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Post by crys on Oct 8, 2012 10:11:59 GMT -5
I don't like redskeezixs vote on me. He voted me for previous reasons which one of them was being a lazy voter. He didn't give much explanation for his other vote and this came across as being very lazy also. vote: RedSkeezixFirst of all you're mischaracterizing my vote intentionally. I never voted you for being a lazy voter. I don't even know what that is. I voted you because you hedge voted the two vote leaders on day one. It's not lazy, it speaks of someone who is afraid to be conterversial, afraid to draw attention. Secondly, I believe you are a hostile third party, not what you claim to be. Thirdly, really an OMGUS vote? C'mon why arent you lynched yet? First off I made a mistake that happens right. I'm sorry my bad. Secondly there is more to it than that but I'm at work more on that after work Sent from my SCH-I405 using proboards
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Post by Sister Coyote on Oct 8, 2012 10:47:47 GMT -5
I think -- and I'm mostly speaking for me, here, but I hope I'm understanding pizza correctly and we're on the same wavelength -- it's not about believing colby's claim so much as:
1) if he's telling the truth, better for Town to keep him around. 2) if he's lying, give him plenty of rope with which to hang himself; there are better candidates for toDay's lynch.
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Post by patricia on Oct 8, 2012 10:53:48 GMT -5
I think -- and I'm mostly speaking for me, here, but I hope I'm understanding pizza correctly and we're on the same wavelength -- it's not about believing colby's claim so much as: 1) if he's telling the truth, better for Town to keep him around. 2) if he's lying, give him plenty of rope with which to hang himself; there are better candidates for toDay's lynch. I think it is more of a question of who then?
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 8, 2012 11:22:59 GMT -5
Bleah. Fine, lynching colby will send pizzaguy into apoplexy and JBG is now lynchproof which I am insanely skeptical of but fine, whatever.
Crys, now, crys claims cabalist werewolf vampire, role pm says mad bomber and the listed wincon is at odds with staying in her room every night. Does not pass the sniff test.
Vote: crys
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Post by KidVermicious on Oct 8, 2012 11:34:28 GMT -5
I can get behind that. I don't trust Colby either, but I'm willing to see how that plays out, and I think I believe JBG at this point. I wish I had time for a full reread, but I'm getting ready to head out for a couple days, and let's be honest, this game is exhausting. I'll be glad when we've got a little more clarity.
Vote Crys
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Post by Sister Coyote on Oct 8, 2012 12:09:28 GMT -5
I've been going back-and-forth about crys's claim and her role and the whole lot of it; I've almost voted her twice and since I'm here thinking about voting her again -- with the wincon mismatch and Mad Bomber being part of her role I just...I don't know. Something feels wrong.
vote: crys
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Post by gnarlycharlie on Oct 8, 2012 12:30:12 GMT -5
i'm not sure what to make of this wave of votes for crys. it seems like a 3rd party non-hostile madbomber seems to fit with a gastard game. i worry that if she gets lynched, the voting record wouldn't be terribly useful.
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 8, 2012 12:37:53 GMT -5
How will it be any less useful than when any other player receives the most votes and gets lynched?
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 8, 2012 12:41:00 GMT -5
I can't speak for anyone else, but Colby picked up my vote way back when for a really flimsy/lazy/opportunistic(?) case in his vote against Inner, a problem that remains unsolved despite his pledge to build a better case.
I'm ambivalent on a Crys lynch. I tend to lean more towards gnarlycharlie's take that her role as claimed is plausible. I've seen mad bombers who weren't win-stealing and they were really difficult roles to play as they were in games that weren't apparently clogged with Third Parties. They were 'other' and therefor not trusted, particularly as they went around feeling paranoid people up at Night. This setup would seem to make it a bit easier to play one out, though.
I'm tentatively willing to switch my KidV vote to crys if that is what it takes to let the Pizza/Colby/Ginger thing come to a head though.
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 8, 2012 12:56:28 GMT -5
Regardless of the winstealing, why is crys offering to stay in her room tonight instead of advancing her purported wincon?
