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Post by Pleonast on Aug 28, 2009 10:41:37 GMT -5
Put whatever spoiled commentary you may have in here.
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Post by Pleonast on Aug 30, 2009 19:02:58 GMT -5
Well, we're off. Let's hope my balance calculations are not too flawed.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Aug 31, 2009 6:36:33 GMT -5
It's always interesting how the powers change around each time you run this. Should be fun to watch.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Aug 31, 2009 6:49:12 GMT -5
Looking at the role distribution, Cabal has the perfect combination of great players and personalities that shouldn't clash.
And Special Ed gets to work closely with Meeko again, but this time as fellow scum rather than masons. I wonder if it'll be as entertaining as Lost Mafia was.
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Post by Pleonast on Aug 31, 2009 11:13:43 GMT -5
Meeko was clever enough to ask for the Omega Wolf role, which is perfect for him. He'll investigate as Town and have team mates keeping him in check from behind the scenes.
I mix up the roles each time I run this to keep it fresh. Balance is always tricky, but each faction's secret power gives me flexibility. The Undead are really over-powered in this particular setup, but their secret power is minimal, so I think it'll work out to be fair.
I'm especially interested to see how the Town deals with the doubles in most of the roles. In case anyone wonders, the "Three is the Charm" refers to the Alpha Wolf becoming the third of a role.
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Post by Pleonast on Aug 31, 2009 11:25:22 GMT -5
I'm also curious to see what happens with the rules saying there may be recruitment. There isn't any, but I put the option in there to reduce the effectiveness of the two Witchdoctors.
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Post by Renata on Aug 31, 2009 16:59:48 GMT -5
I think I will spy on the Cabalists and try to forget the rest of the roles where I can (not that I'll succeed). It's an interesting group of players, and what I would have put as my top choice if I had seen this on time. (Can't resist Day *and* Night secret talk!)
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 1, 2009 19:25:22 GMT -5
It's amusing what some players will lock onto. Over in the Wolves, Meeko is wondering why I blocked out the Days and Nights onto dates out as far as I did. Of course, I had no intent, it's simply where I decided to stop. And in the Witches, peekercpa is wondering what the meaning of the official player order is. He notes it's neither sign-up or alphabetical order. I guess I'm amazed he doesn't even consider the possibility of random. Which it is.
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Post by Renata on Sept 2, 2009 18:44:26 GMT -5
Heh. Speaking of the witches, though, the link doesn't appear to work.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 2, 2009 18:54:02 GMT -5
Heh. Speaking of the witches, though, the link doesn't appear to work. Yeah, it's got an extra "slash" in it.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 3, 2009 10:38:58 GMT -5
Is this the first time a Day One spat has actually been scum-on-scum?
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 3, 2009 12:23:50 GMT -5
Is this the first time a Day One spat has actually been scum-on-scum? AFAIK, yes and no. There have been cases where scum attacked each other for cred, but I don't think I've seen quite the vitriol level that I see between Ed and Meeko. But then again, I'm a relative newcomer to the Mafia scene (Batman was my first game), so there might have been something before that. It'll be really interesting if Meeko gets vigged tonight, though.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 3, 2009 13:08:11 GMT -5
The Wolves will be in serious trouble if the Alpha Wolf gets killed off quick. They really need his secret power to have a chance. There's a lot of swing in how well they'll do.
But we still have 5 more days of Day One. Things can still go any which way, though the Labor holiday may damper that.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 3, 2009 15:53:55 GMT -5
That's their power, but this game has always involved players having an extra treat in their bag when they open up their role pm. In the first Conspiracy, I was a Witch who could also do an extra protection. I forget what my extra role was in C2. My role in this game also has an extra power not included in the role description. Doesn't yours? This is a huge slip. Each faction gets only one secret power in this game (Conspiracy 2 also). So anyone admitting to have a secret power is either a special Townie or scum. The Townies who actually have a secret power will know Boozy is not Town. The Wolves will know he's not of them and the Vamps will know he's not Undead--big target on him now.
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Post by Renata on Sept 3, 2009 17:56:43 GMT -5
Yeah, I agree, but I also don't really understand the response. Why did Nanook argue that the Town secret power must be commonly held, hence Boozy can't be Town? Town can't do anything "as one"; how could they have a common power? It has to be individual, doesn't it?
