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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 18, 2012 16:51:30 GMT -5
I don't think you're grokking the part of your (heavily hypothetical) theory that I have a problem with, so continuing to debate doesn't really serve a point.
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Post by dizzymrslizzy on Sept 18, 2012 17:29:18 GMT -5
Interesting Meeko So do you know something that the rest of us don't? How would you know what scum knows or doesn't know about Pleo?
Vote: Meeko
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 18, 2012 17:41:43 GMT -5
It is not necessarily a slip. Meeko may have just been referring to the fact that Scum know if Pleo is one of their own or not. But they do not know if he's Town or Third Party or Hostile or Non-Hostile.
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Merestil Haye
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Post by Merestil Haye on Sept 18, 2012 18:05:06 GMT -5
It occurred to me that although I've commented on the timing of Pleo's claim, I haven't really looked at the substance of the claim, so maybe I'd better. The claim is in D0.132. The claim itself is odd. It's an investigator, but Pleo can only investigate someone in the bottom 20% of posters (Today, that's 5.8 – I assume 6), and can only get a limited amount of info. Multiple investigations yield more info or mod-confirmation, but only if the same player is in the bottom 20% of posters for multiple consecutive Days. To a certain extent this is outside Pleo's control. He can't be sure that any given player will be a low poster on two consecutive Days. The only player he can guarantee being able to get mod-confirmation of role and alignment is Pleo himself, and only then if he, the Anti-Lurker, lurks. I don't know about you but I think that's funny. I can imagine Pollux and Mr. Blockey having a good laugh over that. The wincon requires Pleo to post a great deal; since he claims he can only win if he's in the top half of the posting list for five Days (or the top 15% in three consecutive days). Pleo, however, seems to be going down the route of investigating himself for the first three Days – ie he's going to lurk, even though he dislikes lurkers. I will concede that he has provoked a lot of discussion Today, even with his rather minimal post count for the Day so far. However, by doing so he is not advancing, or attempting to advance, his wincon. The tension between Pleo guaranteeing the use of his power and trying to win may result in him losing if the game ends suddenly while he was still working on building up Days with high postcount. On balance, I think I believe his claim. There's enough there to persuade me to allow him a chance to prove himself.
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Post by lauriern on Sept 18, 2012 18:24:57 GMT -5
If memory serves (in my case always a dubious proposition), in the Marathon game, when Pleo falsely claimed Town Detective, his targets were predominantly lurkers. What a coincidence that his "assigned role" in this game is to do what he falsely claimed to be doing in Marathon. If anyone here from Marathon can confirm or deny my memory, I would appreciate it. Thanks. Your memory serves you well. That is exactly what Pleo did.
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Post by lauriern on Sept 18, 2012 18:28:45 GMT -5
Assume that Pleo's claim is false. He's designed his false claim to buy time - 3 Days. If he has a killing role, he could do a lot of damage in three Days. I don't think I like the idea of just leaving him alone and saying, "have at it, you're off the hook until Day 3." If his goal was to buy time, he'd have not claimed at all. According to several other players, he has been claiming early for several games now. he had to claim early again or be seen as suspicious and he had to come up with something that would attempt to keep people for voting him out (his wonderful 3 day investigation :/ )
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Post by lauriern on Sept 18, 2012 18:32:04 GMT -5
I'm also supes suspicious of anyone strongly advocating for lynching pleo because a nonhostile lynch is a mislynch and it's relatively easy for scum to get town to mislynch a claimed nonhostile. But we don't know he's non-hostile. If he is, why post that very odd role PM that doesn't seem to make sense?
