RoOsh
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Post by RoOsh on Apr 20, 2008 22:07:48 GMT -5
Day 6: 06:10 hours
The first rays of Dawn slowly creep upon the barred walls of Arkham Asylum, but on this morning it is a sound that arrives to the residents of Arkham before light.
"HOOT! CHIRP! QUACK! It's Him! He's after me! HONK! QUACK! CHIRP CHIRP!" screams the inmate known as Dark Smurf, running through the Halls of Arkham, leaving behind him a trail of items- with a broken pair of glasses serving as a monocle, and a cigarette now burning a charred mark on the ground. "QUACK! QUARK? SQUAWK! Goddammit Boss, they're after me!" He continues running through the Hall trying to find his savior, but alas he runs up the stairs past the confused figure of Storyteller and is not seen again. However, the inmates can hear his voice echoing down the stairs: "SQUACK! QUACK! SWARK! They're after me! Goddammit! It's him! He's- AAUUUUUUGHHHHH-"
And then there was silence.
The rest of the inmates all gathered up together and ran up the stairs to discover what had happened to their fowl mouthed companion. It was finally in the office at the end of the hall that they found the Dark Smurf. Or what was left of him anyways. NAF and Molefan were the first to solemnly react, sadly grabbing a broom and dustpan. Dark Smurf's dusty ashes were solemnly swept up, and all that remained was his nametag: Henchman #2. He had given his life to the cause, and he had done his job well. But ashes to ashes, dust to dust- the man was no more.
The inmates were all in mourning that morning, but quite puzzled over the discovery of their fellow baddie. It was then that someone noticed a package on the ground- "Death by Irony". She walked over to the package, and opened it up puzzled. Her face widened as she realized what was inside- "Oh for the-" ~FSSSSSHHH!!!~ The now familiar canister sprays its contents all over DBI, who begins to cough and gag from the nasty odor.Death By Irony is now resistant to Sharks! [/b]
Brewha just shakes his head at the madness, "Come on, guys, we've got a job to do. It's another Day, so let's figure this out. I'm going to be downstairs in the cafeteria, so let's get on with this." He then headed downstairs, as the others continued to meander upstairs, and slowly shuffle their way downstairs.
KA-POW! A loud noise echoed from downstairs, and the inmates looked at each other, what now? They all run downstairs, and into the acrid smelling cafeteria. There they discover a ripped and charred cannister that reads "BatFlash Grenade". "Apparently a trap had been set for our dear Brewha, but who set it?" asked BlasterMaster. "It... it was him." spat out a voice from the corner "it was... The Bat Man. Oooh... my head." Brewha lay crumpled up in the corner, his hands covering his face and eyes. "I... I can't see and my stomach...oooh, I feel so weak. Can't... move... much. You guys... get him for me. I'll just... lay here for a while...." He weakly lays in the corner as the other inmates look at each other with grim resolve.
It is now a new Day at Arkham Asylum. Dusk will be at ?:00, Friday April 25.
Dark Smurf, a.k.a. Dehydrating Pirate #1, Rehydrated, a Baddie Mason, was ReDehyrated by the Scum. Death By Irony is now resistant to Sharks! Brewha has been weakened by the Batflash Grenade!
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Post by storyteller0910 on Apr 20, 2008 22:15:24 GMT -5
Ya know, Masons, a good way to keep people from not trusting you the whole game long might have been to do fewer things that make you appear untrustworthy. I'm just saying.
Oh, and let's get this party started:
vote Darth Sensitive
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Post by Greedy Smurf on Apr 20, 2008 22:30:23 GMT -5
Hey no fair Mods. I logged on, saw I had no new PM's and thought Pewh safe for another day. But Noooooo, read the colour and blammo. To make this my official good-bye zombie post : Go the Baddies, get the Bat.
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Death By Irony
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The Former Mandate of Heaven/Current Gastard Night Mod
I'm my own mind-altering substance!
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Post by Death By Irony on Apr 20, 2008 22:58:42 GMT -5
:Coughs: Whoever did this :Coughs: to me, I hate you so :Coughs: much right now. :Coughs:
Going :Coughs: to reread a little, cross-check my notes and stuff.
:Coughs: Bastards. :Coughs:
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Blaster Master
Mome Rath
The player formerly know as BLAM!
Now 34.788% less repellant to Sharks! :( [on:I WANT TO DIE!][of:I WANT TO LIVE!]
