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Day One
May 4, 2009 17:22:49 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on May 4, 2009 17:22:49 GMT -5
<font style="font-size: 12px;"> Whedon is pretty far from God - I give you Dollhouse as an exemplar. Also, I'm sorry, but Once More with Feeling sucked. Dr. Horrible is OK, though. And finally this! You are of the devil and must be lynched....hard. Seriously how can you not like Dollhouse and not know all the words to Once More with Feeling? Next you'll be saying Fringe is rubbish - philistine! I loathe Once More with Feeling. Voting for me isn't going to change that fact. I adore Fringe, though, because it's exploring gender and relationship roles in a way that Dollhouse only wishes it could. As to the rest of it: - I snark with the best of them, and I always have.
- I kept repeating myself as to why I did what I did because PEOPLE KEPT CALLING ME ON SHIT I'D ALREADY RESPONDED TO ARGH.
Ahem.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 17:31:34 GMT -5
Post by sachertorte on May 4, 2009 17:31:34 GMT -5
Doesn't say he had questions about his role, just that he had questions. Secret questions? What type of question do you imagine a player having that isn't shared publicly?
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Day One
May 4, 2009 17:45:23 GMT -5
Post by Pleonast on May 4, 2009 17:45:23 GMT -5
Doesn't say he had questions about his role, just that he had questions. Secret questions? What type of question do you imagine a player having that isn't shared publicly? My feeling is that all rules questions should be handled privately with the moderator. That prevents players from publicly playing games with the moderator. (We've seen examples of players asking manipulative questions in game threads.)
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Day One
May 4, 2009 17:48:08 GMT -5
Post by sachertorte on May 4, 2009 17:48:08 GMT -5
Ugh. Too many suspicions, only one vote... My suspect list: Inner Stickler Sister Coyote Pollux I've explicitly stated my suspicions on Sister Coyote and Pollux so I won't repeat them here (even though I know I should, but I don't have time and I have a headache). Inner Stickler, I have not addressed before. My feelings in this direction are vague and not well formed yet. I get a lurker vibe. I found the postings to be riding the line between substantive and useless. I didn't like the vote for paul, though I can't recall why just now. I should probably delete this paragraph, but I'm not going to. Feel free to hold my feet to the fire tomorrow morning (tomorrow, not Tomorrow). But I'm not voting for Inner Stickler; I'd join that bandwagon though if others want to go that way too. Between Pollux and Sister Coyote, I think I'd rather force a claim from Pollux. Vote: Pollux Brownies: I'm leaning Town on zlw. I don't remember why. I think it is because of an early vote on Sister Coyote. This aggressive play is more indicative of Town than scum as it is a stand that opens oneself to criticism and possible Day One lynch. Pleonast: even though he needs to be lynched, I'm fairly certain that he is Town Today. Sinjin: I still have my hair and I have not popped a blood vessel <- this one is NOT serious. Wish List: I kind of want to lynch storyteller. Mainly because its much easier to figure out his alignment when he is dead. Also, he's not posting, and to me a not-posting storyteller is like a red flag to a bull. Not to mention that by not-posting, there is no way for us to determine his alignment. Yuk. Of course if I put storyteller in play as a lurker, MiteyMouse needs to be there too, though at least MiteyMouse has claimed sickness.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 17:48:14 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on May 4, 2009 17:48:14 GMT -5
But we have to balance the cost of my mislynch versus the cost of a recruited, Night-kill-immune Pleonast. Okay, I've read the new Day One stuff. I need to go check out the AT game, then I'll come back and say stuff, and vote, but I wanted to ask about this while the question is still in the front of my mind (or I'll forget): Are you Nightkill immune or Nightkill resistant? Or are you using the 2 terms to mean the same thing? (Because, personally, I think of "NK resistant" as "lowers chances of dying" and "NK immune" to mean "zero chance of dying".) I don't think the phrase would have even caught my eye, except that Pleo's also described himself as "self-protecting", and (to me) that is also not the same thing as "NK resistant" or "NK immune" and makes me wonder if Pleo's making this up as he goes along and not keeping track. And, for Christ's sake, (if you're telling the truth and*) if that's the part of the PM you're confused about (I thought it was just the "possibly recruitable" part), ask FCOD over and over until he answers.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 17:51:15 GMT -5
Post by sachertorte on May 4, 2009 17:51:15 GMT -5
