|
Post by Renata on Sept 9, 2009 9:31:46 GMT -5
Heh. What *would* happen if bufftabby tries to kill Parzival, who's chosen bufftabby as his proxy? Bufftabby commits suicide?
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 9, 2009 9:40:37 GMT -5
Yep, a self kill.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 9, 2009 14:27:49 GMT -5
What is it with the Vamps in these games always targeting their Necromancers? ;D
(Well actually, I didn't follow Conspiracy 1, so maybe it didn't happen there.)
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 9, 2009 14:32:17 GMT -5
And on top of that, it's going to really suck for the undead if the Witches investigate Blockey.
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 9, 2009 17:32:51 GMT -5
It's looking like scum are going to be taking out scum ToNight. I'd like Town to not win one of these for once.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 9, 2009 21:11:02 GMT -5
Yuck. Scum are going to be hurting after tonight.
Two wolves dead with the secret power wasted by eating another wolf.
Cabal one man down from the lynch.
And Undead one necromancer down as well as another exposed to the witches.
And town gets away with no deaths so far. (Well, the other Vamp hasn't submitted, has he?)
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 10, 2009 11:24:59 GMT -5
The Cabal are actually helping the wolves by blocking Special Ed; he won't kill bufftabby and will save his special power. Except that one of the Vamps is killing him. Parzival's Magician power will be used up, and he won't even be able to finger his attacker, since the attacker will already be dead. But he might deduce that bufftabby is a Vampire, since she apparently survived the attack and the attacker ended up dead, exactly as if she were a Vamp. If the Town is unlucky, the Detective might investigate the Vigilante-kill. But they should figure out the problem will resolve itself when the victim is revealed. A Wolf result means the claimed Vig is unlikely to be a Wolf and the Detective result shows he isn't a Vampire.
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 10, 2009 14:36:32 GMT -5
Think any Townies will claim and give out info? Or will they shut up in the face of three Night kills? It'll be interesting to see where everyone goes. The lack of a Coroner means Day Two will be like a Day One.
|
|
|
Post by Renata on Sept 10, 2009 18:39:39 GMT -5
It's certainly quiet so far.
|
|
|
Post by Renata on Sept 10, 2009 18:40:20 GMT -5
Oh, you have to love FCOD's "Huh". Worlds of meaning concealed in that one little word.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 10, 2009 20:14:12 GMT -5
Yeah, it certainly will be quieter without Ed and Meeko - I wonder if they talked each other to death? I rescind my earlier nomination and nominate this one as best *Zing* post of the game.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 11, 2009 13:55:43 GMT -5
Generally, remorseful vigs kill themselves by being required to target themselves with their ability. Which would then be redirectable. Wow! I'm sorry but to whoever designed that game, I really hope they took that possibility under consideration when they balanced or they essentially created a Bastard situation. That has so much potential to be unbalancing. Honestly, anytime you put a vig in a game with a scum redirector you greatly increase the power of that redirector. Add any sort of mandatory kill on the vig and you pretty much have a game that becomes swingy. You have to boost town to make up for the possibility of scum getting multiple bonus kills, but if they never get the kills, you've hurt scum by overpowering town. It's really bad design, IMO. *Makes note to consider the future Bastard possibilities of such a setup.* *Also ponders a Bastard Conspiracy game. It'd be Epic.*
|
|
|
Post by Renata on Sept 11, 2009 14:27:40 GMT -5
The last several posts are really amusing from a PIS perspective.
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 11, 2009 15:15:42 GMT -5
Hoopy, I set up this game with the secret Cabal redirects and two Vigilantes very intentionally. A Vig only has try to kill themselves once in this game; if they fail, they're fine.
Nphase, I wonder if they are intentionally signaling there roles or if accidental. I thought Cookies made a good save of her information "slip", although it might not have been one. I think more useful to players in-game are the "not" slips like Idle's--displaying ignorance of a particular role.
|
|
|
Post by Renata on Sept 11, 2009 16:43:50 GMT -5
Parzival might well be, ditto Nanook. It's still amusing And yeah, it's really hard to tell with Cookies whether that was a slip, or if her head really was where she later claimed it to be. "not" slips are interesting, aren't they? Because they can be faked, yet few people ever do it.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 11, 2009 19:05:42 GMT -5
Hoopy, I set up this game with the secret Cabal redirects and two Vigilantes very intentionally. A Vig only has try to kill themselves once in this game; if they fail, they're fine. I understand, and because of the way you set it up (i.e. all redirects are one shots, multiple scum in play), it works (rather well, I must say). I was more commenting on how it would be horrible to have a remorseful vig have to try to kill himself each night after he kills a townie, and give standard Mafia a redirector who can target the vig each night. Unless the roleblocker is a around, or a doc guesses correctly, or the scum target a 3rd party, scum get a fee bonus kill each night. That is Gastard.