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Post by Blaster Master on Apr 20, 2008 23:30:16 GMT -5
:Coughs: Whoever did this :Coughs: to me, I hate you so :Coughs: much right now. :Coughs: Going :Coughs: to reread a little, cross-check my notes and stuff. :Coughs: gastards. :Coughs:Now you will know our pain. ;D Oh, and... Vote Darth Sensitive
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Darth Sensitive
Mome Rath
With great power comes great responsibility / That's the catchphrase of Old Uncle Ben
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Post by Darth Sensitive on Apr 20, 2008 23:43:00 GMT -5
When you get a chance, I'd like to hear the case against me story, but I've had time to de-incense myself over the night.
Molefan until you do a bit of explaining for as to why your claim happened to be Dark Smurf's character, you have my vote.
Vote:Molefan1981[/color]
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Post by Rysto on Apr 21, 2008 0:14:53 GMT -5
Role claim time: I am an investigator. My PM, for your edification: My results: Night One: Investigate MHaye -- blocked by atarus breadcrumb("nothing happened last night") breadcrumb ("I don't know anything about you yet.") Night Two: Investigate Santo Rugger -- blocked by Hoopy Frood (I didn't breadcrumb this because all night actions were blocked) Night Three: Investigate brewha -- Town breadcrumb(in retrospect, not obvious enough) Night Four: Investigate Hoopy Frood -- blocked by Hoopy Frood breadcrumb ("nothing happened") breadcrumb ("it's not like you'd be blocking an important pro-town role.", which evidently went completely over Hoopy's head) Night Five: Investigate Death by Irony -- Playing for Keeps Hawkeyeop, you are a liar. I'm not sure if you really are a scum investigator or if you got lucky on Ryjae, but you're clearly a Do-Gooder. tdpats, that was a clever claim, but Smurf was very clear: there were only 3 PFKs 2 days ago, and they were DBI, Hal and Ryjae. You're also a Do-Gooder. DBI, if you were a benign PFK like tdpats claimed, you would have counter-claimed him. Therefore we must conclude that you are a threat to us, and you must die, soon. Now, in the opening colour for Day Five, Hal says: There are two possible interpretations of that: five scum or five Do-Gooders. If it meant five Do-Gooders, there are currently 5 Do-Gooders, 6 Townies and 1 PFK. If that is the case, we have lost. The only thing left to determine is whether DBI or the Do-Gooders win. We've only lynched Town once, so five remaining Do-Gooders would have meant we have absolutely no chance at all. So I reject this possibility. The other interpretation is five scum: 2 PFK, 3 Do-Gooders. If that is the case we have 2 mislynches left, including the DBI lynch. The final scum will likely be either Darth or BLaM, and I'm leaning towards BLaM. I'm depending on the rest of you to find that final Do-Gooder. I could have held off on this claim -- the night-kills tell me that the Do-Gooders are not on to me at all -- but this information is totally critical and I cannot risk dying toNight. If the Do-Gooders realize that there has to be a Cop in this game somewhere they probably have a 50% of hitting me, at worst, and there's a ton of evidence out there that I'm a Cop. So I'm claiming now. To head off some obvious questions: why didn't I claim yesterDay, when story called on me to do so? Obviously, because I didn't have any useful information to share. brewha did not look to be long for this world and confirming one more townie wasn't worth guaranteeing that either I'd be dead or made vanilla by brewha. Second, how do you all know that you can trust me? First of all, an analysis of my posts will show that I'm probably an alignment cop. Do you remember Day 1, when I pressed NAF about how many factions there were in the game, and had to backtrack after Hawk posted the phrase "Playing For Keeps" just after I had slipped the same phrase into one of my posts? NAF questioned me about that and I responded here. Now, the questions (and frankly I am shocked that nobody, with the possible exception of Rugger, picked up on this) are: a) Why did I believe that I was in possession of special information? b) Why did I take such pains to conceal the fact that I had special information? The answer to both is simple, now, isn't it? I'm an alignment cop, and it's perfectly natural that I might be in possession of extra information about the different factions, and I'd definitely want to conceal the fact that I have that information, because it points to the fact that I'm a cop. Another piece of evidence in my favour is this post, in which I make the unbelievably stupid slip and reveal that I "know" that there are exactly 3 factions. I'm an alignment cop, and the 3 possible alignments I can get back are Do-Gooder, Playing For Keeps or Town, so it's perfectly natural for me to assume that all players with the Playing For Keeps alignment are aligned together, and totally in character for me to slip like that and reveal that assumption. Further analysis will reveal that I'm almost certainly not a Do-Gooder. I can't be a Do-Gooder because having a Do-Gooder switch to PFK with the Joker would have been horrifically unbalanced. So if I'm not lying about the secret win condition, I'm not a Do-Gooder. And an analysis of the many things I said about the Joker, I think, will support my claim about the secret win condition. I was certain that the Joker had a group. Again, I believed that there were only 2 scum groups, and the Joker had been revealed to almost certainly be Playing for Keeps. And given Harley Quinn's colour, it seemed perfectly natural that should I discover the Joker's identity, I'd join his group. So I pretty clearly thought that I knew many things about the Joker, but I was wrong. The inferences I made from the information that I had were quite wrong, which is a point in my favour: I clearly wasn't aligned with the Joker at that point. That brings up a sticky point, though: how can you trust that my secret win condition hasn't activated? The answer is simple: I was blocked every night Santo Rugger was alive. It has since been modfirmed to me that had Hoopy Frood not blocked me Night Two, I would have started playing for keeps after psychoanalysing the Joker, and with his death, I'd now be a Serial Killer. So don't feel too bad about the fact that you've blocked me twice, Hoopy, you probably inadvertently saved the game for the Town. Here's my evaluation of the situation: we have no idea what DBI's win condition is, so we need her dead before she can activate it. After her, I think that my preferred lynching order would go tdpats, Hawkeyeop, Darth, BLaM. I open the floor to the inevitable rash of counter claims from tdpats, DBI and Hawk. Good luck talking your way of this one, guys.