Secret questions? What type of question do you imagine a player having that isn't shared publicly? My feeling is that all rules questions should be handled privately with the moderator. That prevents players from publicly playing games with the moderator. (We've seen examples of players asking manipulative questions in game threads.) Oh I agree. But I also think that Pollux was asking sensitive information and not general game questions. Pre-role assignment is a good time for general game mechanics questions.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 17:55:36 GMT -5
Post by Pleonast on May 4, 2009 17:55:36 GMT -5
But we have to balance the cost of my mislynch versus the cost of a recruited, Night-kill-immune Pleonast. Okay, I've read the new Day One stuff. I need to go check out the AT game, then I'll come back and say stuff, and vote, but I wanted to ask about this while the question is still in the front of my mind (or I'll forget): Are you Nightkill immune or Nightkill resistant? Or are you using the 2 terms to mean the same thing? (Because, personally, I think of "NK resistant" as "lowers chances of dying" and "NK immune" to mean "zero chance of dying".) I don't think the phrase would have even caught my eye, except that Pleo's also described himself as "self-protecting", and (to me) that is also not the same thing as "NK resistant" or "NK immune" and makes me wonder if Pleo's making this up as he goes along and not keeping track. And, for Christ's sake, (if you're telling the truth and*) if that's the part of the PM you're confused about (I thought it was just the "possibly recruitable" part), ask FCOD over and over until he answers. Why do you care about the precise nature of that power of mine?
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Day One
May 4, 2009 18:18:26 GMT -5
Post by sinjin on May 4, 2009 18:18:26 GMT -5
Ok, Pleo, enough with the pussy footing around. I am soooo sick of this.
You on the one hand claim we should lynch you. On the other hand you suggest we should keep you around to end game because you're night-kill resistant. On the gripping hand you claim you're recruitable and therefore dangerous to town. Can we stop with the games?
It seems there are three theories about you:
1) The bad guys can recruit you, thus we should lynch you, post-haste (I'm in this group in case you're wondering).
2) The good guys can recruit you, thus we should keep you alive (Roosh).
3) You're lying about being night kill resistant and we should let the vig take you out (sacher).
WTF, you have infused the whole PLEO issue with a big whopping can of WIFOM. I can't help but fear that the day is going to end with a bunch of outed power roles, a dead townie and then a whole bunch more power roles outed as each and every watcher, tracker, vig, that might exist focuses their sights on YOU tonight. Is this your plan?
When exactly do you think we should lynch you by the way? ToDay, ToMorrow, just before lynch or lose?
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Day One
May 4, 2009 18:30:09 GMT -5
Post by The Real FCOD on May 4, 2009 18:30:09 GMT -5
Vote count:
Pollux (4) - Pleonast, Sister Coyote, Special Ed, sachertorte Sister Coyote (3) - zlw, Paul, Almost Human Paul (2) - NAF1138, Inner Stickler KidV (1) - Roosh sachertorte (1) - Pollux Inner Stickler (1) - Natlaw Natlaw (1) - sinjin
--FCOD
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Day One
May 4, 2009 18:32:40 GMT -5
Post by special on May 4, 2009 18:32:40 GMT -5
But saying you had questions for the mod about your role? Usually a Vanilla role is pretty simple. I think Pollux could handle understanding it himself. He actually said Yeah, and honestly, your quotes within quotes got way too small to read, I was going on memory. Doesn't say he had questions about his role, just that he had questions. (that quote's taken from Sister C's quote as I couldn't be arsed to go back and find PSS's)
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Day One
May 4, 2009 18:53:00 GMT -5
Post by special on May 4, 2009 18:53:00 GMT -5
ooops, I seemed to have put my statement right smack dab in the middle of my quote. I promise, that's the last time I don't preview... Here's how that should have looked: But saying you had questions for the mod about your role? Usually a Vanilla role is pretty simple. I think Pollux could handle understanding it himself. He actually said I know I had a couple questions I asked privately and Mr. FCMOD gave me nothing, nada, zilch to work with so I'm working on my own assumptions here too. Doesn't say he had questions about his role, just that he had questions. (that quote's taken from Sister C's quote as I couldn't be arsed to go back and find PSS's) Yeah, and honestly, your quotes within quotes got way too small to read, I was going on memory.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 18:56:51 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on May 4, 2009 18:56:51 GMT -5
I still don't think that's right, Ed.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 19:09:04 GMT -5
Post by special on May 4, 2009 19:09:04 GMT -5
I still don't think that's right, Ed. really? I mean, the part quote to me is what my post should have looked like. I think I got it right. Please don't tell me I'm wrong. (even if I am, I might go run and hide)
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Day One
May 4, 2009 19:11:18 GMT -5
Post by Sister Coyote on May 4, 2009 19:11:18 GMT -5
No, you're right. I was confused.
