thanks for reminding me why I quit playing this game.
Of course you don't see how you poked Peeker. The comment you made, that peeker quoted, bolded and giant sized is exactly the sort of thing that gets him riled up. You've played with him before, so I don't see how you could fail to see the predictable reaction.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:53:23 GMT -5
Post by septimus on Jan 16, 2012 12:53:23 GMT -5
Oops. I missed the crosspost by Nanook, whose cases seem pretty good.
Vote: Mahaloth [/color]
Vote: Idle Thoughts [/color]
Unvote: Nanook [/color]
I still welcome discussion of the mechanics, e.g. my questions about which team seeks No Lynch.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:53:48 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 16, 2012 12:53:48 GMT -5
unofficially: (There was an error guiri was listed twice, once under 1 vote and once under no votes with CIAS's removed vote. CIAS was not listed at all.
5 votes Mahaloth: CatInASuit (105), scathach (113), peekercpa (117), Mr Special Ed (120), Nanook (125).
4 votes peekercpa: Boozahol Squid (60), Mr Special Ed (77), CatInASuit (105), JustBeingGinger (107). Idle Thoughts: Hoopy Frood (53), Mr Special Ed (77), CatInASuit (105), Nanook (125).
3 votes texcat: guiri (36), Mr Special Ed (77), CatInASuit (105). Drain Bead: septimus (76), Mr Special Ed (77), CatInASuit (105). Inner Stickler: Hoopy Frood (72), Mr Special Ed (77), CatInASuit (105). Boozahol Squid: CatInASuit (105), peeker (117), Mahaltoh (118). Suburban Plankton: CatInASuit (105), scathach (113), Mr Special Ed (120). Nanook: CatInASuit (105), Mahaloth (128), septimus (131). gnarlycharlie: CatInASuit (105), Mahaloth (128), septimus (131).
2 votes septimus: Mr Special Ed (77), CatInASuit (105). Mr Special Ed: septimus (76), texcat (82), CatInASuit (105-111). JustBeingGinger: CatInASuit (105), Mahaloth (118). deon: CatInASuit (105), Mahaloth (128). hirkatbawa: CatInASuit (105), septimus (131).
1 vote guiri: Hoopy Frood (53-72), Mr Special Ed (77)CatInASuit (105-111). BillMc: CatInASuit (105). colby11: CatInASuit (105). Pollux Oil: CatInASuit (105). Sister Coyote: CatInASuit (105). scathach: CatInASuit (105). Merestil Haye: CatInASuit (105). CatInASuit: Mahaloth (118).
0 votes Silver Jan: CatInASuit (105-109). Hoopy Frood: CatInASuit (105-111).
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:54:36 GMT -5
Post by special on Jan 16, 2012 12:54:36 GMT -5
My summary doesn't include septimus' most recent votes/unvote
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 12:59:23 GMT -5
Post by septimus on Jan 16, 2012 12:59:23 GMT -5
But hey, thanks for reminding me why I quit playing this game. Of course you don't see how you poked Peeker. Can you expand on this? Are you conflating two of us?