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Darth Sensitive
Mome Rath
With great power comes great responsibility / That's the catchphrase of Old Uncle Ben
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Post by Darth Sensitive on Apr 21, 2008 0:25:52 GMT -5
Well... That's certainly interesting.
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RoOsh
FGM
Former BatMod
[on:Wanna see a magic trick?][of:See You, Space Cowboy....]
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Post by RoOsh on Apr 21, 2008 0:58:33 GMT -5
When you get a chance, I'd like to hear the case against me story, but I've had time to de-incense myself over the night. Molefan until you do a bit of explaining for as to why your claim happened to be Dark Smurf's character, you have my vote. Vote:Molefan1981 [/color][/quote] Ah Crap. That's my Bad. Darth Smurf is Henchman #1. Carry On.
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Post by Holy Moley! on Apr 21, 2008 1:53:11 GMT -5
When you get a chance, I'd like to hear the case against me story, but I've had time to de-incense myself over the night. Molefan until you do a bit of explaining for as to why your claim happened to be Dark Smurf's character, you have my vote. Vote:Molefan1981[/color][/quote] Well, I'm sorry to lose Big Blue, but in regards to the Batclan's choice of kill, I have one thing to say: HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Seriously guys, you didn't think we were going to give away the Penguin THAT easily, did you? Silly, silly do-gooders... On the plus side, you only have two targets left now. That's assuming that NAF and I aren't BOTH rehydrating pirates and that the real Penguin isn't masquerading as someone else. Which they may very well be. You just never know, do you? PS - How'd you like my blatant indignation at being accused of lying in the first round, while all the time I was lying my ass off about Smurf being the penguin? I thought it was a nice convincer myself... and obviously the do-gooders agreed... Major analysis post coming up when I have the time, but for now I'm starting with a vote. And that vote is for Darth Sensitive. Seriously, two Masons revealed as town and he still votes for a confirmed third one? Big mistake my friend.
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Post by Holy Moley! on Apr 21, 2008 2:03:17 GMT -5
I'm not going to respond to all of the Mason-criticism, but this one I will: Ya know, Masons, a good way to keep people from not trusting you the whole game long might have been to do fewer things that make you appear untrustworthy. I'm just saying. Like revealing details of the roleplayer I claimed to know about on Day One, which caused all of the molegate idiocy in the first place? Didn't I always say I wouldn't do that? The only reason anybody ever claimed it was Dark Smurf was to protect the real Penguin. Well, the Penguin is still in the game and I hope it's clear to everyone that I for one have no intention of revealing who he or she is. There is simply no benefit whatsoever to the townies, and every benefit to the do-gooders. Right now, to get to the Penguin, they have a 50/50 shot of getting it wrong if - and only if - the Penguin is NAF or me. If it's not, they'll have to start looking at likely false aliases as well. We can sacrifice a few rehydrated pirates if it means that the do-gooders waste a few night kills on powerless Masons. They've done it once so far. If they do it again with NAF or myself - well, we knew what we were letting ourselves in for.
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Post by Holy Moley! on Apr 21, 2008 3:11:51 GMT -5
One thing I immediately notice about Harley Quinn's role PM: it mentions the word "scum".
More on this later, I'm just putting it here for my own reference...
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Apr 21, 2008 7:40:47 GMT -5
First a question for Rysto: You didn't get any flavor text when I blocked you, did you?
Now, some analysis based on Rysto's comments:
There are 12 of us left (the Mod's have 13 on the player list count, but I think they forgot to count Smurf, since the list itself shows 12 people dead, including Smurf).
Of these 12, we have the following breakdown:
Confirmed town: NAF1138, Molefan1981. We know the masons are town from the modkill. We know the masons have confirmed each other. Yeah, they haven't been quite playing straight, but in retrospect, it's understandable why.