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 18, 2012 18:34:40 GMT -5
I'm also supes suspicious of anyone strongly advocating for lynching pleo because a nonhostile lynch is a mislynch and it's relatively easy for scum to get town to mislynch a claimed nonhostile. But we don't know he's non-hostile. If he is, why post that very odd role PM that doesn't seem to make sense? I don't understand your question.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 18, 2012 18:38:56 GMT -5
If his goal was to buy time, he'd have not claimed at all. According to several other players, he has been claiming early for several games now. he had to claim early again or be seen as suspicious and he had to come up with something that would attempt to keep people for voting him out (his wonderful 3 day investigation :/ ) This, and most of the arguments I am hearing for wanting to disbelieve or lynch Pleo, is ensconced in the aroma of confirmation bias that can really frack things up when it is too wrong too early in the game.
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Post by Meeko on Sept 18, 2012 18:53:04 GMT -5
? not so fast- quick draw-meeko Scum could know if he is/isn't Scum but the other bits? what other bits are there? Scum know if pleonast is scum or not. This was my arguement in marathon mafia. I was bringing it up, because a scum or town detective, would be hard to discern between. Thus it is hard to confirm a dick in a normal game. I would assume it would be at least as hard in this game, a gastard game. If we don't talk about pleonast today won't that conversation hog time needed for other discussions later? That is what else should we cover on day 1? Day 2 and after will have more information via mod reveal right? So I think we should tackle pleo for better or worse now not later Sorry if I am more scattered than usual on my iPod touch, at work durring break.
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Post by sinjin on Sept 18, 2012 18:54:22 GMT -5
Ok, pleo has a vote on peeker. So almost literally. Things I don't like: colby's, sinjin's and Suburban's votes. They're lazily argued and reek of bandwagonism. So the first and second votes are now considered bandwagonning? But Meeko's, whom you chose to ignore is fine? I'm sorry but I've hated Pleo's bullshit post my role first methodology in every game I've played with him. And the more wine I drink the more I hate it. This game he didn't even wait for Day 1 to post his supposed PM which made no sense! And then almost immediately toDay he decided unilaterally to investigate himself for the next 3 Nights. How exactly does this help town?
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Post by Meeko on Sept 18, 2012 18:55:51 GMT -5
Neta. If it is hard to confirm a standard dick in regular mafia it would stand to reason a non standard detective role in a non standard gastard game would be that much harder
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Post by lauriern on Sept 18, 2012 19:14:51 GMT -5
Pleo's wincon is met by being the top 15% of posters for 3 days or top 50% of posters for at least 5 days.
His strategy of "lurking" so he can investigate himself is bullshit, pure and simple. It contradicts what he needs to do to meet his wincon. Also, his results are posted by him, not the Mod:
Powers 1. Once each Night, you may investigate a person who was in the lowest 20% of post volume for the previous Day. You will get their role name and nothing else.
2. The following Night of an investigation, if the same person is still in the lowest 20% of post volume, you may choose to use your Anti-Lurking powers on them again to get their alignment and designation.
3. The third Night, if the same person is STILL in the lowest 20% of post volume, you may paint their role name, alignment, and desgination on their face and all over their room so at Dawn the entire public will know who they are.
It says "you"......meaning Pleo, not the Mod, will post the results. We cannot trust his results.
Vote: Pleo
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 18, 2012 19:19:24 GMT -5
Doesn't it bother you that you are citing, as evidence/justification for your vote, a post that the Mod hasn't actually made?
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Post by lauriern on Sept 18, 2012 19:28:49 GMT -5
Doesn't it bother you that you are citing, as evidence/justification for your vote, a post that the Mod hasn't actually made? That's exactly my point. Pleo can make up anything he wants, including his role PM.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 18, 2012 19:38:56 GMT -5
3. The third Night, if the same person is STILL in the lowest 20% of post volume, you may paint their role name, alignment, and desgination on their face and all over their room so at Dawn the entire public will know who they are. This assumes that the 'color' of Pleo's alleged PM, describing the reveal of Pleo's investigation results will be in a post from Pleo. An alternate assumption, that I happened to make when I first read Pleo's post, was that maybe a reveal may indeed be made by the Mod in the Dawn post. I honestly don't know how it will go down, but then I'm not someone who is voting to Lynch Ple based on an apparent belief that I I'm psychic.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 18, 2012 19:40:55 GMT -5
Fucking goddamn vote tags argh 3. The third Night, if the same person is STILL in the lowest 20% of post volume, you may paint their role name, alignment, and desgination on their face and all over their room so at Dawn the entire public will know who they are. It says "you"......meaning Pleo, not the Mod, will post the results. We cannot trust his results. Vote: Pleo [/color][/quote] This assumes that the 'color' of Pleo's alleged PM, describing the reveal of Pleo's investigation results will be in a post from Pleo. An alternate assumption, that I happened to make when I first read Pleo's post, was that maybe a reveal may indeed be made by the Mod in the Dawn post. I honestly don't know how it will go down, but then I'm not someone who is voting to Lynch Ple based on an apparent belief that I I'm psychic.