Off to check who Nanook is ...
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Post by Renata on Sept 3, 2009 17:58:33 GMT -5
He's Town -- now I really don't get it. Assuming the power lies with the witches or hypothetical freemasons, perhaps, but it still doesn't make sense as an accusation.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 3, 2009 18:44:44 GMT -5
Yeah, I don't understand where Nanook is coming from. In C2, the Town secret power was held by one player--the Scotsman. I expect he'll get some heat if someone actually double-checks it.
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Post by Renata on Sept 3, 2009 19:08:03 GMT -5
What it may well get him is dead, if the wolves decide it's the slip of a witch or mason with a held-in-common secret power.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 3, 2009 20:49:48 GMT -5
What it may well get him is dead, if the wolves decide it's the slip of a witch or mason with a held-in-common secret power. Better a vig than a witch. We must remember that we have a lot of anti-Town elements who would just love us to waste our Day without getting any useful information I don't think anyone is forgetting that. That's why they're voting for you.Nomination for best *Zing* post of the game.
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Post by Renata on Sept 4, 2009 8:28:06 GMT -5
Good point; I keep forgetting that there are no vanillas in this game.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 4, 2009 9:48:44 GMT -5
I'm trying to decide whether or not it's in the Town's best interest to lynch a claimed Cabalist. Without knowledge about the existence of the Witches, it's risky to let Cabal live. But their threat to the Town is slight compared to the Wolves and Undead. And both Wolves and Undead must be killed before the Cabal can win, so they're not close at the moment. Overall, I think it's probably better to let the claimed Cabalist live a few Days.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 4, 2009 10:47:00 GMT -5
I'm trying to decide whether or not it's in the Town's best interest to lynch a claimed Cabalist. Without knowledge about the existence of the Witches, it's risky to let Cabal live. But their threat to the Town is slight compared to the Wolves and Undead. And both Wolves and Undead must be killed before the Cabal can win, so they're not close at the moment. Overall, I think it's probably better to let the claimed Cabalist live a few Days. If I were town, I would probably let him live. Why? First of all, town is not typically going to claim scum. So you now have an exposed scum. That is important information. And odds are that the claim is truthful, so you have a reasonable belief that you have an exposed scum who is the least likely faction to hurt you. (A wolf or undead would be more apt to claim town. Especially since if either claims cabal, the cabal can out them at their leisure. It's a very risky gambit for a wolf/undead to pull. Particularly an undead.) So what does the lynch get you? Nothing but confirmation of what you already suspect, and removal of a role that isn't an immediate danger to you. (Granted, the fact that there are secret powers mitigates this somewhat.) Now, if you lynch someone else, you will get more information, and the earlier town gets information, the better. Plus, you have other factions that would love to take out a cabalist. Also, if all else fails, an exposed cabalist screams "Vig me!". You don't know if you have a vig, but you might. Of course, cabalist should be the last vig target, because cabal can be entirely alive and Town can still win. Add it all up, and for town to leave the cabalist alive is a risk I would take. It's only Day 1 after all. But apparently no one in town agrees with me. Stop thinking in the short term people. I mean PCM: Regarding boozy His win condition is exclusive to towns wincon, we win or he (Cabal as he claimed) does, not both and there are no second places. So yes he does rather have a head on conflict with us. So his claim to stay alive just lets him and his team potentially steal a win later. WTF? Steal the win later? It's day freakin' one! What's the rush? And of course his claim lets him potentially steal the win later. But big deal. You have an exposed scum in your pocket. You don't need to take him out. How many times has town let less dangerous 3rd parties live because they have bigger fish to fry. This is really no different. Wolves and Undead can kill you. It's in the rules. Cabal might have a secret ability to kill you, but not at the level the other two factions do (i.e. it's limited number of times, otherwise, the game would be Gastard since cabal would be overpowered). And even if they can, it's unlikely killing Boozy is going to stop that anyway. And right now, with no witches exposed, they have no reason to use it. And it seems CIAS gets a bit of this, but I'm surprised he's not pushing it harder. Town lynching Boozy, is, IMO, a bad move. It's not a horrible move, but it's bad. It does little to help them, and it helps Wolves and Undead, both of whom need cabal dead no matter what, a lot. And stop thinking of it in terms of "what town gets out of it by leaving boozy alive". That's type of thinking only works in a predominantly two faction game. You have to think more along the lines of "What do the other factions lose by us leaving boozy alive?" The answer is: a significant amount.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 4, 2009 10:48:23 GMT -5