Confirmed town by Rysto: Brewha. A doc/roleblocker.
Likely town based on wealth of information provided: Rysto. Yeah, we don't know for sure, but at this point, we need to take some things on faith. Rysto has challenged a lot of people; it's a huge gamble for scum to take, since they are winning right now.
Likely town based on events: Hoopy Frood, storyteller. Yes, I know three blasted role-blockers on town. Unlikely. Don't ask me why this was done, but, unless you think Rysto and/or the masons were lying, since the PFK is exposed, I would have to be scum. I think both my character actions and behavior as a player would make it a stretch at this point. I regret blocking Rysto when he invesigated me, though. It would have confirmed me. I'd be happy to die to prove my towniness, but town can't really afford at this point to lynch too many town. That being said, I really am curious as to why town was such role-blocker heavy, since it doesn't appear that individual blocks are doing anything to stop kills. (The only kill that was stopped was from Brewha acting as a doctor.) For the record, I blocked Hawkeyop last night.
As for story, well, he has given us nothing as far as role or information. However, has been very forthcoming in discussion. Also, Koldanar was town, and based on something in his PM, was fairly certain story was as well.
Confirmed PFK: DBI
Confirmed liars: Hawkeyop and tdpats. Usually no good reason for town to lie. Definitely no reason for town to claim a PFK. tdpats is no doubt scum. Hawkeyop is likely scum.
That leaves three people we know almost nothing aboutoutside of what they've said: Darth, BlasterMaster, and Sinjin. Based on the numbers, with 3 or 4 scum (3 if Rysto's interpretation of Riddler's color text was accurate, 4 seems more likely to me) and likely 2 exposed, we can assume we have at least one scum in that list.
Sinjin's only known power would be useful for anybody. Her role stated that she could survive one kill. However, scum haven't tried to take her out since. Even though, she's exposed and would be pretty much a guarantee. However, they have had more dangerous targets, so this in of itself really doesn't mean much. Unfortunately, if town, her role gives her little chance of proving she's town. Out of the three, she's the least likely scum, IMO.
BlasterMaster has a vague claim. As long as he's alive, scum are unlikely to win. Scum haven't tried to take him out, though. You'd think he'd be at the top of their list. Especially since his passive power doesn't work against the Bat.
Darth is the most unknown of all. The only thing we know is that Lex is the guy behind all this and he's trying to get the Bat.
I'm not sure who I'm going to vote for. We really need to hit scum. However, we have a malicious PFK out there (unless, DBI can adequately explain why she was setting up the town to leave a scum alive by not counter-claiming tdpatriots). Unfortunately, vote tallies at this point give us no information, because scum can easily start sacrificing up their own with no real concerns. They have a big numbers advantage at this point. I'm thinking, we hit the ones we do know are lying. So for now, my vote is:
vote tdpatriots[/color]
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Post by brewha on Apr 21, 2008 7:58:18 GMT -5
Hey guys. Not feelings so well today. I shoulda stuck around to see watch what was happening at the end of yesterDay. I gotta say that just sucks. So, we got another PFK. Good for us, but good for scum too. I would have much rather seen Blam go down yesterday.
At this point I'm inclined to believe Rysto for who he says he is. It just bugs me that in the Batman world, Harley tends to occasionaly help out the do gooders. And with the Joker dead, it seems to me that Harley would be more likely to become a full time Do Gooder than a full time Baddie.
I'm not sure who I'll vote for yet toDay, but I'd better make it count. I have a sneaking suspicion that it'll be the last vote I cast.
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Post by Hawkmod on Apr 21, 2008 8:32:44 GMT -5
Thanks Rysto. You made life considerably easier. I take it that you are close enough to winning that you only need to buy a little extra time?
vote Rysto
You have a secret win condition, but the mods won't tell you what it is? That seems odd. I go back to Dark saying the number of scum is approximate. I read that to mean that the number can change. I'm not sure if you started as a scum or became one, but either way your lying.