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 13:02:30 GMT -5
Post by Nanook on Jan 16, 2012 13:02:30 GMT -5
The first paragraph was directed at you. The second was for Maha. I apologize for not making that clearer.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 13:05:51 GMT -5
Post by Pollux Oil on Jan 16, 2012 13:05:51 GMT -5
I'll put a few votes on the table. Vote Inner SticklerFor the two posts that scathach quoted. It just seems weird that Inner is making a big deal about this being an all power role game, despite knowing information about a previous game. Either Inner has selective memory about things, or...well I don't even know what he's doing. Playing up not having knowledge about the game set-up? It just strikes me as funny. Vote texcatAlso for posts that strike me as funny. Texcat seems very fence-sitting and wishy-washy. I know she's already mentioned that she's a Libra and what-not, but most of her posts seem very "well this could be a position, but this other position is also okay." Not a lot of firmitude (I believe I just made that word up) in her discussions. Gives me the impression she's trying to keep all her options open, while not fully commiting to anything until something gains traction. Also, I agree with Cat in that the post he quoted is very smudgey. Speaking of Cat. Vote CatinaSuitCatinaSuit is taking the carpet bomb approach to voting. I do understand the need to get votes on the table so we can make our way towards a lynch. However, I don't like the idea of not really having culpability or reasoning behind your votes. Just voting for everybody, then retracting votes makes it easy to hide scum buddies in there while still being able to take credit for voting them. Plus, "looking for signs of towniness" as unvote reasoning instead of looking for scumminess as a vote reason is a nice way to subtly be "pro-town" and get people on your side. It's also a good way for self-survival, as he basically puts everybody else one vote ahead of himself as a lynch candidate. Aaannnnd to top it off. Vote MahalothVote Suburban PlanktonScathach again brings up some good points with Suburban and mahaloth's questioning of the Ed's list discussion. Both of them looked like they were trying to nudge people in the direction of "hey, Ed looks scummy. Eh? Eh? Doesn't he look scummy, people? Eh?" while not fully committing themselves, just kind of subtly hinting at it. Smudging, I suppose. I'd say overall Suburban looks slightly worse, especially when he says "it's as good a reason to vote as any this early." And I understand mahaloth's explained he didn't understand what Ed was saying, but as scathach pointed out, the explanation is right in the post he quoted. Seems, to borrow peeker's word, hinky. I still welcome discussion of the mechanics, e.g. my questions about which team seeks No Lynch. Conspiracy is unique in that scum factions still benefit from a scum lynch of a faction they aren't a part of. Wolves want to lynch the vampires, because the vampires can take down their numbers (either accidentally early game or on purpose late game) and they can't kill them at Night. Cabal want to lynch all wolves and undead for their win condition, and they normally don't have kills of their own (secret powers notwithstanding). The undead will lynch anybody because they need the dead bodies like you said, and need to decrease overal numbers. So I don't think any team benefits from a no lynch here. Push comes to shove, though, I'd say wolves are most likely to seek a no lynch simply because they're the "basic" scum of Conspiracy and need their number advantage for as long as possible.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 13:14:54 GMT -5
Post by Mahaloth on Jan 16, 2012 13:14:54 GMT -5
Lurking? How do you figure that? Because I didn't post over the weekend? I never post on weekends, or very little. But hey, thanks for reminding me why I quit playing this game. Of course you don't see how you poked Peeker. The comment you made, that peeker quoted, bolded and giant sized is exactly the sort of thing that gets him riled up. You've played with him before, so I don't see how you could fail to see the predictable reaction. Dude, I didn't mean to make you upset. My apologies if I did. I thought peeker was just asking for clarification, which I gave.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 13:16:24 GMT -5
Post by Mahaloth on Jan 16, 2012 13:16:24 GMT -5
I think Pollux has merely voted me because I have votes. He explains his other votes, then just agrees with "hinky" and puts a vote on me. He's trying to bandwagon me.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 13:36:54 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 16, 2012 13:36:54 GMT -5
The vote count is in a separate thread called Player Lists and Vote Count. Ah. Thanks. I thought that was just for the end of each Day. I didn't realize it's a running thing.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 13:46:54 GMT -5
Post by Silver Jan on Jan 16, 2012 13:46:54 GMT -5
Vote Idle ThoughtsI find that he is really pushing the fact that he is Town I made a request to Pleonast to be Town (since I don't like being scummy roles) and lo and behold, I am Town, although I know that accounts for fuck-all right now. Take it as you will. This is the second time he says he is Town, it’s as if by saying it enough times it becomes fact. I'll be even more specific. I asked to be town first and a specific role second. I got both. So Pleo definitely seemed to give you the role you requested if they were available (at least, in my case he did...I can only speak for myself, however). Now for number three As you say, it holds no more weight that saying "I'm Town" over and over, why mention it? Because it seemed relevant to the discussion? People were talking about if they requested a role and if they got it. Why wouldn't I weigh in with my own experience? Non-Town don't know whether I'm telling the truth or not (or other Town for that matter). Of course some Non –Town would know whether you are telling the truth or not, it’s only Town that doesn’t know what you are.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 14:28:03 GMT -5