In fact, the Town can hold the Cabalist hostage--when the first Witch dies by any means, the Cabalist gets lynched.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 4, 2009 13:48:26 GMT -5
In fact, the Town can hold the Cabalist hostage--when the first Witch dies by any means, the Cabalist gets lynched. Interesting. But I don't think too effective. The cabal will try to get the witches killed no matter what, and will happily sacrifice one of their own to do so. Plus, it might make the undead/wolves try to ignore the cabal and seek out town to kill, knowing that if they find a witch (who are a danger to everybody), they will get two enemies with one stone.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 4, 2009 14:37:14 GMT -5
Well, I'm redirecting storyteller's actions onto CatInASuit... because, why not? It'd be much more effective the other way.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 4, 2009 14:51:47 GMT -5
Actually, it doesn't matter either way. Using the redirect power in the Day only redirects Day powers. The main use of the power in this case is Witch detection.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 5, 2009 10:18:49 GMT -5
Actually, it doesn't matter either way. Using the redirect power in the Day only redirects Day powers. The main use of the power in this case is Witch detection. Gotcha. I thought there was some special thing where they could activate their power for that Night before Dusk.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 8, 2009 12:06:28 GMT -5
I keep hearing the underlined part. In my most recent FB game, it was from bufftabby. In my most recent Giraffe game it was from NAF. I keep hearing how I'm aggressive. I get that, but to say I'm more aggressive isn't true. I play aggressively because it causes people to react and through that, we can often find Scum. If nothing else, the way people react might give a clue to their alignment when I flip. I wish I could say that my aggressive play leads me to find more Scum, but that isn't true, but at least it leads to discussion and maybe someone can find scum in the shit that I stir up. I do try to keep my aggressiveness directed toward the game itself. I hope everyone I play with realizes that I have nothing but respect for everyone (even you, Meeko). I'm continually impressed with the level of intelligence displayed in these games. I may not agree with everything, but I'm still impressed. Those who know me better know I'm not an aggressive person by nature, but in the game, it seems to fit. Were trying to find people who are trying to kill us. We shouldn't sit around and wait for them to make mistakes, we should pressure them so that they do. That's what I'm trying to do. You may not agree with my tactics and gambits, but they really shouldn't appear to be an aberration. I've done it game after game. As to Meeko, you've yet to play with him. I agree my stance may have been overly aggressive, but if it gets his attention and gets him to think before posting ya'll should thank me. (and this isn't baiting him, there's no need to respond, Meeko, we both know how I feel about your play. we disagree on it's usefulness to Town,. There's really nothing more to discuss about it.) Special Ed's strategy is not too different from mine. Players need to be pushed. When under stress, scum can make mistakes. The way town reacts can be different than how scum reacts. I think aggressive play by townies, especially vanilla townies, generally helps the town.
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Post by Pleonast on Sept 8, 2009 12:20:38 GMT -5
I'm somewhat surprised that some players think multiple votes hinders the town. I think it helps the town significantly, although maybe less so in my multi-scum scenario. In a regular Mafia game, the town greatly outnumbers scum. Say it's 20 to 5. With single votes, town has a 15 vote lead. With multiple votes, lets say the average player has 3 votes, the town has a 45 vote lead. That's huge!
With a single vote, scum only have to get a town player to switch their single vote, since votes and unvotes are necessarily linked. With multiple votes, scum not only have to get the townie to vote for someone else, they have to get them to unvote the scum. That's much harder.
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Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 9, 2009 6:47:59 GMT -5
I find it amusing that Bufftabby wants the wolves to take out Parzival when Parzival is using his magician power on her. It'll be particulary amusing should bufftabby be chosen to perform the kill, and even more so should the detective investigate her after the fact.
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