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Post by storyteller0910 on Apr 21, 2008 8:33:37 GMT -5
I'm not going to respond to all of the Mason-criticism, but this one I will: Ya know, Masons, a good way to keep people from not trusting you the whole game long might have been to do fewer things that make you appear untrustworthy. I'm just saying. Like revealing details of the roleplayer I claimed to know about on Day One, which caused all of the molegate idiocy in the first place? Didn't I always say I wouldn't do that? The only reason anybody ever claimed it was Dark Smurf was to protect the real Penguin. Well, the Penguin is still in the game and I hope it's clear to everyone that I for one have no intention of revealing who he or she is. There is simply no benefit whatsoever to the townies, and every benefit to the do-gooders. It is good that you know everything about the game set-up, and can therefore tell definitively which lies benefit the Town, and which do not? Oh, you don't know the entire set-up? You have no idea what benefit the Town could have gained from a more honest approach (which could have included, "hey, the four of us are Masons; one of us is the Penguin but we're not going to share which," by the way)? Oh. Well, that's less good, then. Look, I've had this argument is past games and I frankly haven't the patience or the typing stamina to hash it out again. All I'll say is that I hope that the real Penguin has some unbelievable powers. I hope that he has an optional Night kill, Day and Night investigations, and the ability to keep everyone in the game alive for a Night at his discretion. I hope he can fart perfume and turn lead into gold. I sure as heck hope that the little bits and pieces of game set-up information you all have been leaking aren't the extent of his abilities. Because, in the service of protecting the Penguin, you have sown confusion and frustration among the Town, your putative allies. You have made the jobs of the other power roles much more difficult. You have given to the scum, wrapped in a pretty silk bow, perfectly defensible reasons to push suspicion at the Masons. You have risked the very real clusterfuck that would have occurred had Hal Briston decided to check out the Dark Smurf = Penguin connection for any reason. You've done all this because you've prioritized the protection of the Penguin over team play. I hope he's worth it. You all keep on playing whatever game you're playing over there in your corner. The Town will be over here, trying to work together to find scum. ---- Addressing the rest of the Town: the deaths of Cookies and Smurf have definitively put to rest the possibility of scum or PFK Masons. Unfortunately - and especially given the grotesque degree to which the Masons have jerked us around throughout this game - we cannot rest comfortable that they don't have an alternate win condition opposed to our own. We can't lynch them. The numbers make that clear (see below for more). But they can't be trusted. Anything they've said must be considered as likely to be a lie as the truth. And we must look carefully for a way to make sure that if they have an alternate win condition, it doesn't get triggered.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Apr 21, 2008 8:36:30 GMT -5
Another thing, it's likely the scum knew that DBI was PFK already, and knew that she wouldn't counter-claim, which means they probably know her power.
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Darth Sensitive
Mome Rath
With great power comes great responsibility / That's the catchphrase of Old Uncle Ben
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Post by Darth Sensitive on Apr 21, 2008 8:40:05 GMT -5
When you get a chance, I'd like to hear the case against me story, but I've had time to de-incense myself over the night. Molefan until you do a bit of explaining for as to why your claim happened to be Dark Smurf's character, you have my vote. Vote:Molefan1981[/color][/quote] Well, I'm sorry to lose Big Blue, but in regards to the Batclan's choice of kill, I have one thing to say: HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Seriously guys, you didn't think we were going to give away the Penguin THAT easily, did you? Silly, silly do-gooders... On the plus side, you only have two targets left now. That's assuming that NAF and I aren't BOTH rehydrating pirates and that the real Penguin isn't masquerading as someone else. Which they may very well be. You just never know, do you? PS - How'd you like my blatant indignation at being accused of lying in the first round, while all the time I was lying my ass off about Smurf being the penguin? I thought it was a nice convincer myself... and obviously the do-gooders agreed... Major analysis post coming up when I have the time, but for now I'm starting with a vote. And that vote is for Darth Sensitive. Seriously, two Masons revealed as town and he still votes for a confirmed third one? Big mistake my friend.[/quote] (bleached) No. I'm voting for a confirmed liar. I still want an explanation from you - you gave half of one, but I think you might be able to make a full one without being a jackass like you have been so far today. Until I get that explanation, I'm leaving my vote on the 'pirate'. I do however, think we need to lynch one of the liars, preferably the pfk, because we don't know win conditions.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Apr 21, 2008 8:42:24 GMT -5
Thanks Rysto. You made life considerably easier. I take it that you are close enough to winning that you only need to buy a little extra time? vote RystoYou have a secret win condition, but the mods won't tell you what it is? That seems odd. I go back to Dark saying the number of scum is approximate. I read that to mean that the number can change. I'm not sure if you started as a scum or became one, but either way your lying. Actually, he did tell us what it was. If he happened to investigate Joker, he would have changed alignments and become another SK. I happened to block him on night 2 preventing this. This also isn't the first time he's mentioned the secret win condition, but to not draw attention to himself earlier, he didn't go into specifics. He did say that the Joker's death confirmed him as town, however. You could argue that you don't believe him for whatever reasons you want, but lack of consistency and lack of disclosure of the secret win aren't valid positions.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Apr 21, 2008 8:44:35 GMT -5
He did say that the Joker's death confirmed him as town, however. And to clarify, I'm referring to earlier (I think it was Day IV, but I don't remember and the Day itself is largely irrelevant) when the remaining number of PFK's was indicated by the masons. Rysto's been consistent in what he's said.