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 11, 2009 22:35:25 GMT -5
Ped has made an early soft claim. A little risky, but it allows the Town to focus its powers on preserving her. And since Undead could mean Vampire, there's a huge possible benefit to the Town to eliminate the Undead earlier rather than later. I'm a little disappointed though. I was hoping the two Necros would throw the Town through a loop, but they're the among the first to die. Oh, well, I can still hope that the Vigs target each other.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 12, 2009 11:04:15 GMT -5
Re: Kat's PM to you.
She feels bad now, just wait until she finds out she killed her own necromancer.
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 14, 2009 13:25:11 GMT -5
Re: Kat's PM to you. She feels bad now, just wait until she finds out she killed her own necromancer. It was very hard for me to not mention that. Vampires seem to have a hard time avoiding killing Necromancers in my games.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 14, 2009 19:39:56 GMT -5
So the Vicars become pretty much vanilla after toDay since both Necros should be out of comission come Dusk.
It'll be interesting to see how they play when they realize two necros are dead. If they've followed the previous games, they'll probably reasonably conclude that there wouldn't likely be more than two necros, so they'll realize that they can safely draw heat.
|
|
|
Post by Renata on Sept 15, 2009 10:26:52 GMT -5
Parzival just "claimed" about Ed. Fun, fun.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 15, 2009 12:18:25 GMT -5
That's weird: why would Parzival paint a target on his back when special ed is already dead? And since it's was just discussed, he could be a Vampire targeted by Wolf Ed or a Detective. Or, he could be the magician and is now essentially vanilla town. Granted, since Ed is dead, the question raised is "Is the information reveal worth the "kill me now" sign he has posted?" Personally, I think it is. Someone attempted to kill him, they might try again anyway. This way, when he's dead, and it's revealed he's a magician, people can figure out that Ed misfired.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 16, 2009 15:10:44 GMT -5
So why does everyone think that the block of a kill takes precedence over the magician's redirect of that kill? There is nothing in the rules that implies this, and either situation is a reasonable way of doing things. While blocks take precedence over the specific actions they target (i.e. had they blocked Parzival, Ed would have killed him), there is no reason to assume that the kill was necessarily blocked before the redirect. No one has suggested the truth: Parzival redirected a kill which was then blocked.
|
|
|
Post by Renata on Sept 16, 2009 15:28:58 GMT -5
I don't know, but the right explanation does feel counter-intuitive to me, too. It feels like a block of someone's actions ought to act at the source, so to speak, rather than at the target. Of course in this case, Town's misinterpretation stands to benefit them, eventually.
What if bufftabby had been the protected witch, though? Any cabal in that Parzival pileup toward the end? I think I remember Natlaw in there somewhere.
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 16, 2009 16:02:11 GMT -5
I think the players are not grokking the whole "simultaneous" resolution of actions. That means every action happens, unless logic prevents it.
It looks like the Cabal have figured it out, but it's in their interest to not mention it. Since all the players involved are not Cabal, better to let the Town and killing roles think there's some lying going on.
I expect some excitement and confusion when at Dawn it's revealed the first Night's kills were two Wolves and an Undead.
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 17, 2009 10:30:19 GMT -5
Wow, the Wolves are taking it on the chin. Looks like they'll lose another two ToNight. The Undead are reduced to just the Vampires so all those dead bodies are going to waste. At least the Detective will have a hard time tracking down the last wolf with all the clutter. And the three Witches means the Cabal is not doing so well.
The Town is doing really well. Maybe they'll freak out when SisterCoyote comes back to life.
|
|
|
Post by Renata on Sept 17, 2009 10:54:02 GMT -5
Oh man the poor wolves! What a horrific start.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 17, 2009 15:09:54 GMT -5
Oh man the poor wolves! What a horrific start. Yeah, I don't think I've ever felt so sorry for a team in Mafia as I do for those guys. (Well, maybe with the exception of Town in SSB after the game ended and I saw how screwed we really were by Dawn 3.) So a question. With the witchdoctor enchanting herself, which power comes into play upon her death? The open power or the secret power?
|
|
|
Post by Pleonast on Sept 17, 2009 15:30:01 GMT -5
So a question. With the witchdoctor enchanting herself, which power comes into play upon her death? The open power or the secret power? I could be really mean and say both. But my original intent is that the regular power is given priority, especially since she used it on herself. Now if another Witchdoctor enchanted her, I might have to rethink.
|
|
|
Post by Høøpy Frøød on Sept 17, 2009 21:42:21 GMT -5
So cat's going to take out a witch. That's going to hurt town a lot. Something tells me ped is unlikely to claim when he finds bufftabby dead. But the witches now have to protect ped or investigate. Personally, I'd investigate tomorrow Night. It's unlikely someone's going to target the witches intentionally until one of them is revealed as dead. But it'll be interesting to see how they play it from here on out.
Still, I think this going to come down to town or cabal. The other scum teams have gotten hit too hard, too early.
(And it'll be interesting to see if peeker actually gets resurrected by secret power. That would pretty much lock the game for town.)
|
|