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 8, 2012 13:03:12 GMT -5
unofficial vote tally
JustBeingGinger (12 votes) - Penalty Vote, Parzival, gnarlycharlie, Meeko, dizzymrslizzy, silverjan, askthepizzaguy, storyteller0910, BillMc, Red Skeezix, peekercpa, Rich Beckman Colby11 (6 votes) - CometotheDarkSideWeHaveCookies, BillMc, patricia, sinjin, Lightfoot, crys crys (5 votes) - Meeko, Red Skeezix, Inner Stickler, KidVermicious, Sister Coyote Inner Stickler (3 votes) - Colby11, dizzymrslizzy, Suburban Plankton Suburban Plankton (2 votes) - askthepizzaguy, Sister Coyote KidVermicious - (1 vote) CometotheDarkSideWeHaveCookies CometotheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (1 vote) - peekercpa peekercpa (1 vote) - KidVermicious Red Skeezix (1 vote) - crys
Assuming JBG is truly unlynchable, we're looking at a no-lynch here which is less than helpful. I would really like the stack of voters on JBG to look at their vote and decide how acceptable the risk of a no-lynch is. The sheer number of votes piled on her is making me fear that scum won the merc bid and are trying to make sure that JBG eats it so that one of their number doesn't have to claim and get put under the magnifying glass.
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Parzival
Mome Rath
Let's all strive to do our best today![on:forgot to log out][of:forgot to log in]
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Post by Parzival on Oct 8, 2012 13:09:52 GMT -5
Whether or not crys is lying about hiding, won't we have definitive proof of what happens when someone else comes out with a virus? I can't see why she'd make a claim like that if she wasn't the source of infection. Which means that her keeping of her promise will be obviously tested.
Now, maybe she's lying about her wincon and hoping to survive until there are fewer folks left to infect. But I think it'll be easy enough to see that coming. I don't get the pressure to lynch her today. I'm starting to feel a tiny bit of scummy backlash against the JustBeingGinger lynch. The idea that "this could be a no-lynch" doesn't make sense. It only works if you assume that she's telling the truth. If we lynch someone we get information. In this case, if it turns out she's telling the truth, that's probably not as bad an outcome as it could be - she ends up surviving. But my own opinion is that she's lying, given that she lied once (by changing her PM) and her updated information feels like an expansion of that lie.
I may be gone for most of today or tomorrow as I'm updating my e-mail address but it's causing problems.
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Post by crys on Oct 8, 2012 13:23:41 GMT -5
Regardless of the winstealing, why is crys offering to stay in her room tonight instead of advancing her purported wincon? why not I have already acknowledged my mistake on my edit. It gives me the ability to be safe from nightkills. Plus biting people now could just be a waste of time Sent from my SCH-I405 using proboards
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 8, 2012 13:37:53 GMT -5
I still don't understand. Unless I missed an update, the only way you can win is when the number of infected people are some portion of the total population. Are you hoping colby will convert you at some point or were you just going to hang out in your room for the rest of the game?
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Colby11
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Post by Colby11 on Oct 8, 2012 13:49:26 GMT -5
Everyone, drink the kool aid!
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Post by Rich Beckman on Oct 8, 2012 14:04:23 GMT -5
Everyone, drink the kool aid! Which kool aid is that? "Othello told Desdemona 'I'm cold, cover me with a blanket. By the way, what happened to that poisoned wine?' She said 'I gave it to you, you drank it.'" - Bob Dylan
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Post by Silver Jan on Oct 8, 2012 14:27:37 GMT -5
If Ginger is a mislynch and I'm not sure she is, then won't her lack of dying tell us that she could be telling the truth. Does that make sense? It does in my head. Either way we get some information.