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Blaster Master
Mome Rath
The player formerly know as BLAM!
Now 34.788% less repellant to Sharks! :( [on:I WANT TO DIE!][of:I WANT TO LIVE!]
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Post by Blaster Master on Apr 21, 2008 8:52:05 GMT -5
When you get a chance, I'd like to hear the case against me story, but I've had time to de-incense myself over the night. Molefan until you do a bit of explaining for as to why your claim happened to be Dark Smurf's character, you have my vote. Vote:Molefan1981Well, I'm sorry to lose Big Blue, but in regards to the Batclan's choice of kill, I have one thing to say: HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Seriously guys, you didn't think we were going to give away the Penguin THAT easily, did you? Silly, silly do-gooders... On the plus side, you only have two targets left now. That's assuming that NAF and I aren't BOTH rehydrating pirates and that the real Penguin isn't masquerading as someone else. Which they may very well be. You just never know, do you? PS - How'd you like my blatant indignation at being accused of lying in the first round, while all the time I was lying my ass off about Smurf being the penguin? I thought it was a nice convincer myself... and obviously the do-gooders agreed... Major analysis post coming up when I have the time, but for now I'm starting with a vote. And that vote is for Darth Sensitive. Seriously, two Masons revealed as town and he still votes for a confirmed third one? Big mistake my friend. You know, I have to say that I'm confused. I can appreciate hiding the identity of the penguin if he does, indeed, have useful powers. However, the events don't jive very well with your explanation. It was the claimed penguin who was revealing special information that I would have expected would come from the Penguin. But, if he wasn't, how was he getting that information, particularly after the whole "private message" fiasco on Day One which almost resulted in a major mod smackdown? Now, I don't think you're scum, and I agree that revealing the Penguin is probably not in our favor, but I agree with storyteller in saying that you have not a lot to cause distrust of yourselves. Just because we're sure you're Baddie doesn't mean you get to go around contradicting yourselves and raising confusion, because all it does is distract us. So, I'd appreciate as much of a disclosure about this as possible, and not veiled with "haha, we fooled you."
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Apr 21, 2008 9:00:44 GMT -5
Until I get that explanation, I'm leaving my vote on the 'pirate'. I do however, think we need to lynch one of the liars, preferably the pfk, because we don't know win conditions. Preferably the PFK? We need to reduce the scum's numbers by at least one. Every scum we take out gives us a bigger cushion in case we mis-lynch. The PFK hasn't been killing anyone, and no-one's gotten hats or anything, so her win condition doesn't put us in any sort of immediate danger. Now what does have me worried is that the scum knew she was PFK. In fact, I'm willing to bet that hawkeyop has been playing honest with both his power, and the fact that he found Ryjae as PFK. He gave us a PFK, one who was dangerous to scum and town. He said himself that his power works best on outing PFK's. However, I think he's investigated many more people than he told us. He's the scum investigator, and has only been giving town information that benefits everybody. He lied about DBI in order for scum to assume a PFK role with tdpatriots. He knew she couldn't counter-claim for some reason. This would explain that they don't view her as a threat, as they did Ryjae. I'd be willing to consider lynching her Day VII, but there are way too many scum out there right now, and lynching a PFK won't net us info or a numbers advantage. We take her out, and scum gets closer to their win condition tonight. And remember, scum has enough numbers that they can swing a lynch to non-scum, something we can't afford. We know what scum's win goal is, and to paraphrase Blam's arguments for lynchign Ryjae, better to go with the enemy we do know than the one we don't. At least for now.
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Blaster Master
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Post by Blaster Master on Apr 21, 2008 9:09:41 GMT -5
Okay, and in light of Rysto's claim, I call bullshit. You CLAIM to have investigated the Joker on the Night you were blocked, how do we know you didn't do it another Night? How do we know that was how your secret condition would be activated? Is it possible you took over his role when he died, you know, trying to get revenge for us killin' your "puddin'"? Maybe it was something else entirely that would have set you PFK.
One thing I DO agree with, is that either you or Hawk is a liar, but at this point I'm inclined to believe Hawk because he has actually provided us with confirmable information. Meanwhile, your explanation for that is he was lucky?
Either way, we've ended up in a similar situation that we were in yesterday, we have a pair of liars, and each one ties to several other people. If Hawk is telling the truth, then Rysto is lying, DBI is Baddie, and tdpatriots depends on whether Rysto is PFK or Do-Gooder. If Rysto is honest, hawk is Do-Gooder, DBI is PFK, and tdpatriots is Do-Gooder.