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Post by peekercpa on Sept 18, 2012 19:49:34 GMT -5
Doesn't it bother you that you are citing, as evidence/justification for your vote, a post that the Mod hasn't actually made? no i think the gritch is that a player made it. surely gastard involves a lot of loopholes but i think i will still trust the mod over a player.
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Post by lauriern on Sept 18, 2012 19:51:03 GMT -5
3. The third Night, if the same person is STILL in the lowest 20% of post volume, you may paint their role name, alignment, and desgination on their face and all over their room so at Dawn the entire public will know who they are. This assumes that the 'color' of Pleo's alleged PM, describing the reveal of Pleo's investigation results will be in a post from Pleo. An alternate assumption, that I happened to make when I first read Pleo's post, was that maybe a reveal may indeed be made by the Mod in the Dawn post. I honestly don't know how it will go down, but then I'm not someone who is voting to Lynch Ple based on an apparent belief that I I'm psychic. I don't think I'm psychic either, but I do have common sense and not only does his PM not make sense, how he's using the power supposedly given to him in that PM is highly illogical.
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Post by peekercpa on Sept 18, 2012 19:58:34 GMT -5
Fucking goddamn vote tags argh 3. The third Night, if the same person is STILL in the lowest 20% of post volume, you may paint their role name, alignment, and desgination on their face and all over their room so at Dawn the entire public will know who they are. It says "you"......meaning Pleo, not the Mod, will post the results. We cannot trust his results. Vote: Pleo [/color][/quote] This assumes that the 'color' of Pleo's alleged PM, describing the reveal of Pleo's investigation results will be in a post from Pleo. An alternate assumption, that I happened to make when I first read Pleo's post, was that maybe a reveal may indeed be made by the Mod in the Dawn post. I honestly don't know how it will go down, but then I'm not someone who is voting to Lynch Ple based on an apparent belief that I I'm psychic. [/quote] jeebuz i think i am going to refer you hereafter as two post janie. pleo has posted what he has posted. other folks seem to be consistently picking apart inconsistencies. other folks seem to be meh. i honestly do not know where your non concern comes from. i'm keeping my vote where it is.
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Post by LightFoot on Sept 18, 2012 20:18:57 GMT -5
If Pleo’s posted role/win-con is legit he’s shooting himself in the foot for these first 3 Days- odds are he won’t live past them anyway.
Probably for the best since he’s dominating this Day’s discussion and will continue to do so
D2 he may announce his Name is as posted
D3 he may announce his alignment/designation is as posted D4- who the shite knows-
If his real win-con involves living to D4 And/Or posting near nothing for 3 Days- he’s golden
My thoughts are -Gastard or not- I don’t think the Mod would set us up so a hostile could win in the first Day
Day 2 should give us more meat for this sandwich
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Sept 18, 2012 20:21:00 GMT -5
Who says I'm not concerned? I'm just not concerned enough to vote for Pleo. I'm more concerned with a pile of really poorly justified votes, including yours, but apparently I'm not concerned enough and that's vote-worthy?
I'm willing to see how things go with Pleo in the game for now, and I'm going to try and poke holes in stuff. I think that's more constructive than voting like you did.