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Jan 16, 2012 14:28:03 GMT -5
I don't support voting for people who make distracting posts. I see other votes for peeker, but based on something. Except Catinasuit, who just voted all of us. vote CatinASuit Voting all of us is, to me, a way to look like having a vote out there but not really. I see you unvoted three people, but still. Actually, he unvoted four people. You probably missed his unvote of Silver Jan. Cabalists, OTOH, are always eager for Lynching as long as they're the meek unlikely-to-be-lynched sort. They are happy to see a Town Power go down. Actually, cabalists really only want to see the witches go down. They need to work with town to kill off the undead and wolves, since both town and cabal need the other two factions dead to win. Also, (barring secret roles) lynching cabal is only required for town to win if at least two witches are dead. Otherwise, the entire cabal can be living and town can win once undead and wolves are dead. And witches are pretty much unlynchable.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 14:39:19 GMT -5
Post by Idle Thoughts on Jan 16, 2012 14:39:19 GMT -5
[/color] He seems to have a pretty good idea of exactly how many Undead there are. Even in his "clarification" post he reiterates an exact number again. It is no unprecedented for the undead to know who at least one other undead is, so it could very easily be a slip.[/quote] I don't have any idea how many there are. I thought there were 2, because that's what I thought Colby's post was confirming. On reread, I see he was just commenting on one of the ways it could possibly be. It was a simple misread. Vote MahalothFully to help save my own ass since I know I'm town and have no idea what he is.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 15:11:43 GMT -5
Post by Nanook on Jan 16, 2012 15:11:43 GMT -5
You thought that Colby was confirming that? That to my mind makes it even worse. You see a post by someone that you presumably do not know the alignment of and you assume that a post he made confirms the numbers of one of the factions in the game and you don't even bat an eye at this? You don't consider where he got the info? You don't think it might be PIS or something? You just accept it? I don't believe you.
To counter your defensive vote Unvote: Mahaloth . I'm still suspicious of you, just less than Idle atm.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 15:24:06 GMT -5
Post by Idle Thoughts on Jan 16, 2012 15:24:06 GMT -5
You thought that Colby was confirming that? That to my mind makes it even worse. You see a post by someone that you presumably do not know the alignment of and you assume that a post he made confirms the numbers of one of the factions in the game and you don't even bat an eye at this? No, I didn't wonder where he (or Ed, whose post I also thought confirmed it, as Colby had made his post based on Ed's) got the info from...mainly because I thought if two people were confirming it, then it must have been said in the rules.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 15:28:07 GMT -5
Post by scáthach on Jan 16, 2012 15:28:07 GMT -5
He seems to have a pretty good idea of exactly how many Undead there are. Even in his "clarification" post he reiterates an exact number again. It is no unprecedented for the undead to know who at least one other undead is, so it could very easily be a slip. Was this in another game? From the rules list it seems like there's only 2 undead roles and neither mentions knowing who the others are? "You are a Vampire, a member of the Undead. Each Night you may kill one player. If the target is a Vicar, your attack will fail, but you will not know why. Vampires are immune to being killed at Night, except by a Vigilante. Anyone else who attempts to kill you at Night will instead be killed; you will know if this happens. Vampires are immune to a Detective's investigative power.
You are a Necromancer, a member of the Undead. Each Night you may attempt to animate a dead player, no matter how long dead. The attempt fails if the target has been blessed by a Vicar, or is under the enchantment of a Witchdoctor. If successful, a new Zombie is created and will be revealed to all. All Zombies are destroyed when their Necromantic masters are killed, although this will not be revealed at the time of death.""
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 15:31:10 GMT -5
Post by scáthach on Jan 16, 2012 15:31:10 GMT -5
Oh wait,
Roles
There are many possible roles. Not all roles will be in this game, and there may be more than one player in any given role.
I didn't realise there could be more than one of the roles that didn't explicitly call out being part of a group.
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Day One
Jan 16, 2012 16:07:37 GMT -5
Post by guiri on Jan 16, 2012 16:07:37 GMT -5
I'll be even more specific. I asked to be town first and a specific role second. I got both. So Pleo definitely seemed to give you the role you requested if they were available (at least, in my case he did...I can only speak for myself, however). Personally, I'd find it quite hilarious if you're actually a Scotsman this time. It would be funnier if he's cabal and the secret power is similar to the last game. Vote IdleThe rules exclude the possibility that's he's made a PIS slip and is a member of the Undead but the only other reason for his certainty about the number of undead is that he's somehow aware of the composition of the Undead team. I can't see that being a Town power.
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