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Post by Pollux Oil on Oct 8, 2012 14:37:51 GMT -5
Day 3 Updated Vote Count
JustBeingGinger (12 votes) - Penalty Vote, Parzival, gnarlycharlie, Meeko, dizzymrslizzy, silverjan, askthepizzaguy, storyteller0910, BillMc, Red Skeezix, peekercpa, Rich Beckman Colby11 (6 votes) - CometotheDarkSideWeHaveCookies, BillMc, patricia, sinjin, Lightfoot, crys crys (5 votes) - Meeko, Red Skeezix, Inner Stickler, KidVermicious, Sister Coyote Inner Stickler (3 votes) - Colby11, dizzymrslizzy, Suburban Plankton Suburban Plankton (2 votes) - askthepizzaguy, Sister Coyote KidVermicious - (1 vote) CometotheDarkSideWeHaveCookies CometotheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (1 vote) - peekercpa peekercpa (1 vote) - KidVermicious Red Skeezix (1 vote) - crys
With these votes, JustbeingGinger will be lynched.
Day ends in ~22.5 hours.
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Merestil Haye
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Post by Merestil Haye on Oct 8, 2012 14:46:22 GMT -5
I haven't finished my second read yet. However...
I came upon Ginger's expanded claim just before packing up for tea. Having mulled it over, I think it might be worth testing her claim by trying a lynch. If she's lied about that power, she dies, her lie is exposed and we probably have a threat to Town dead. If she hasn't lied she will survive. At that stage, I'd consider it very unlikely that she's a Mafiate or hostile third party, because I don't see Pollux making a threat to Town unconditionally unlynchable.
With that in mind, I'm going to vote for Ginger.
Vote: JustBeingGinger
I still think her story is plausible, because I've been in similar catchup situations, and you really feel the pressure of time. I'm only willing to vote her because she claims to be unlynchable and that is directly testable, a claim that hadn't been made when I last pontificated about her claims.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 8, 2012 14:48:19 GMT -5
If Ginger is a mislynch and I'm not sure she is, then won't her lack of dying tell us that she could be telling the truth. Does that make sense? It does in my head. Either way we get some information. It would tell us that she had a power that would survive a single lynch. Whether or not anything else about her claim is true would still be unknown, including whether or not she can survive more than one lynch. I happen to be willing to leave her alone for now even without lynching her to test that portion of her claim, which is why the idea of a no-lynch for someone that I'm not voting for in the first place has me concerned. But those concerns have been spelled out a couple of times now and the vote count on Ginger isn't really going down, so I guess it is what it is.
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Post by KidVermicious on Oct 8, 2012 14:53:41 GMT -5
Regardless of the winstealing, why is crys offering to stay in her room tonight instead of advancing her purported wincon? So that she'll investigate as non-hostile. According to the PM she posted, she investigates as hostile on a night when she's out doing wolfampirabal things, and non-hostile when she keeps it in her pants. She claims that her true state is non-hostile. I think she's fibbing.
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Post by KidVermicious on Oct 8, 2012 14:58:21 GMT -5
If Ginger is a mislynch and I'm not sure she is, then won't her lack of dying tell us that she could be telling the truth. Does that make sense? It does in my head. Either way we get some information. If Ginger doesn't die of a lynch, all that tells us is that she was telling the truth about being immune to the lynch. I don't doubt that part of her claim, considering her role name. I also don't doubt that she's Town or Non-Hostile 3rd, considering the rest of her role. I don't know that lynching her is going to tell us anything we don't already know, and I'm skeptical of the motivations of anybody who is still voting her.
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Post by KidVermicious on Oct 8, 2012 15:02:02 GMT -5
I still think her story is plausible, because I've been in similar catchup situations, and you really feel the pressure of time. I'm only willing to vote her because she claims to be unlynchable and that is directly testable, a claim that hadn't been made when I last pontificated about her claims. So you would rather test a minor aspect of a claim you already trust than try and lynch scum? I'll be honest, I'm baffled by your position here. It seems very un-Merestil-like. Color me bemused.