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Post by LightFoot on Sept 18, 2012 20:27:22 GMT -5
? not so fast- quick draw-meeko Scum could know if he is/isn't Scum but the other bits? what other bits are there? Scum know if pleonast is scum or not. This was my arguement in marathon mafia. I was bringing it up, because a scum or town detective, would be hard to discern between. Thus it is hard to confirm a dick in a normal game. I would assume it would be at least as hard in this game, a gastard game. If we don't talk about pleonast today won't that conversation hog time needed for other discussions later? That is what else should we cover on day 1? Day 2 and after will have more information via mod reveal right? So I think we should tackle pleo for better or worse now not later Sorry if I am more scattered than usual on my iPod touch, at work durring break. yes Scum would know if Pleo is Scum or not But they would not know what other carps he had up his sleeve You typed an absolute = and now you are fixing it- Myself I think Scum Would know that so your origional comment is not vote worthy but it deserves notice
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Post by Mahaloth on Sept 18, 2012 20:45:22 GMT -5
Wow, I get busy and I miss all this. Then again, 7 pages of posts and most of the conversation is back and forth on two thinks. Peeks and Pleo and their roles, blah blah.
More than several games, Pleo has been claiming early I think for perhaps a couple years now? Except in one game on the dope where he didn't' claim and was scum. And perhaps others I've forgotten. It's a thing and other than getting us all chatting, it doesn't do much. I guess I believe his claim.
I have no idea about the Deadpool reveal.
Ok, moving on.
I'm going to go out and gamble a bit on my role. Maybe it'll get me lynched, but I'm willing to risk it. I'll post the full role PM thingy later but the short version is this.
I'm Arthur Dent and I am not Town....yet. I win with Town if I can get a Townie to do an action to me at Nighttime. They will see my towel and I join them. Or I can use the towel and risk visiting someone, hope for a Townie, but not have the towel out if I get visited.
And I can kill once using a Vogon poetry book. Unprotectable, too.
Here is my suggestion and if it is a stupid move, I apologize to Pollux for poorly playing the role. Long days at work have perhaps made me delirious.
1. I will not use my towel toNight. Lay it out, that is.
2. I need a Townie to visit(use their power on) me. That makes me officially Town. Protection would be gosh-darn nice, but I guess anything would work.
3. I'll make a kill toNight. I'll do it in what I think is Town's interest. Hey, I got it right last game, didn't I? Heh.
Or you could just all lynch me toDay, but that is a serious waste. I'm basically a townie-in-waiting. If I get Day-killed by a scum with that power(if that kind of thing exists), I lose for not becoming town, but I still kind of help Town(my hopefully future team) by wasting/using-up a day kill.
Hey, I think it is a good move. I'll post my role PM next in its own post.
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Post by Mahaloth on Sept 18, 2012 20:47:01 GMT -5
Here's the role PM.
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Post by KidVermicious on Sept 18, 2012 21:17:57 GMT -5
What on earth is the point of that claim, Mahaloth?
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Post by LightFoot on Sept 18, 2012 21:22:33 GMT -5
What on earth is the point of that claim, Mahaloth? It appears to be approaching an epidemic before the end of D1
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Post by patricia on Sept 18, 2012 21:42:28 GMT -5
Mahaloth would be a good guy to have aboard - can someone with the power help him to the town side - I would if I could
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Post by LightFoot on Sept 18, 2012 21:56:06 GMT -5
Mahaloth would be a good guy to have aboard - can someone with the power help him to the town side - I would if I could So now all the Scum- and everyone else- know that you are a) not currently town or b) Town with no Night actions or c) smoke screening careful what/how you post
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Post by Red Skeezix on Sept 18, 2012 21:57:25 GMT -5
Interesting Meeko So do you know something that the rest of us don't? How would you know what scum knows or doesn't know about Pleo? Vote: MeekoI guess I'll hold off on my pleo vote, this looks scummier. Pointing out PIS where there is none, is so often a scum tell that we should put it up on signs. Vote: dizzymrslizzy
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