Don't run and hide.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 19:55:43 GMT -5
Post by KidVermicious on May 4, 2009 19:55:43 GMT -5
Okay, I've read the new Day One stuff. I need to go check out the AT game, then I'll come back and say stuff, and vote, but I wanted to ask about this while the question is still in the front of my mind (or I'll forget): Are you Nightkill immune or Nightkill resistant? Or are you using the 2 terms to mean the same thing? (Because, personally, I think of "NK resistant" as "lowers chances of dying" and "NK immune" to mean "zero chance of dying".) I don't think the phrase would have even caught my eye, except that Pleo's also described himself as "self-protecting", and (to me) that is also not the same thing as "NK resistant" or "NK immune" and makes me wonder if Pleo's making this up as he goes along and not keeping track. And, for Christ's sake, (if you're telling the truth and*) if that's the part of the PM you're confused about (I thought it was just the "possibly recruitable" part), ask FCOD over and over until he answers. Why do you care about the precise nature of that power of mine? This is an excellent question.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:08:15 GMT -5
Post by Pollux Oil on May 4, 2009 20:08:15 GMT -5
From zero to 4 votes within 24 hours of Day's end. Surprise surprise. This, apparently, is why I was never in debate in school. Between Pollux and Sister Coyote, I think I'd rather force a claim from Pollux. What really? That's the reason you chose me over the other choice? You want to force a claim out of me? Buh. Guh. Well, whatever. Here's what I am. I'm Captain Hammer's Groupie #1. I know who Groupie #2 is. There are more groupies than that but I don't know who they are, and I don't know any alignments. I assume we groupies are a variant on a masonic group, but I don't know for certain. Maybe one of the other Groupies, or Captain Hammer himself, knows all the alignments for definite but that's just postulating on my part. From the information I have at my disposal about my role, I'm about as good as vanilla town. All I can do is confirm who Groupie #2 is who they say they are. I'll be back to respond to all the votes and questions posed to me but I figure I'll go ahead and get this out.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:24:39 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on May 4, 2009 20:24:39 GMT -5
Why do you care about the precise nature of that power of mine? It's not so much that I care about what the precise nature of the power is, as that I am curious as to why you are inconsistent in describing/defining it. (Hence the statement, which you quoted "makes me wonder if Pleo's making this up as he goes along and not keeping track.") Well, also that part of my reasoning for encouraging Any Hypothetical (non-remorseful/non-one-shot) Vig to target you was that we'd save a lynch. If you're actually immune as opposed to resistant, that's kind of pointless. Although, if it's a mandatory Vig, it might still make sense to target a NK-immune role if said Vig didn't have a good target, since it'd prevent accidental Vig-caused Townie death.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:33:45 GMT -5
Post by sinjin on May 4, 2009 20:33:45 GMT -5
So PSS you're claiming you're a groupy who aligns with town? And that you know of one other groupy but there are other groupies out there but you don't know their alignments. But you, personally, feel mainly vanilla.
So what? You're a masonry of one? Two? Many? But you all might not have the same alignment? Come again please.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:40:22 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on May 4, 2009 20:40:22 GMT -5
Damn. This sounds like a possible combination of those circular-confirming Masons (what game was that in?) and the SSB Masons. Worse, even, since at least in SSB, the Masons knew for sure that one Mason was scum.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:42:34 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on May 4, 2009 20:42:34 GMT -5
For those who haven't see it yet (Boo! Bad Mafia-ites!), there's 3 groupies in canon. (They do the weird stuff!)