OTOH, all of THAT depends on how much we believe the claim from Dark Smurf about the number of Do-Gooders and PFKs left, but considering he wasn't even the Penguin, we have no reason to beleive he'd have that power (as a rehydrated pirate), that he'd be able to communicate with the Penguin to get that information, or that they don't have some other secret win condition, I'm not so sure we can trust THAT information anymore either.
But for now, it looks like our best move is to discern which one between Hawk and Rysto is lying, so I'm going to put my vote on whom I'm more inclined to believe is lying and, by chance if he's not, where it will generate the most information.
Unvote Darth Sensitive Vote Rysto
Also, to help clear things up on this matter, I'd like some more tangible claims from Hawk and DBI.
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Blaster Master
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Post by Blaster Master on Apr 21, 2008 9:15:20 GMT -5
Until I get that explanation, I'm leaving my vote on the 'pirate'. I do however, think we need to lynch one of the liars, preferably the pfk, because we don't know win conditions. Preferably the PFK? We need to reduce the scum's numbers by at least one. Every scum we take out gives us a bigger cushion in case we mis-lynch. The PFK hasn't been killing anyone, and no-one's gotten hats or anything, so her win condition doesn't put us in any sort of immediate danger. Now what does have me worried is that the scum knew she was PFK. In fact, I'm willing to bet that hawkeyop has been playing honest with both his power, and the fact that he found Ryjae as PFK. He gave us a PFK, one who was dangerous to scum and town. He said himself that his power works best on outing PFK's. However, I think he's investigated many more people than he told us. He's the scum investigator, and has only been giving town information that benefits everybody. He lied about DBI in order for scum to assume a PFK role with tdpatriots. He knew she couldn't counter-claim for some reason. This would explain that they don't view her as a threat, as they did Ryjae. I'd be willing to consider lynching her Day VII, but there are way too many scum out there right now, and lynching a PFK won't net us info or a numbers advantage. We take her out, and scum gets closer to their win condition tonight. And remember, scum has enough numbers that they can swing a lynch to non-scum, something we can't afford. We know what scum's win goal is, and to paraphrase Blam's arguments for lynchign Ryjae, better to go with the enemy we do know than the one we don't. At least for now. See, this argument doesn't make sense to me. If Hawk is a scum investigator, why would he pick out someone he hadn't investigated, and if he HAD investigated her and she WAS PFK, why would he say she was town and tie himself into a triple play lynch-a-thon. More logically, if he's scum, he'd know who the scum were, so when he found the last PFK, he could have safely assumed anyone else was town, and thus just come up with a good reason why he'd investigate someone else and just say they were town. I'm not getting the motivation behind this potential lie here at all.
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Post by storyteller0910 on Apr 21, 2008 9:21:12 GMT -5
Preferably the PFK? We need to reduce the scum's numbers by at least one. Every scum we take out gives us a bigger cushion in case we mis-lynch. The PFK hasn't been killing anyone, and no-one's gotten hats or anything, so her win condition doesn't put us in any sort of immediate danger. Now what does have me worried is that the scum knew she was PFK. In fact, I'm willing to bet that hawkeyop has been playing honest with both his power, and the fact that he found Ryjae as PFK. He gave us a PFK, one who was dangerous to scum and town. He said himself that his power works best on outing PFK's. However, I think he's investigated many more people than he told us. He's the scum investigator, and has only been giving town information that benefits everybody. He lied about DBI in order for scum to assume a PFK role with tdpatriots. He knew she couldn't counter-claim for some reason. This would explain that they don't view her as a threat, as they did Ryjae. I'd be willing to consider lynching her Day VII, but there are way too many scum out there right now, and lynching a PFK won't net us info or a numbers advantage. We take her out, and scum gets closer to their win condition tonight. And remember, scum has enough numbers that they can swing a lynch to non-scum, something we can't afford. We know what scum's win goal is, and to paraphrase Blam's arguments for lynchign Ryjae, better to go with the enemy we do know than the one we don't. At least for now. See, this argument doesn't make sense to me. If Hawk is a scum investigator, why would he pick out someone he hadn't investigated, and if he HAD investigated her and she WAS PFK, why would he say she was town and tie himself into a triple play lynch-a-thon. More logically, if he's scum, he'd know who the scum were, so when he found the last PFK, he could have safely assumed anyone else was town, and thus just come up with a good reason why he'd investigate someone else and just say they were town. I'm not getting the motivation behind this potential lie here at all. The only motivation I can think of would be if Dark Smurf was lying to us (I know, contain your shock and amazement) and there are still two PFK remaining: tdpatriots12 and DbI. In such a situation, the hypothetical hawk-as-scum-investigator checks out whoever he checks out. But knowing (as he thinks he does) that tdpatriots12 is the "last" PFK, he assumes DbI is Town and throws that out there. I don't know. I'm more inclined to believe Rysto then hawk, but I kind of think both of their stories smell cruddy right now. If we could be sure that Smurf's numbers are correct, we could solve this problem by lynching tdpatriots12. If tdpats turns up PFK, then Rysto is lying. If tdpats turns up scum, then Rysto very well may be telling the truth. There is zero danger that tdpats is Town, so killing him helps solve the who-is-lying puzzle to some extent while minimizing risk of wasting our last mislynch. Hm.