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Post by crys on Oct 8, 2012 15:11:27 GMT -5
Regardless of the winstealing, why is crys offering to stay in her room tonight instead of advancing her purported wincon? So that she'll investigate as non-hostile. According to the PM she posted, she investigates as hostile on a night when she's out doing wolfampirabal things, and non-hostile when she keeps it in her pants. She claims that her true state is non-hostile. I think she's fibbing. Whatever lol. I conceded to staying in my room for now because it will give town more of a reason to trust me because I want to help them not hurt them. Go ahead lynch me. I just hope that if I do get lynched town will look closely at who started and continued said push. Sent from my SCH-I405 using proboards
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Post by crys on Oct 8, 2012 15:12:55 GMT -5
Neta if I start towards my wincon now it wouldmost likely be wasted time on my part. Still early in the game.
Sent from my SCH-I405 using proboards
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 8, 2012 15:13:14 GMT -5
So that she'll investigate as non-hostile. According to the PM she posted, she investigates as hostile on a night when she's out doing wolfampirabal things, and non-hostile when she keeps it in her pants. She claims that her true state is non-hostile. I think she's fibbing. But the only wincon she has so far admitted to is a typical mad bomber wincon. Her strategy at this point is apparently to ignore her wincon. Why?! What is the motivation? Being turned? If colby dies either at the lynch or by NK and does flip recruiter what is she going to do? Start biting? Quit? Continue staying in her room at the expense of her wincon? I keep adding 2 and 2 and getting neon.
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Post by Rich Beckman on Oct 8, 2012 16:00:23 GMT -5
I would be interested in opinions on what good Ginger's role is for Town or 3rd Party. There is nothing in her power to give her more info than any of the rest of us have, so what basis does she have on which to make a decision to save someone? But if she is Scum, her power is extremely useful. She can save Scum from the lynch. And she can do it with near impunity right up until the time someone she saves dies by other means and flips Scum (but even that does not necessarily convict her of being Scum or stop her from saving more Scum). As Town or 3rd Party, she could as easily be hurting her self/team as helping since she really does not know who she is saving. Add to this the comment AskThePizzaGuy made: <snip> A weak bodyguard role is not critical. If town begins with 6-7 roles or whatever Skeezix said was there a couple rounds ago, each role is particularly necessary. Likely a town vig, but also possible there is no starting town vig and there are a couple recruitable third party killers, which become town vigs. My role complements such a vigilante. Town converter, obviously. Doctor, as we already know. Starting town detective. Possible masons. I don't see a weak bodyguard fitting into that equation as starting town. Granted, all that is pure speculation, but it does not strike me as idle. Given the supposedly small numbers of Town, how does Ginger's role fit into the balance equation?
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Post by Inner Stickler on Oct 8, 2012 16:20:31 GMT -5
I don't believe that Pollux would give scum an unlynchable role.
Roles that can prevent a lynch are sometimes called Governors or some other political office related title. They're not used very often for the exact reason you state. Unless a governor is somehow connected to an investigator, they can't know someone's town with any more certitude than the people voting for the lynch and interfering with a lynch just because you have a hunch is not in town's best interest.
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Post by Rich Beckman on Oct 8, 2012 16:38:46 GMT -5
I don't believe that Pollux would give scum an unlynchable role.<snip> That makes sense, but that is part of the PM I do not believe. Here is BillMc's side by side: www.idlemafia.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=poll&thread=2050&page=9#99532The first one was posted in a rush, the second one posted when she had time to work on it. If she started with the second one, she got to the first one in a hurry and only blew the hostile/non-hostile?? It makes more sense to me that she started with something very similar to the first one, make minor adjustments on the run blowing the hostile/non-hostile and then with more time came up with the second one. I admit that the second one is quite impressive work. But I think starting with the second and editing done to the first while rushed is equally impressive. Every time I look at Ginger's case, I find more reason to vote for her.
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Post by ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies on Oct 8, 2012 16:54:19 GMT -5
There is nothing in her power to give her more info than any of the rest of us have, so what basis does she have on which to make a decision to save someone? In theory, the same basis that a Town Doc has when trying to decide who to protect, or a Town Investigator, or any Town power role, or any Town player at all who is trying to decide where to put a vote...the basis is the information that has been provided and discussed in the game. Her role as described is no more hobbled by lack of information as any other role.
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