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:52:19 GMT -5
Post by KidVermicious on May 4, 2009 20:52:19 GMT -5
From zero to 4 votes within 24 hours of Day's end. Surprise surprise. This, apparently, is why I was never in debate in school. Between Pollux and Sister Coyote, I think I'd rather force a claim from Pollux. What really? That's the reason you chose me over the other choice? You want to force a claim out of me? Buh. Guh. Well, whatever. Here's what I am. I'm Captain Hammer's Groupie #1. I know who Groupie #2 is. There are more groupies than that but I don't know who they are, and I don't know any alignments. I assume we groupies are a variant on a masonic group, but I don't know for certain. Maybe one of the other Groupies, or Captain Hammer himself, knows all the alignments for definite but that's just postulating on my part. From the information I have at my disposal about my role, I'm about as good as vanilla town. All I can do is confirm who Groupie #2 is who they say they are. I'll be back to respond to all the votes and questions posed to me but I figure I'll go ahead and get this out. So, you can confirm groupietwo, but can groupiethree confirm you?
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:53:50 GMT -5
Post by Pollux Oil on May 4, 2009 20:53:50 GMT -5
So PSS you're claiming you're a groupy who aligns with town? And that you know of one other groupy but there are other groupies out there but you don't know their alignments. But you, personally, feel mainly vanilla. So what? You're a masonry of one? Two? Many? But you all might not have the same alignment? Come again please. Yes. To be more clear, yes. I am town-aligned, but I cannot confirm the alignment of the other groupies. There was no indication given to me that I should be suspicious of the other groupies, but my certainty of their alignment was absent from my role PM, so I figured it best not to make a fatal assumption. I know the total number of groupies, but I'm not planning on divulging it in case we are the mason group. Damn. This sounds like a possible combination of those circular-confirming Masons (what game was that in?) and the SSB Masons. Worse, even, since at least in SSB, the Masons knew for sure that one Mason was scum. My first thought was circular confirming as well but I'm not entirely sure how it works.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:57:57 GMT -5
Post by special on May 4, 2009 20:57:57 GMT -5
From zero to 4 votes within 24 hours of Day's end. Surprise surprise. This, apparently, is why I was never in debate in school. Between Pollux and Sister Coyote, I think I'd rather force a claim from Pollux. What really? That's the reason you chose me over the other choice? You want to force a claim out of me? Buh. Guh. Well, whatever. Here's what I am. I'm Captain Hammer's Groupie #1. I know who Groupie #2 is. There are more groupies than that but I don't know who they are, and I don't know any alignments. I assume we groupies are a variant on a masonic group, but I don't know for certain. Maybe one of the other Groupies, or Captain Hammer himself, knows all the alignments for definite but that's just postulating on my part. From the information I have at my disposal about my role, I'm about as good as vanilla town. All I can do is confirm who Groupie #2 is who they say they are. I'll be back to respond to all the votes and questions posed to me but I figure I'll go ahead and get this out. This sounds like an almost entirely useless role. You know the name of one character who has a role that you can probably assume has no real powers like you. But they could be Mostly Vanilla Scum or mostly Vanilla Town
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Day One
May 4, 2009 20:58:06 GMT -5
Post by Pollux Oil on May 4, 2009 20:58:06 GMT -5
So, you can confirm groupietwo, but can groupiethree confirm you? Supposing there are only three groupies, still no idea. All I know is I can confirm who Groupie #2 is. I don't know how the rest of it works. One thing that's crossed my mind is Groupie #2 knows all the groupies, and all the groupies know Groupie #2.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 21:05:25 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on May 4, 2009 21:05:25 GMT -5
[fluff]If you're really a groupie, let's see your collection of Captain Hammer dry-cleaning bills.[/fluff]
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Day One
May 4, 2009 21:31:11 GMT -5
Post by sachertorte on May 4, 2009 21:31:11 GMT -5
At some point in time I suggested a circular masonic group (I think I mentioned it to storyteller when he was making a game, but I don't remember precisely). This is essentially a weakened mason group.
What I had proposed is three (possibly more, but I think I had proposed three), let's label them Masons A, B, and C.
So Mason A would know Mason B is Town. Mason B would know Mason C is Town. Mason C would know Mason A is Town. (This idea is documented somewhere)
The idea was to create a mason group that was not as strong as the usual mason group. I find the claim very plausible.
What this means: If you are a MASON and NOT a Groupie, counter claiming might be a good idea. Please weigh your belief that Pollux is lying against the risk of exposing yourself.