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Darth Sensitive
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Post by Darth Sensitive on Apr 21, 2008 9:24:08 GMT -5
But, because of a wonderful web of lies, we can't be sure of that.
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Post by Darth Sensitive on Apr 21, 2008 9:24:54 GMT -5
But, because of a wonderful web of lies, we can't be sure of that.
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Post by Hawkmod on Apr 21, 2008 9:26:38 GMT -5
Unless, of course a PFK wins first. I think we have bigger fish to fry, but I would not be the least bit surprised if the Penguin is playing for keeps, and the masons win with him. In fact, based on the masons actions, I'd be kind of surprised if that wasn't the case.
Well she is town, but even she was PFK how would you know that? If you don't know someone's win condition, how can you tell it isn't close to be being met?
What exactly do you think my power is? Investigate multiple people per day and find their exact win condition? Does that make sense to you? Does my actions at the end of the previous day support that?
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Post by Blaster Master on Apr 21, 2008 9:39:26 GMT -5
Hawk, since you're here, can you please provide a full claim with your PM.
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Post by Blaster Master on Apr 21, 2008 9:55:09 GMT -5
See, this argument doesn't make sense to me. If Hawk is a scum investigator, why would he pick out someone he hadn't investigated, and if he HAD investigated her and she WAS PFK, why would he say she was town and tie himself into a triple play lynch-a-thon. More logically, if he's scum, he'd know who the scum were, so when he found the last PFK, he could have safely assumed anyone else was town, and thus just come up with a good reason why he'd investigate someone else and just say they were town. I'm not getting the motivation behind this potential lie here at all. The only motivation I can think of would be if Dark Smurf was lying to us (I know, contain your shock and amazement) and there are still two PFK remaining: tdpatriots12 and DbI. In such a situation, the hypothetical hawk-as-scum-investigator checks out whoever he checks out. But knowing (as he thinks he does) that tdpatriots12 is the "last" PFK, he assumes DbI is Town and throws that out there. I don't know. I'm more inclined to believe Rysto then hawk, but I kind of think both of their stories smell cruddy right now. If we could be sure that Smurf's numbers are correct, we could solve this problem by lynching tdpatriots12. If tdpats turns up PFK, then Rysto is lying. If tdpats turns up scum, then Rysto very well may be telling the truth. There is zero danger that tdpats is Town, so killing him helps solve the who-is-lying puzzle to some extent while minimizing risk of wasting our last mislynch. Hm. That's exactly the problem, storyteller, we CAN'T believe those numbers from Smurf anymore, but I don't think that motivation is the case either. If hawk is a scum investigator, and believed Smurf, then if tdpatriots isn't Do-Gooder, he'd HAVE to be PFK (why would town say they were PFK?). So, he'd know if tdpatriots was PFK or Do-Gooder, right? So, if he knew he was PFK, then he may have lied about DBI by assuming she was town. If tdpatriots was Do-Gooder, then that means he'd know there was at least one more PFK out there, and he would have known better than to blindly pick someone who wasn't scum and say they're town, because he COULD have been wrong. So, if hawk is a scum investigator, that means tdpatriots is PFK, DBI is ALSO PFK, and the Masons LIED to us in a way that doesn't seem consistent with pro-town motivation, and lends credence to the suspicion that the Penguin may have some sort of PFK win condition as well. That said, I DO agree that, on the surface, Rysto's claim looks more believable, but that, I think, is largely a byproduct of the seeming completeness of his claim compared to a lack of a full claim on the part of Hawk. I won't be persuaded by it at this point because he's had AT LEAST a few Days to put it together. Hell, if he's been PFK the whole time, he very well could have been deliberately planting crumbs the whole time. Either way, as I see it, Hawk has at least provided us with some useful information (although, so did Hal), but it means he's at least SOME sort of investigator. I haven't seen anything to support Rysto's claim other than posts he's made himself and claiming to have confirmed the Scarecrow. And still, this whole thing DOES seem really fishy to me, because we already had an investigator in Two-Face, and a PFK one in the Riddler, and we can be reasonably sure that Hawk is some sort of investigator (either Do-Gooder, or Baddie). Are there really FOUR investigators in here? Hell, now that we can't even believe the PFK count from the Masons, I can't even feel confident there are THREE pro-town role-blockers. Dear God, this is getting convoluted.
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