If you are a Groupie and have information that is consistent with what Pollux has revealed so far, you have some choices to make: - stay silent. It is unlikely that a claimed mason will be lynched. However, there are RISKS. Death of a Groupie will weaken the group beyond losing a member, the ability to cross confirm may be compromised in this event. Assuming there are 3 groupies (which is consistent with the show). I suppose if Groupie number #2 dies, that would do much to confirm Pollux, but we would be unable to confirm #3. If Groupie #3 dies then Pollux would need to reveal #2, which should do well to confirm both. If Pollux dies, then we will need to rely on name claim for the remaining groupies with #3 able to be confirmed by #2, but little else.
- speak up. I don't know if this is a good idea or not. SOP is to keep Masons silent to keep them hidden from scum, however the delicate nature of the information structure makes a claim more reasonable. You need to judge this for yourselves as one of you knows who all the Masons (assuming 3) are now. The more you feel that death is probable (yours or the other hidden mason), the more you should consider claiming. I'll also note that scum usually figure out who are masons rather quickly, though their progress on this front will be impeded since the masons don't even know who all the masons are.
I'm not going to pretend to know what the other groupies should do. Good luck though.
Pollux, what question(s) did you ask FCoD via PM?
Unvote: Pollux
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Day One
May 4, 2009 21:36:14 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on May 4, 2009 21:36:14 GMT -5
Okay, at this point, I'm wavering between Inner Stickler and Sister Coyote.
SC for backing off her her Pollux vote so easily. which makes her revote for Pollux after Pleo's vote look like scrambling for credibility.
IS for his vote on paul combined with the listing of our options as: "1. Lynch Pleonast 2. Random Lynch 3. Lynch a Lurker" And then in his next post voting paul. Mitigated a bit by the fact that he'd FOSed paul already, but mitigation offset by him not including any explanation of why he'd changed his mind about the options (there's been about a day between the posts, so it's plausible that he could have read or thought of something to change his mind, but he says nothing to explain the turnaround).
I am not going to be around for the end of Day, but I should be able to be online about 7 AM tomorrow, so this may not be my final vote, if anything changes, but for now, I'm voting SisterCoyote.
I'd still like to see IS address his tactic switch (or if he's done so and I missed it, he can link to the post).
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Day One
May 4, 2009 21:42:21 GMT -5
Post by Gir! on May 4, 2009 21:42:21 GMT -5
One suggestion to add to sache's analysis above: Maybe one of the other Groupies, or Captain Hammer himself, knows all the alignments for definite but that's just postulating on my part. If the bolded hypothesis is correct, I don't think Captain Hammer should speak up, especially if he has other abilities (which is likely). On the other hand, based on Captain Hammer's canon personality, I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't have a clue who his groupies are. ;D
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Day One
May 4, 2009 21:43:36 GMT -5
Post by special on May 4, 2009 21:43:36 GMT -5
If you are a Groupie and have information that is consistent with what Pollux has revealed so far, you have some choices to make: - stay silent. It is unlikely that a claimed mason will be lynched. However, there are RISKS. Death of a Groupie will weaken the group beyond losing a member, the ability to cross confirm may be compromised in this event. Assuming there are 3 groupies (which is consistent with the show). I suppose if Groupie number #2 dies, that would do much to confirm Pollux, but we would be unable to confirm #3. If Groupie #3 dies then Pollux would need to reveal #2, which should do well to confirm both. If Pollux dies, then we will need to rely on name claim for the remaining groupies with #3 able to be confirmed by #2, but little else. I'm not sure if I understand. If Pollux =G1 Pollux knows the identity of G2 G2 knows G3 G3 knows Pollux If G2 dies, Pollux will be able to say, "yup that was G2" And nothing will have been confirmed at all. If G3 dies, Pollux can Identify G2 before G2 outs themselves thereby confirming himself If Pollux dies, G2 can claim and ID G3, barring that, anyone can claim G3 Additionally, Pollux himself says that he doesn't know the alignment of the other Groupies. That sorta nullifies their Pro-Towniness.
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Day One
May 4, 2009 22:02:34 GMT -5
Post by The Real FCOD on May 4, 2009 22:02:34 GMT -5
Before bed vote count:
Sister Coyote (4) - zlw, Paul, Almost Human, Kat! Pollux (3) - Pleonast, Sister Coyote, Special Ed Paul (2) - NAF1138, Inner Stickler KidV (1) - Roosh sachertorte (1) - Pollux Inner Stickler (1) - Natlaw Natlaw (1) - sinjin
--FCOD
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